The planes we truly need most.

[Debonair]

i'm a big fan for te P-61 too, but i think it's unique control surface arrangment would make a much more tough than normal job for te software doods.
also it is too good & would pwn every1 all te time even if a total n00b was 'flying' & the would have to change names from "aces high ii" to "black widows high, everone else pwnd in a smoking crater v1.4"

[Col. Flashman]

Originally posted by Yoshimbo
a japanese 110 that ki45 is, possibly more maneuverable too, as it was lighter i believe and not much slower either

ok i've heard of and flown (in various sims) the p-39D and p-39Q airocobra

but this is the first time i've heard of the "Kingcobra"

...elaborate




-Boss Yoshimbo

Bell P-63A "Kingcobra", 1942

A favorite with the Soviet Air Force, the P-63 was distinguished by and aft mounted engine that drove the propeller by a hollow 10 foot shaft through which a 37mm cannon could be fired.

P-63 began as improved P-39, redesigned around the new NACA laminar-flow wing, basic airfoil section used in P-51, and a new Continental engine intended to replace the Allison. Wings tested on thr3ee modified P- 39Ds resulting in a go-ahead for 2 prototype XP-63s ordered 27 Jun 41. Deliveries began Oct 43. Of 3,303 built, 2,421 went to USSR, 300 to Free French, and others were RP-63 "Flying Pinball Machines" target aircraft with heavy armor, fired at by gunners in training using frangible bullets; a light would flash on the aircraft when hit. Lacked range and altitude of contemporary fighters. Without ballast in the nose, or comparable weight of ammunition for cannon, center of gravity went too far aft and made handling difficult.


Bell P-63F Kingcobra


http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?aircraft_genericsearch=Bell%20P-63%20Kingcobra&distinct_entry=true

[Debonair]

OMFG that thing is [SIZE=9]huge[/SIZE]!!!!11 kewl

[Panzzer]

Only a handful of Kingcobras joined VVS regiments in the European theatre during WWII. However, the Airacobras were much used (and liked) by the Soviets, and were in use from 1942 to 1945 (and even post-war). See Geust & Petrov: Red Stars vol. 4 (Lend-Lease Aircraft in Russia), ISBN 952-5026-23-X.

[Warspawn]

The P-63 was a fast airplane - its performance approaching that of the P-51 - but since the P-51 and P-47 were in full production, about 2,400 of the 3,303 P-63s produced were sent to the Soviet Union under the Lend-Lease act.  France used some in Indo-China after the end of World War II.

The P-63D was the "hottest" Cobra yet to appear, with a maximum speed of 437 mph at 30,000 feet. Although the P-63D had a good performance, it was no better than the North American P-51D Mustang which was already in service.

Specification of Bell P-63D Kingcobra:

Powerplant: One Allison V-1710-109 (E22) water-cooled engine rated at 1425 hp for take off.

Performance: Maximum speed was 437 mph at 30,000 feet, service ceiling was 39,000 feet, and an altitude of 28,000 feet could be reached in 11.2 minutes. Normal range was 950 miles, and maximum ferry range was 2000 miles.

 Dimensions: wingspan 39 feet 2 inches, length 32 feet 8 inches, height 11 feet 2 inches, and wing area 255 square feet. Weights: 7076 pounds empty, 8740 pounds gross, and 11,100 pounds maximum loaded.

Armament: One 37-mm M9E1 cannon in the propeller hub with 48 rounds, a pair of 0.50-inch machine guns in the forward fuselage synchronized to fire through the propeller arc, plus a single 0.50-inch machine gun in each of two underwing gondolas

[cobia38]

vader....... gimee a vader......please.......

[Benny Moore]

Originally posted by Debonair
also it is too good & would pwn every1 all te time even if a total n00b was 'flying' & the would have to change names from "aces high ii" to "black widows high, everone else pwnd in a smoking crater v1.4"

No, the aircraft had several flaws as a fighter, which is one of the reasons it was not used as a normal fighter.  First, it lacked performance; the speed was more reminiscent of a P-40 or P-39 than a P-38 or P-51.  Then, too, the roll rate was "nothing to write home about," in the words of one Black Widow pilot.  In other words, it rolled like a swamped barge.  That was the reason for the spoilerons; draggy and inefficient, their presence on the P-61 was a desperate attempt to improve the roll rate.  And do not forget that the rotating turret caused turbulence problems, especially on the early models.  Lastly, you almost can't miss the thing when shooting at it.  I fly P-38 in the simulator and it's hard enough dodging a shot in that.  I can't imagine flying something the size of a B-25.

[Debonair]

you can find something bad to say about almost every combat plane, but The Black Widow's undefeated combat record IMHO contradicts it's detractors

[Karnak]

Originally posted by Debonair
you can find something bad to say about almost every combat plane, but The Black Widow's undefeated combat record IMHO contradicts it's detractors

Not really. It came too late and saw too light of use to get a really good read on it.

It is a very neat aircraft, and a good one, but I don't think it is nearly as good as it's proponents like to make it out to be.  It certainly wasn't the best nightfighter of the war.

[Widewing]

Originally posted by Benny Moore
No, the aircraft had several flaws as a fighter, which is one of the reasons it was not used as a normal fighter.  First, it lacked performance; the speed was more reminiscent of a P-40 or P-39 than a P-38 or P-51.  Then, too, the roll rate was "nothing to write home about," in the words of one Black Widow pilot.  In other words, it rolled like a swamped barge.  That was the reason for the spoilerons; draggy and inefficient, their presence on the P-61 was a desperate attempt to improve the roll rate.  And do not forget that the rotating turret caused turbulence problems, especially on the early models.  Lastly, you almost can't miss the thing when shooting at it.  I fly P-38 in the simulator and it's hard enough dodging a shot in that.  I can't imagine flying something the size of a B-25.

It was a night fighter Benny, not a day fighter. It was fast enough and later models were very fast. Roll rate was ok for its size, managing 50 degrees/sec at 350 mph. It could turn circles around any late-war day fighter in US service. More importantly, it was very well armed and was used for interdiction attacks on enemy ground targets, day and night. Their air to air record didn't generate huge kill totals, but it no P-61 was lost to enemy aircraft in combat.

In the MA it could do anything the A-20G can do and do it much better.

My regards,

Widewing

[CPW]

G.55/O
G.55/I
G.55/S
G.56
G.55A

I truly want to fly a beautiful big fighter which similar to 109 but stronger and got 3* MG151/20. Especially each MG151/20 have 250RD!!!

[Knegel]

So you look for the 109G with gunpods?? But we already have that!!!

The C.205 at least only had two cannons and it was to heavy for the used engine(similar like the gunpod armned 109G´s).

[B3YT]

i'd like to see the beufighter or as the japanese called it "whispering death"
a good torp bomber 4 20mm in nose . inbuilt radar . carried 10 rockets internal bombbay too.  bomb racks on wing . quick too

[CPW]

109G with gunpad is not good to fly.

And the nosegun just 150RD, each gunpad only 120.

Besides, the whole new design G.55 with DB605 is better than 109G.

I think many people ever looked at this text.

"In December 1942 a technical commission of the Regia Aeronautica was invited by Luftwaffe to test some German aircrafts in Rechlin. The visit was part of a joint plan for the standardization of the Axis aircraft production. In the same time some Luftwaffe officers visited Guidonia where they were particularly interested in the performances promised by the Serie 5's. On December 9 these impressions were discussed in a Luftwaffe staff meeting and rised the interest of Goering itself.

In February 1943 a German test commission was sent in Italy to evaluate the new Italian fighters. The commission was led by Oberst Petersen and was formed by Luftwaffe officiers and pilots nad by technical personnel, among them the Flugbaumeister Malz. The Germans carried with them also several aircrafts included a Fw190A and a Me109G for direct comparison tests in simulated dogfights.

The tests began February 20. The German commission, not without a certain surprise, was very impressed by the Italian aircrafts, the G55 in particular. In general, all the Serie 5's were very good at low altitudes, but the G55 was competitive with its German opponents also in term of speed and climb rate at high altitudes still maintaining superior handling characteristics. The definitive evaluation by the German commission was "excellent" for the G55, "good" for the Re2005 and "average" for the MC205. Oberst Petersen defined G.55 "the best fighter in the Axis" and immediately telegraphed his impressions to Goering. After listening the recommendations of Petersen, Milch and Galland, a meeting held by Goering on February 22 voted to produce the G55 in Germany.

The interest of the Germans, apart from the good test results, derived also from the development possibilities they was able to see in the G55 and in the Re2005. For the Re2005 the German interest resulted in the provision of an original DB605 with the new WM injection. This engine and a VDM propeller were installed on the MM495 prototype that was acquired by Luftwaffe and tested in Rechlin. The aircraft reached 700 km/h during a test with a German pilot, but the airframe was not judged sufficiently strong for these performances.

The G55 was bigger and heavier and was considered a very good candidate for the new DB603 engine. Other visits were organized in Germany during March and May 1943 in Rechlin and Berlin. The G55 was again tested at Rechlin at the presence of Milch. Gabrielli and other FIAT personalities were invited to visit German factories and to discuss the evolution of the aircraft. The specifications of the German G55/II included the DB603 engine, five 20 mm guns and a pressurized cockpit. The suggestion of weapons in the wings, limited to one 20 mm gun for each wing, originated the final configuration of the Serie I, while the 603 engine was succesfully installed in the G56 prototypes.

As a concrete results of the German interest in the G55, the Luftwaffe acquired three complete G55 Sottoserie 0 airframes (MM91064-65-66) for evaluations and experiments giving in change three DB603 engines and original machinery for the setup of other production lines of the DB605/RA1050 RC58 I. Two of the Luftwaffe G55's remained in Turin, at the Aeritalia plants, where they were used by German and Italian engineers to study the planned modifications and the possible optimizations to the production process. Later these two were converted to Serie I and delivered to the ANR. The third one was transferred to Rechlin for tests and experiments in Germany. The DB603 engines were used to build the G56 prototypes.

The interest in the G55 program was still high after the Armistice: in October 1943 Kurt Tank, who previously personally tested a G55 in Rechlin, was in Turin to discuss about the G55 production. However, war events and the not yet optimized production process were the reasons for which the G55 program was eventually abandoned by the Luftwaffe. Early produced G55's required about 15000 manhours; while there were estimations to reduce the effort to about 9000 manhours, the German factories were able to assemble a Bf109 in only 5000 manhours".

Giving the best axis fighter a chance!!!

[Widewing]

Within Aces High, the 109G-2 utterly owns the C.205 in head to head flying. There's no reason to expect the G.55 to offer any marked improvement over the C.205 in terms of performance.

Inasmuch as G.55 a generally insigificant aircraft in terms of its impact on the war, most players would rather see HTC expend their limited resources on more important types not yet represented in the game.

My regards,

Widewing