How can the U.S. maintain a technological edge?

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by soda72
Between federal Pell Grants and student loan deferments anyone from a low income house hold can go to school if they want too...

If your goal is to have more students taking science type courses, it would be better to create incentives like awarding more federal pell grants to students wanting to take theses type courses.    

But regardless of whether or not we have more students taking science courses if there are no jobs for them what good will it do?

There are plenty of jobs in this country. Here in N. Florida we have 3% unemployment. If there is no job where you are you have 2 choices, move or elect people who will bring and keep jobs into where you live.

[Chairboy]

Originally posted by Jackal1
4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.

Well, I was being civil, I see you've decided to follow a different path.

You said, and I quote:

Another good starting point would be to put teachers in place in public schools who actualy wish to teach something useful instead of using it as a platform for their personal agenda.

What agenda?  Which teachers specifically?  What change would you make?  How would you filter the people who meet your undefined criteria?  How do you determine who wants to teach versus who wants a platform?

I invite you to try again.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by BluKitty
The sad but true thing is the thief's in the U.S. goverment don't even realize that education has a great return of investment.   (rollseyes)

I guess they just want their pork now, always now.

We need to offer full tuition for undergrads.  Not too likely to happen anytime soon though.

The whole education funding argument is smoke and mirrors. We spend an enormous amount of money on primary and secondary education and we get very little for it. Per student we spend a lot more than other countries. NYC itself spends close to $10K/student/year ($11,172 for 2003-2004). The problem is a lot of that money goes to ancillary expenditures. (in the case of NYC 40% goes to non-classroom instruction costs)

Same is true of higher education. College budgets are bloated and the cost of tuition only keeps rising with little benefit to the student.

We could educate high school graduates with the equivalent of the 2 year college degree if we only had the will to do it. It takes more will and effort than money but the education establishment doesn't want that because it would upset their gravy train.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by Rolex

I don't think the US is 'threatened' by the education of others. I know that wasn't said here, but there are people who promote that image. Not everyone is university caliber. US public school does a poor job of preparing high school graduates without university potential to do anything.

Right on the mark Rolex. We do a very poor job preparing those who will not, through economics or personal choice, go to college. There are plenty of jobs that really do not require a college degree but it is required by corporations only because of the poor education that high school students get in basic English & math skills. Colleges are spending lots of money remedializing entering freshmen in these skills they should have been taught in High School.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by lazs2
I value education...  I don't think many teachers do tho.  I think most teachers... and the teachers union in general.... think that what they want is all that matters.

lazs

The teachers unions could care a whit about your child's education. There are good and dedicated teachers out there but the union in general only cares about itself and it's political agenda. They will use your children to advance that agenda.

I spent the 1st 1/3 of my technology career dealing with the education community and I had ample opportunity to work with teachers, administrators, School Board members and union representatives both local and national. Most of them are arrogant elitists who believe they are smarter than everyone else.

The highest paid teachers, the lowest drop out rates and the highest test scores in the US are all in non-union school systems.

[Clifra Jones]

Originally posted by Chairboy
Well, I was being civil, I see you've decided to follow a different path.

You said, and I quote:What agenda?  Which teachers specifically?  What change would you make?  How would you filter the people who meet your undefined criteria?  How do you determine who wants to teach versus who wants a platform?

I invite you to try again.

It's pretty easy to find the agenda Chairboy. One need only to look. Actually one need only to have a conversation with your average educator to see where their political agenda lies. One need only look at the political contributions and activism of the NEA.

When my daughter was in high school I went to parents day and met her teachers. 2 of the 6 I considered educated and professional, the other 4 I would not have hired to walk my dog.

It is time to make performance a factor in teachers salary and retention, not tenure.

[FUNKED1]

I blaem teh librules.

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Chairboy
Well, I was being civil, I see you've decided to follow a different path.

You said, and I quote:What agenda?  Which teachers specifically?  What change would you make?  How would you filter the people who meet your undefined criteria?  How do you determine who wants to teach versus who wants a platform?

I invite you to try again.

OK........................... ........

Another good starting point would be to put teachers in place in public schools who actualy wish to teach something useful instead of using it as a platform for their personal agenda.

Any clearer this time?

[Chairboy]

Originally posted by Jackal1
Any clearer this time?

I admire the persistance you employ in just repasting your original message over and over.  If you are incapable of communicating effectively, then, well, at least you have the persistance.

You still haven't described what the agendas are, how you would make it happen, and so on.  Can I expect another repaste?  Or are you able to answer the questions?  I look forward to your reply.

[DREDIOCK]

Import more Japaneese

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Chairboy
I admire the persistance you employ in just repasting your original message over and over.  If you are incapable of communicating effectively, then, well, at least you have the persistance.

If you are incapable of comprehending what I said, I`m sorry but I can`t help you. Don`t see anyone else having much of a problem with it. It`s about as clear as it gets. Straight forward and to the point.
I`m soooo sorry you find it so perplexing. Please do not let it interfere with your day to day life.............or your professional one.

You still haven't described what the agendas are, how you would make it happen, and so on.  Can I expect another repaste?  Or are you able to answer the questions?  I look forward to your reply.

I feel , at this point, another trip around the block would not open your eyes to the scenery.
I would like to suggest that you do your best just to carry on.
Please accept my profound apologies for causing you such confusion and turmoil.

[Debonair]

i smell smoke, the kind that you sometimes smell just before a
FLAME WAR!!!
zOMGOMGOMGOMG u n00bs r all teh sux!!!!!1
i m teh flame war beserxor!!!!! rofllololol:furious

[bj229r]

Originally posted by FUNKED1
Clearly, we need to take all our money and our young people, and...
send them to foreign countries.
Also, let's piss away billions flying a 30 year old deathtrap spacecraft.  
That's my plan!  
Back on topic, nothing will happen unless our society starts to value education instead of focusing on issues like gay marriage, Lacey Peterson, Mt. Soledad, presidential hummers, war on drugs, war on immigration, etc.

I think too large a % of US kids are so squealing stupid at the time they graduate high school, they will never catch up, and the best they can hit is community college...or maybe a degree in education:rofl

[FUNKED1]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Import more Japaneese

Indeed, it wouldn't hurt to have more immigrants from cultures that place more value on education than Americans.

[Chairboy]

Originally posted by Debonair
i smell smoke, the kind that you sometimes smell just before a
FLAME WAR!!!
zOMGOMGOMGOMG u n00bs r all teh sux!!!!!1
i m teh flame war beserxor!!!!! rofllololol:furious

Nah, I was honestly curious about what Jackal1 was talking about, but I guess he didn't know either.  Not worth any sort of flame war, not by far.