Grizzly Man

[Holden McGroin]

Originally posted by FiLtH
Maybe he should have chosen something like wild hare or something to befriend.

Bad idea... I saw a few documentaries where several were actually killed by hares or rabbits.



and of course,

[FiLtH]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
It's rather annoying how many people are commenting on both situations when they really know nothing about either.  

Similarly, both entertainers died from a Rogue Animal.  There is no reason why the stingray attacked Steve Irwin.  There is no reason why that grizzly bear attacked Treadwell.  While both people could have been labeled as kooks, they both lived good lives showing people what else those predators can be.  

The distinction is that neither were killed by animals that were in the norm.  Irwin was attacked by a stingray that had no reason or purpose in attacking him.  Treadwell was attacked by an outcast grizzly bear that had no reason or purpose in attacking him.  However, in both cases, what the animal did was unexpected and different.

     You see..thats why they are called animals. It doesnt take a qualified wildlife scientist to tell me bears, and many other wild animals are dangerous to humans...largely because of that unpredictability. The guy play with bears...and his luck ran out.

[lasersailor184]

These posters are trying to make a distinction between Irwin and Treadwell when there is none.  While both might have been thought of as crazy to some people, they had interesting mannerisms that played well into the animals they were around.

But, as most people here have made evident as they have not seen the movie, Treadwell was attacked by a bear that was not from his region, nor from any region nearby.  He was literally attacked by a "Crazy" bear if we can attach human mannerisms to animals.  There was no reason for that bear to be near Treadwell, no reason for the bear to be in that region, no reason for the bear to attack him...

It was more of a freak accident that could have happened to anyone of us then something that was inevitable.

[detch01]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
IThere is no reason why the stingray attacked Steve Irwin.  There is no reason why that grizzly bear attacked Treadwell.  

From what I heard Irwin and his camera man had the ray boxed in. It reacted in a natural way - not necessarily predictable but definitely within its range of behaviours especially when its stressed. It was Irwin's bad luck to cozy up to a ray that didn't react as he expected. Given the stunts he regularly pulled for his show it shouldn't have come as a surprise to anyone that he stood a good chance of getting killed by a wild animal of some sort eventually.
Treadwell? The man was an idiot. His behaviour was utterly and completely irrational. Although he managed to get away with living in his fantasy world with his big loveable teddy-bears for awhile but it couldn't last forever. Bears are omnivores. If food is plentiful and the competition for the available food isn't extreme then yeah, you're more than likely going to survive an encounter with a grizzly as long as you stay calm and it's not of a mind to kill you for any number of other  reasons (surprising a bear falls under "any number of other reasons", as does the bad luck of running into a big bear in a bad mood). If food gets scarce or the competition gets extreme and you're in the vicinity, well then, you're on the menu.
Trying to convince people that predators have a warm, soft cuddly side is assinine and dangerous - dangerous for the animal and for any people it is unlucky enough to encounter later.  Treadwell was an idiot living in a fantasy world, but that wasn't his crime. His crime was talking someone else into it and getting them killed.
Irwin made a habit of pushing his luck with dangerous critters and it caught up to him. A little less arrogance on his part in the face of potentially lethal critters would likely have seen him still alive - oh well.


asw

[Holden McGroin]

From my vast experience watching 'Grizzly man', it seemed to me Treadwell was seriously disturbed.  Not for the walking around in the presence of bears, but for the camera takes of a man screaming at the world, and then shake that emotion off and immediately give a sedate description of the situation.  He seemed to have no sense of humor, and capable of wild swings of emotion.

Irwin stayed consistant in his entusiasm for the natural world.

Treadwell stayed beyond the time when he normally left for the winter, beyond the time when the bears he knew were down for the winter.

He did something his experience told him not to do, and he payed for it.

Irwin did something that thousands of snorklers do.  Nothing out of the ordinary.  Akin to crossing the street and being hit by a bus:  A freak accident. Had the spine hit him a few inched off, a short hospital stay.

[Dinger]

Yeah, but bringing up Grizzly Man is useful exactly for that. Plenty of people want to say Steve Irwin was killed because of his insanity around wild animals. You know, "I called it, saw that crazy fool getting his ribs cracked by a huge female croc, and I knew his insanity would cost him his life". That's also why the story has "Traction" in the news industry.

The guy wasn't insane. Treadwell was insane (or, some would say, stupid). He got so wrapped up with his bears that, at the end, with an invalid air ticket home, he couldn't deal with what he called "the human world", and rather than sort out his trip, he went back; all his "Friends" had hibernated, and he was left with the other desperate outcasts.
It makes a great story -- a man whose obsessive insanity drives him from civilization and to his ruin; it's also pretty much the plot line of every Werner Herzog film ever made. But this one is the best.

[Shuckins]

A bear attack shouldn't have been unexpected.  Nor are they outside the pale of human experience.  Grizzlies attack people every year.  And not all of those attacks are carried out by "rogue" animals or animals that are old and incapable of finding other food.

The wild is not as it has been portrayed by Disney.

If you want a no-nonsense, non-starry-eyed look at what happened to Treadwell, take the time to read the information at this site:

http://www.yellowstone-bearman.com/Tim_Treadwell.html

[eagl]

When I first heard about Treadwell, I immediately thought "well of COURSE he got eaten... Duh!".  When I heard about Irwin's death, I thought "Damn I guess he got too close."  There is a huge difference.

If Irwin had gotten himself eaten by a croc while messing around in a croc pen in his spare time, then yea I'd say the situations were pretty similiar.  But comparing a guy who made it his life's calling hanging out with one of the world's most successful and aggressive predators, and a guy who got killed swimming around one of the world's most passive critters that just happens to be rather well armed for self defense, does not make any kind of common sense.

It's sort of like comparing the death of an airshow performer with the death of a private pilot who biffs into a hill trying to fly under a bridge to impress his girlfriend.  One guy is taking a methodical approach to a dangerous business in order to perform acts requiring a high degree of skill, and the other guy is just being a tard.  Guess what...  Swimming near a stingray, even as close as Irwin had to have been to get stabbed, is nowhere near as stupidly dangerous as hanging out with grizzly bears on a routine basis.

You can find thousands of divers who have had wonderful experiences up close and personal with stingrays, but I challenge you to find ONE alaskan outdoorsman who has anything good to say about going unarmed close enough to a grizzly for it to eat you and your girlfriend.

I'm with Yeager on this one...  Comparing these two people is an insult to Irwin.

[SuperDud]

I think the bears just thought the guy was "special" and felt pity for him. Then one day, one realized he was just an idiot who tried to pet and become 1 with 1000lb predators and it ate him.

Steve on the other hand knew those 1 ton crocs were dangerous and although he took risk he didn't really try to gain thier "acceptance". He got the heck outta dodge when 1 was coming, not try to talk to it.

[Mini D]

Irwin went for the flash of dangerous animals. It cost him his life. Anyone remember what the name of the film he was making?

I know parents who would not let their kids watch him because he was an idiot. It doesn't matter if it's for the camera or because of insanity... it doesn't really matter. Both were promoting irrational behavior with dangerous animals. I feel about as much pity for him as I'd feel for a lion tamer that gets attacked. Any time someone tries to present themselves as above the rules of nature, nature has a nasty way of proving them wrong.

[Neubob]

Originally posted by lasersailor184
It's rather annoying how many people are commenting on both situations when they really know nothing about either.  

Nothing about them, not their tactics, nor their knowhow, nor their approaches to their work, nor their effects on the animals, nor their personalities, were the same. So with all due respect, if you If you think they had more in common than not, I think it's you that doesn't know much about either.

The fact that they died from injuries inflicted by wild animals does nothing to level the playing field. Comparing Irwin to Treadwell is like comparing a trained chemist to an idiot who sticks a quarter stick into his mouth, lights the fuze and sees how long he can wait before spitting it out.

[Mini D]

You don't work with any "trained chemists", do you?

[deSelys]

Originally posted by Mini D
...Any time someone tries to present themselves as above the rules of nature, nature has a nasty way of proving them wrong.

According to your logic, you should only travel on foot.

[Suave]

"Panda Watch. The mood is tense; I have been on some serious, serious reports but nothing quite like this. I uh... Ching... King is inside right now. I tried to get an interview with him, but they said no, you can't do that he's a live bear, he will literally rip your face off. "

Brian Fantana

[Neubob]

Originally posted by Mini D
You don't work with any "trained chemists", do you?

It was an analogy.

Regardless, the point is valid. As crazy as Irwin seemed to be, his level of training and conditioning and control over the situations in which he placed himself were that much more advanced than that of Treadwell.

On a seperate note, Treadwell seemed to be more self-serving and self-indulgent than he was interested in the bears. His flights of emotion compeltely put him out of the realm of professionalism.