Author Topic: iran fighter (Read 2561 times)

Pei · « **Reply #45 on:** September 07, 2006, 01:38:37 AM »

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Originally posted by lukster

Wonder how they are measuring it's "power"? Thrust to weight? Payload? Avionics? My balsa wood r/c has a greater thrust to weight ratio than an F-18.

It has the power of Allah! Unfortunately that means it stops anything it's doing and points towards Mecca five times a day.

babek- · « **Reply #46 on:** September 07, 2006, 02:10:24 AM »

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Originally posted by Kurt
Not more than one or two of the Iranian F-14's remains operational today. They were sabotaged when the U.S. Contractors left Iran in 1979 and have had no access to replacement parts.

They are big pretty sun-shades today.

Wrong - check this book:
http://www.amazon.com/Iranian-F-14-Tomcat-Units-in-Combat-Combat-Aircraft/dp/1841767875/sr=8-2/qid=1157611961/ref=sr_1_2/002-5675283-2409642?ie=UTF8&s=books

The iranians managed very fast (motivated by the invasion attempt of Saddams arabs) to bring the F-14 back to work. Not all the 79 F-14´s, because many were used to deliver spare parts for the other planes in the first years of the war. Later the spare part problem was solved - so the number was growing.
During the 8 year Iran-Iraq war iranian F-14 shot down more than 150 iraqi planes and helicopters.
Read the book - it has some interesting details which may surprise you.

But again: They are useless in a war against US-airforce. Any IRIAF-plane would be - even if the IRIAF would have the same planes in the same technical shape like the US they still would have lesser training quality.

The important news of the iranian F-5 Saegeh plane is, that Iran managed to build a jet fighter in Iran. So they are learning more and more, which is good for the technical development. Even the new cars made in Iran look far better than the old designs

The same with the F-14. They simly look cool.
And the iranian war films are better than Top Gun, because they show real MiGs as enemy planes instead of black F-5´s.
Many of the obsolete iraqi planes which fled once to Iran were sent as a present to the iranian film industries.
"Attack on H5" is one of my favorite films - although in this film the heros were flying F4 Phantoms. But also F-14´s and F-5´s were shown in this film. On the iraqi side MiG-21 and Su-7 and Su-20 were shown.

mora · « **Reply #47 on:** September 07, 2006, 02:21:24 AM »

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Originally posted by Kurt
Not more than one or two of the Iranian F-14's remains operational today. They were sabotaged when the U.S. Contractors left Iran in 1979 and have had no access to replacement parts.

Yeah right..

You accuse them of seeking nuclear weapons, and yet you think that they can't reverse engineer some service parts for F-14?

babek- · « **Reply #48 on:** September 07, 2006, 03:39:56 AM »

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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Probably to lazy to pray to allah 7 times a day.

No - neither I am singing Halleyuyah and believe in the concept that the son of god is born by a virgin and that when I die I will sit on a whit cloud with wings and playing ancient music instruments nor am I wearing funny caps and hair-Styles and nodding like a spastican in front of a wall nor I am expecting to join a paradise filled with virgin-women.

It would be nice if I could believe in the concept of religions -(if so I must admit that I would prefer the virgin-women option rather than sitting all the day on a cloud and making music), but thats not the case.

So I changed my religious status to "atheist" when I turned 18.
And I was neither killed, whipped or punished by the iranian officials. I just had to pay the money for the changing of this in my papers.

And yes - I live most time of the year in Germany but also spend much time in Iran (2005 i spent 7 months in Germany, 3 in Iran and the other 2 in other countries like Spain, Egypt or Canada). Both - Iran and Germany - are great nations with a proud history and culture and I am happy to have both passports.

And no - I neither voted for Merkel or Ahmadinedjad in the elections.

Angus · « **Reply #49 on:** September 07, 2006, 04:25:44 AM »

What is with the Iranians these days?

Would have thought there was something better to do than arming up and nuking up.

Iraq has been elimited as a potent enemy, and Uncle Sam shows a habit of keeping other's fingers away from the nukes, so forgive me, but I think this Ahmadinedjad is just nuts.

babek- · « **Reply #50 on:** September 07, 2006, 04:45:25 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Angus
What is with the Iranians these days?

Would have thought there was something better to do than arming up and nuking up.

Iraq has been elimited as a potent enemy, and Uncle Sam shows a habit of keeping other's fingers away from the nukes, so forgive me, but I think this Ahmadinedjad is just nuts.

1. Yes - presidents who are deeply religious and think that they are doing good things for the world are really nuts.

2. Maybe the iranians have seen the following facts:

Afghanistan:
- no nukes
- bad bad terror regime
- attacked with UN-legitimation and with the announcement that democracy, freedom and human rights would come after the liberation.
- result: Civil war, 2000 dead civilians per month, world prime drug producer and no freedom for women who even wear the Burkha in Kabul.

Iraq:
- no nukes
- bad bad terror regime
- attacked without UN-legitimation, but with the announcement that democracy, freedom and human rights would come after the liberation.
- result: Civil war, 2000 dead civilians per month, Abu Ghraib and other human right installations and so on.

North-Korea
- nukes
- bad bad terror regime
- not attacked (maybe because of the nukes ?)

Now.... as the bad bad terror regime in Iran - what would be your cconclusion to avoid to be attacked?

Angus · « **Reply #51 on:** September 07, 2006, 04:48:13 AM »

Hehe maybe they should see this:
Iraq trying to get nukes = Iraq gets screwed

Recent example from the neighbourhood.

babek- · « **Reply #52 on:** September 07, 2006, 05:00:05 AM »

Yes - but Iran is not a small flat tabletop desert country with 15 million people who were enemies since Iraq was artificially created after WW1.

I would like to see the mullahregime kicked out of Iran.

But without a full invasion that will not happen. In contrary they will get stronger when Iran is attacked.

The same happened when the arabs attacked Iran while it was in the middle of inner political fightings after the Shah and his terrorregime were kicked out of Iran. When Saddam attacked all inner political fighting ended and the Khomeini regime had full power.

I fear that attacks against some installations will only help the mullahs to stay longer in power in Iran.

Angus · « **Reply #53 on:** September 07, 2006, 05:52:18 AM »

It's an old trick.
Make an enemy for the people to unite.
Or
Make an enemy that you can blame for everything.

Anyway, wasting all that energy for armory and nukes is just going to turn out bad.
Their grip might get stronger if Iran was to be attacked, and their grip would still remain somewhat if Iran would be routed.

My thought is that if this guy remains it's bound to happen. And as for the USA viewpoint, they rather want that nut cracked than armed with a nuke.

Just my cents...

Eagler · « **Reply #54 on:** September 07, 2006, 06:20:14 AM »

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Originally posted by babek-
I fear that attacks against some installations will only help the mullahs to stay longer in power in Iran.

that is only if we attack the installations first ...
the first wave of attacks should be on the heads of Iran without CNN fanfare .. but sadly it will not be ..

Sombra · « **Reply #55 on:** September 07, 2006, 06:28:54 AM »

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Originally posted by babek-

No - neither I am singing Halleyuyah and believe in the concept that the son of god is born by a virgin and that when I die I will sit on a whit cloud with wings and playing ancient music instruments nor am I wearing funny caps and hair-Styles and nodding like a spastican in front of a wall nor I am expecting to join a paradise filled with virgin-women.

It would be nice if I could believe in the concept of religions -(if so I must admit that I would prefer the virgin-women option rather than sitting all the day on a cloud and making music), but thats not the case.

So I changed my religious status to "atheist" when I turned 18.
And I was neither killed, whipped or punished by the iranian officials. I just had to pay the money for the changing of this in my papers.

And yes - I live most time of the year in Germany but also spend much time in Iran (2005 i spent 7 months in Germany, 3 in Iran and the other 2 in other countries like Spain, Egypt or Canada). Both - Iran and Germany - are great nations with a proud history and culture and I am happy to have both passports.

And no - I neither voted for Merkel or Ahmadinedjad in the elections.

Please could you tell me if this information is wrong, or how should I interpret it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy#In_Islam

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A person born of Muslim parents that rejects Islam is called a "murtad fitri" (natural apostate)

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Today apostasy is punishable by death in the countries of Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Yemen, Iran, Sudan, Afghanistan and Mauritania.

I'm just curious. Thx.

babek- · « **Reply #56 on:** September 07, 2006, 07:09:07 AM »

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Originally posted by Sombra
Please could you tell me if this information is wrong, or how should I interpret it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy#In_Islam

I'm just curious. Thx.

I can only tell you my personal story about this.

When I was born I was registered as shi.ite iranian moslem like my parents. That was during the Shah reign. My parents were no religious fanatics - although both were believing in Islam they decided that neither my brother nor I have to learn about religion. So both we havent visited religious schools or lessons or something like that. We should decide by ourself if we want to learn about religion or not.

When the revolution started in Iran I was 13. I am sure that there would have been great problems if I made my decison to put down my status as shi.ite moslem in the first years of the revolution then I would have got many problems - that was a really mad time - especially the first year.

But 5 years later I had only to pay some money to some officials and everything was OK. I was also not defined as a heretic and also have not got any problems when I am dealing with iranian officials like from the embassy if I am not in iran or the others when i am in iran.

My aunt switched from Islam to christianity. That caused more problems, but according to the iranian constitution there are 4 religions defined as the religion of believers:
Islam
Christianity
Judaism
Zoroastrism.

In Iran you get extreme problems if you are member of the Bahai religion.
But I havent seen that christians, jews or zoroastrians were hunted or threatened because of their religion. Or myself for putting down shi.ite islam.

Maybe this WIKI-topic about apostasy in Islam is more for sunnite islam.

As I mentioned I dont know much about religions - so I am not the specialist to ask about this - sorry

Angus · « **Reply #57 on:** September 07, 2006, 07:39:38 AM »

Politics and religion..always a problem...

Edbert1 · « **Reply #58 on:** September 07, 2006, 08:50:34 AM »

IIRC (I'm sure many here know the exact details)...

A pair of F22s went up against a group (12?) of F15s in a mock combat. Final score was 12 to 0. That was against some of the USAF's finest, no doubt whatsoever more capable than the best Iranian pilots, who, if they were trained by the US would have to be over 55 years old today.

Iranian Air Force's best bet with their new fighter should a conflict arise between them and the USAF/USN would be to run to Syria, kind of like Sadaam did with his air force in 1991, assuming they could get that far without flying over Iraq.

lukster · « **Reply #59 on:** September 07, 2006, 08:59:51 AM »

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Originally posted by babek-
In Iran you get extreme problems if you are member of the Bahai religion.
But I havent seen that christians, jews or zoroastrians were hunted or threatened because of their religion. Or myself for putting down shi.ite islam.

Maybe this WIKI-topic about apostasy in Islam is more for sunnite islam.

As I mentioned I dont know much about religions - so I am not the specialist to ask about this - sorry

According to this it appears that there is an active, but perhaps somewhat covert, effort to eliminate at least the christian faith.

http://www.jubileecampaign.co.uk/world/ira1.htm