P-38s and P-40E pilots, help please?

[Reynolds]

These are two planes I would like to learn. I use the P-40E a good deal already, but gave up on the 38 after my second day of AH. If anyone could give some practical education, I would be very thankfull.

[Major Biggles]

how about next time you find em online we go to the TA?

really, dogfighting tactics apply to all planes, you just need to learn how those planes react in those situations. search this forum for posts on energy management, which applies to both of those rides then try practising those maneuvers in those planes. give me a shout when you see me online

[Widewing]

Originally posted by Reynolds
These are two planes I would like to learn. I use the P-40E a good deal already, but gave up on the 38 after my second day of AH. If anyone could give some practical education, I would be very thankfull.

Well, my suggestion for the P-40s is not to fly them...  Worst low-speed handling in the game; vicious, wicked stall. Plus, the P-40B is at least 20 mph slower than it should be (it seems to be modeled on the heavier, higher drag Tomahawk IIb).

As to the P-38, there's many accomplished P-38 sticks who can teach you a lot. However, getting together with them is a matter of timing. If you come to the TA, look for Murdr or me, we can get you well on your way.

You can also send an e-mail to trainers@flyaceshigh.com and all trainers will see it.

My regards,

Widewing

[Oldman731]

Originally posted by Widewing
Well, my suggestion for the P-40s is not to fly them...  Worst low-speed handling in the game; vicious, wicked stall. Plus, the P-40B is at least 20 mph slower than it should be (it seems to be modeled on the heavier, higher drag Tomahawk IIb).

Hmmmm.  A chink in the Widewing's armor....

P40B is the worst plane in AH.  You are better off flying a Dauntless, a Boston III, an Il2....there are more.  It's an iron dog.  Occasionally they will run a contest to see who can get the most kills in the P40B in a month.  It's like pig night at the frat house.

On the other hand, the P-40E is a very nice ride, within its own family of planes.  P-40E v. 202 and P-40E v. Tony are some of the best fights the game has to offer.  See if you can find 1Duke1 some night and watch him slaughter in his Warhawk.  The key is using flaps (a lot) and never (or rarely) making a vertical-UP maneuver.  The guns are good, the turn with flaps is quite sufficient, using rudder a lot will help you keep it in the air at low speeds, just remember that you aren't a Spitfire and you can't go up a lot.  Work on your scissors maneuvers.

- oldman

[Widewing]

Originally posted by Oldman731
Hmmmm.  A chink in the Widewing's armor....

P40B is the worst plane in AH.  You are better off flying a Dauntless, a Boston III, an Il2....there are more.  It's an iron dog.  Occasionally they will run a contest to see who can get the most kills in the P40B in a month.  It's like pig night at the frat house.

On the other hand, the P-40E is a very nice ride, within its own family of planes.  P-40E v. 202 and P-40E v. Tony are some of the best fights the game has to offer.  See if you can find 1Duke1 some night and watch him slaughter in his Warhawk.  The key is using flaps (a lot) and never (or rarely) making a vertical-UP maneuver.  The guns are good, the turn with flaps is quite sufficient, using rudder a lot will help you keep it in the air at low speeds, just remember that you aren't a Spitfire and you can't go up a lot.  Work on your scissors maneuvers.

- oldman

I guess I'm basing my opinion on flying the P-40s in testing as well as in duels. Since the drag model was reworked, the P-40s have become even worse at or near stall. Likewise, I've found no other fighter that is as prone to spinning out of high angle of attack maneuvers as the P-40s. Now, that doesn't mean that you cannot have success in them. What you do have is a very limited list of options.

A lot of guys swear by the Ki-61. I generally swear at them. It is nearly as bad as the P-40 when pushed to its limits. Comparing either of these to the C.202 reveals the absolute superiority of the 202 in the vertical. It needs to be better in the vertical, because its low speed handling is also quite poor. All of the above depart with little warning and do so violently. Although, the P-40s are the worst of the lot in terms of the viciousness of the stall/spin/recovery cycle.  

Granted, many players will never push the P-40 to its limits as some of us do when preformance testing them. We fly it to the edge and stay there long enough to generate data. Then we push beyond the limits to catalog its behavior. The problem with the P-40s is the difference between the edge and hopelessly over the edge is razor fine. For that reason, I steer new players towards more forgiving rides.

My regards,

Widewing

[Reynolds]

Well oldman, I have luckily never been tainted by a spitfire, so im not worried. I have, however, been tainted by a 109s climb rate.

[Balsy]

Originally posted by Widewing
Well, my suggestion for the P-40s is not to fly them...  Worst low-speed handling in the game; vicious, wicked stall. Plus, the P-40B is at least 20 mph slower than it should be (it seems to be modeled on the heavier, higher drag Tomahawk IIb).

As to the P-38, there's many accomplished P-38 sticks who can teach you a lot. However, getting together with them is a matter of timing. If you come to the TA, look for Murdr or me, we can get you well on your way.

You can also send an e-mail to trainers@flyaceshigh.com and all trainers will see it.

My regards,

Widewing

I held the same opinion of the P40 for a long time as I found myself stalling and having difficulties with its erratic departure charactheristics.  Until I started flying in in the EW.  I found the P40E to be quite nimble, climbs well, and actually outturns most with flaps. It suprisingly has 1 click of flaps at near 300 mph.

The key to flying the P40 is to never use full deflection on the stick. I am used to flying the F6, f4u, and Jug11, all of which allow you can (with few exceptions)   apply full rudder, aileron, or elevator controls with little consequence.  If you limit your inputs (when flying slow especially) with the P40 to about 2/3 input it flys like a dream.

Balsy

[Major Biggles]

yeah widewing, i think you've been a little harsh to the baby, she can give me a wild ride every now and then

you really have to ride the stall, and it can be really nasty if you go over than thin line, but, they fly quite nicely i think. it's like the c202 in that way, difficult to fly if you aren't very experienced, but very rewarding if you are

[Nightshift82]

P-40's rock

[Reynolds]

Thanks veryone but... I kinda need some hands on training. Im looking for someone to go to the TA with me or something and sit down and actually SHOW me these things. Delerium has been a great help with the P-38, but I need someone to help with the P-40E.

[Widewing]

Originally posted by Major Biggles
yeah widewing, i think you've been a little harsh to the baby, she can give me a wild ride every now and then

you really have to ride the stall, and it can be really nasty if you go over than thin line, but, they fly quite nicely i think. it's like the c202 in that way, difficult to fly if you aren't very experienced, but very rewarding if you are

I fly the P-40 from time to time and enjoy it. It is, however, the spin king of AH2. Departure is vicious enough for me to warn noobs away from it and into something that is more forgiving.

I find the P-40E to be a sweetheart at 8/10th, but an increasingly evil lady beyond that.

Just for the heck of it, I tested the P-40E for turn radius and compared my data to that generated by Mosq. We had virtually identical numbers. So, I tried easing off and increasing speed about 5 mph, getting away from the limit where it was very unstable. I managed to lop off almost 30 feet (to 468.5 feet) from the turn radius and increase turn rate by nearly two degrees per second. Most aircraft can be flown to a point where you can still hang on to it, but the aircraft simply will not turn as well and you may think that you're actually doing better than you really are. Often, what is happening is that turn radius and rate being adversely impacted.

Actually finding that sweet spot takes time and most players will never get close to it without spending time exploring the limits offline. This was shown to good example when Batfink and I were playing around with F6Fs in the TA. Batfink was appalled at how tight the F6F can be turned IF you know where the sweet spot is. It took me nearly 45 minutes to arrive at the best result for the P-40E.

My regards,

Widewing

[Reynolds]

What exactly did you do for best turn radius?

And what does 'departure' mean?

[Widewing]

Originally posted by Reynolds
What exactly did you do for best turn radius?

And what does 'departure' mean?

In the inverse.. Departure: Departing controlled flight.

As to obtaining the best turning radius, it requires careful flying and accurate measuring.

Typically, you will fly a constant circle at a specific altitude. I use 500 feet. Timing is based upon a visual reference. I fly three consecutive timed circles. I usually do this several times and take the average.

My regards,

Widewing

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Reynolds
Well oldman, I have luckily never been tainted by a spitfire

LOL whatta joke.  Stop being a Lemming.

If you want tips in a P-38, just do a search of the BBS and you'll find plenty of posts with films and tips.  



ack-ack

[Reynolds]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
LOL whatta joke.  Stop being a Lemming.

If you want tips in a P-38, just do a search of the BBS and you'll find plenty of posts with films and tips.  



ack-ack

Im not looking for films and tips, im looking for someone to sit down, in the TA or something, and actually TEACH.

Also, I HATE YOU ALL! lol. Before I read all that stuff about P-40s spinning out, I NEVER noticed it, but once In read it, it seemed never tos top happening! lol.