Author Topic: Is the russian bear back? (Read 2359 times)

Nilsen · « **Reply #75 on:** October 10, 2006, 05:35:37 PM »

Oh nice... Russian vs American propaganda. This is good stuff.

Hopefully we will never find out who would win a conventional fight between a fully trained and fitted America and Russia. I doubt either will be close to 100% at the same time anyway.

I put my money on Sweden, Austria and the Swiss.

2bighorn · « **Reply #76 on:** October 10, 2006, 05:39:28 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lukster
So when a comparison of US and Russian bombers and fighters is made I'm not allowed to post a pic of the world's premier bomber (imo) and a catchy tune without it being a challenge to your post Viking?

Don't care bout Viking, but B2 (in strategic terms) is just about useless.

21 in service with about 45% MC rate (according to Pentagon, other sources say it's bellow 40%).

Probably the most expensive PR ever...

Chairboy · « **Reply #77 on:** October 10, 2006, 05:40:40 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
5. All American spy planes have been shot down, no matter how high, stealth or not.

There's plenty of fodder for an exciting response, but I cherry picked this little nugget. The SR-71 had over 1000 missile launches against it, but was not shot down even once. Your error is extravagant in its scope.

lukster · « **Reply #78 on:** October 10, 2006, 06:21:03 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Viking
NP Nilsen, I'll just dodge Iron's hook this time. He uses old bait anyways.

I really didn't know who you were. Have to admit to enjoying some of our past arguments and look forward to more, even if you do pop your cork, maybe especially if you do.

Mace2004 · « **Reply #79 on:** October 10, 2006, 07:09:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
Look. Russian Fighters can still beat American Aircraft. If russia wanted we would upgrade even more and pass the US once again.

1. Russian migs can "Beam" an american aircraft for a missile lock and FIRE before the American is in range, and trust me these missiles are tricky buggers RK-73

R-73 is a short range missile. Both the AMRAAM and Sparrow have longer range. You also obviously don't understand the term "beam" and what it means. Iraq had R-73s, they had exactly 0 kills with them.

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
2. Practically every Russian fighter can outturn and do even more depending on the pilot compared to american craft.

MIG-25? 31? I'll grant you that both the MIG29 and SU27 can turn well, but, I'll remind you that the MIG-21 could out turn an F-4. F-4 still had the better kill ratio.

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
3. We have more VTOL aircraft

I don't know the exact number of VTOL aircraft Russia still has but the Forger is generally considered to be failure with shorter range, less payload, and weak weapon system comparted to the AV-8B. Also, the US has the JSF on the way.

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
4. We don't exactly need stealths we don't need to worry if we wanted one we would make it.

LOL. Stealth was probably the last nail in the USSR's coffin. The USSR had neither the technical means to defeat it nor the money to develop it.

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
5. All American spy planes have been shot down, no matter how high, stealth or not.

I think Chairboy answered this one although I don't know that more than a 1000 missiles were fired at it, I'll just add that this plane first flew in 1966, that was 40 years ago and none was even scratched by a Soviet/Russian missile.

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
6. Russia basically also has nukes ya know, the ammount is insane, start war, on day 2, Bush will be dead. Or whomever started it. Sure the US has nukes and such, but about a fraction of what Russia does

Yeah...well...what does one say to that? I can overkill you more than you can overkill me? I guess I can point out that Russian can't afford to destroy what they have, that's why the US is giving the Russian government money to destroy all the excess.

RAIDER14 · « **Reply #80 on:** October 10, 2006, 07:22:01 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Viking
Nope, it's the other way around. Russia has hundreds of bombers faster than US bombers, but the US has the best fighters (F-22).

F-22 projected got canceled didn't it now its the F-35 JSF

Mace2004 · « **Reply #81 on:** October 10, 2006, 07:23:57 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by RAIDER14
F-22 projected got canceled didn't it now its the F-35 JSF

No. We have both.

Angus · « **Reply #82 on:** October 11, 2006, 04:00:43 AM »

LOL, a Russian-American contest.
Krypto: your stuff has proved to be faulty. Ponder on this:
American and russian aircraft have been clashing since Korea. The supposed performance was sometimes in the Russian favour. Sometimes the numbers were too. Yet, the score is vastly better from the behalf of the U.S. Hardware, - the top dog being the F-15 if my memory serves me.

Nilsen · « **Reply #83 on:** October 11, 2006, 04:31:53 AM »

I am pretty sure that if the americans had used russian hardware, but had the same training and tactics as they did then they would still have won those air wars.

Its training and how its used that really puts the americans one step ahead of their prior counterparts. Not saying that the technology in sertain areas are not superior but not by as much really.

Sadly im confident that if the russians decided to take on NATO they would run over all european and american forces stationed there during the cold war. They would have suffered alot of losses but their share number and the element of suprise would do it. The focus on quality and "microchip" technology over quantity would benefit the USSR.

Excel1 · « **Reply #84 on:** October 11, 2006, 05:57:42 AM »

Nilson, I think tactical nukes would have quickly evened things up

Nilsen · « **Reply #85 on:** October 11, 2006, 06:15:05 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Excel1
Nilson, I think tactical nukes would have quickly evened things up

im pretty sure both sides had them

lukster · « **Reply #86 on:** October 11, 2006, 10:17:57 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Krypto
Look. Russian Fighters can still beat American Aircraft. If russia wanted we would upgrade even more and pass the US once again.

1. Russian migs can "Beam" an american aircraft for a missile lock and FIRE before the American is in range, and trust me these missiles are tricky buggers RK-73

2. Practically every Russian fighter can outturn and do even more depending on the pilot compared to american craft.

3. We have more VTOL aircraft

4. We don't exactly need stealths we don't need to worry if we wanted one we would make it.

5. All American spy planes have been shot down, no matter how high, stealth or not.

6. Russia basically also has nukes ya know, the ammount is insane, start war, on day 2, Bush will be dead. Or whomever started it. Sure the US has nukes and such, but about a fraction of what Russia does

I don't believe your post is serious but I'll answer it anyhow. You might want to recheck your numbers on nukes.

http://www.nrdc.org/nuclear/nudb/datab19.asp

Angus · « **Reply #87 on:** October 11, 2006, 10:30:00 AM »

Lots of nukes, and even the French have enough to plonk anybody down to the stone age.

Mace2004 · « **Reply #88 on:** October 11, 2006, 04:32:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Angus
Lots of nukes, and even the French have enough to plonk anybody down to the stone age.

So the French have both white flags and nukes...strange, strange country. How are they going to use them? If their surrender isn't accepted right away they threaten to blow up Paris? That would really piss off the invading country, they wouldn't get to visit all the cool Parisian places the Germans told them about.

1895 · « **Reply #89 on:** October 11, 2006, 06:06:26 PM »

lukster, ever been to russia, plenty of active silos guarded still around. Plenty actually and you think the russians will admit the true amount of nukes? And why isn't the US dismantling their nukes from the patriot act