Author Topic: Michael J. Fox political ad  (Read 1658 times)

Offline Sabre

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« Reply #60 on: November 01, 2006, 08:33:31 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Stringer
BZZZT...Wrong.

Both the House and Senate approved the legislation....THAT was the will of the people....GWB Vetoed the Bill, which went AGAINST the WILL of the people, according to how the people's elected body voted.

Soooo....the will of the people as expressed through their direct representatives voted FOR the legislation.


Yes, Stringer, I'm aware of the vetoed legislation.  I was refering to the election of the President himself, who ran on a platform that included opposing destruction of new embyos for research.  The point I was making was regarding the suggestion that opposing stem embryonic stem cell research on moral or religious grounds somehow ran contrary to the US Constitution.  I take it that you agree with the rest of my post then?

Here is my opinion: I believe that in the same way most Americans believe abortions should be avoided if possible (i.e. abortion should not be used for casual birth control), I believe most would not support Federal funding of ESC research if they understood the touted promise is nothing more than smoke and mirrors.  As posted above, adult and cord-blood stem cell research is delivering, where ESC is not (and not because of a lack of funding, federal or otherwise).  Any exploitation of human life is a step down a road, the destination of which most decent people can't help but find abhorrent.

BJ229r, thanks for the info.  I was aware of some of these studies, but not the Type-I diebetes one.  My daughter is Type-I diebetic, and on insulin since she was 6 1/2 years old (she's 21 now).  This brings real hope to me, not the false hope of ESCR, and does so without requiring the harvesting of human beings.
Sabre
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Offline T0J0

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« Reply #61 on: November 01, 2006, 10:46:04 AM »
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Originally posted by Vudak
I don't mean offense by this...  But I think you may be in need of an education regarding pre-legalized abortions in the USA...


I heard the stories from the pre legalized era, certain achievements in medicine in the last 50 years make those old school horror stories just that "old school horror stories"

Offline lukster

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« Reply #62 on: November 01, 2006, 10:54:43 AM »
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Originally posted by Vudak
I don't mean offense by this...  But I think you may be in need of an education regarding pre-legalized abortions in the USA...


If I'm understanding you correctly my answer is that I think it shouldn't be easy but perhaps should even be dangerous to kill your baby.

Offline Horn

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« Reply #63 on: November 01, 2006, 12:31:28 PM »
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Originally posted by AquaShrimp
"Spontaneous abortions, generally referred to as miscarriages, occur when an embryo or fetus is lost due to natural causes before the 20th week of development. Spontaneous abortions after the 20th week are generally considered to be preterm deliveries. Most miscarriages occur very early in a pregnancy. Between 10% and 50% of pregnancies end in miscarriage, depending upon the age and health of the pregnant woman.[10]"

This article lists 10-50%, though I've always heard 50% as the general rule.


http://www.obgyn.net/femalepatient/default.asp?page=jauniaux

Fourth paragraph.



VVVVVVVVVVVvgood job reading there, chief.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2006, 12:44:06 PM by Horn »

Offline john9001

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« Reply #64 on: November 01, 2006, 12:41:22 PM »
10 to 50%, well that narrows it down. :rolleyes:

Offline lukster

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« Reply #65 on: November 01, 2006, 12:47:11 PM »
I'm too lazy to go back and study the thread. What's the point about miscarriages? We're all going to die, every last one of us. Doesn't mean it's ok to murder.

Offline Horn

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« Reply #66 on: November 01, 2006, 12:56:39 PM »
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Originally posted by lukster
I'm too lazy to go back and study the thread. What's the point about miscarriages? We're all going to die, every last one of us. Doesn't mean it's ok to murder.


Unless it is the death penalty, right? :rolleyes:

Offline lukster

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« Reply #67 on: November 01, 2006, 01:03:27 PM »
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Originally posted by Horn
Unless it is the death penalty, right? :rolleyes:


I guess you don't understand the difference between murdering the innocent and executing the guilty.

Offline AquaShrimp

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« Reply #68 on: November 01, 2006, 04:13:51 PM »
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EARLY-PREGNANCY VIABILITY

The miscarriage of an early pregnancy is the most common medical complication in humans, with 50% of conceptions lost before the end of the first trimester (Table 1).3,4 Moreover, early pregnancy complications currently account for about 75% of emergency gynecologic admissions at the University College, London. Most miscarriages occur within the first month after the last menstrual period,4 so that the patient is often unaware of both the conception and the subsequent spontaneous abortion. The rate of clinical miscarriage increases with maternal age and a positive obstetric history, and decreases with gestational age.4


Offline lazs2

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« Reply #69 on: November 02, 2006, 09:07:26 AM »
stem cell research should be allowed but the government (us) shouldn't be coerced into paying for it.

lazs

Offline Chairboy

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« Reply #70 on: November 02, 2006, 12:42:53 PM »
"When fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis

Offline Vudak

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« Reply #71 on: November 02, 2006, 12:58:42 PM »
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Originally posted by T0J0
I heard the stories from the pre legalized era, certain achievements in medicine in the last 50 years make those old school horror stories just that "old school horror stories"



Yeah...  As long as a woman retains her right to go to a clinic...  Take that away and welcome back to the alley!

I mean, unless you've got a sympathetic doctor for a buddy, all those certain achievements in medicine aren't going to do you a whole lot of good if abortion is made illegal.
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Offline Vudak

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« Reply #72 on: November 02, 2006, 01:01:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lukster
If I'm understanding you correctly my answer is that I think it shouldn't be easy but perhaps should even be dangerous to kill your baby.


Fair enough.

I don't like abortion myself.  But the way I see it is this:

If I got my girlfriend pregnant, and she decided to have an abortion, I'd be pretty upset (to say the least), but not nearly as upset as I'd be if she killed herself in the process of trying to self-abort because she couldn't go to a clinic.
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