Author Topic: Red Orchestra free trail coming 12/07/06  (Read 1161 times)

Offline Bruno

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« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2006, 01:23:37 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Russian
We should add another phobia to ever-growing list: Steamphobia.

I had it since HL2 release, purchased RO and Dangerous Waters on it and still have no problems. I understand when people freak out because of StarForce, but this is silly….



Don't bother trying to to be rational with them - I tried a while back it just leads to more paranoia.

There's lots of good stuff on Steam and thousands of people use Steam and have no issue at all. Other gaming companies are coming to Steam to deliver their products.

If they don't want to 'play' its their loss. RO - even over Steam - is a lot of fun.

I can't wait to hear their rants over the new in game advertising stuff like in Battlefield 2142.  

I guess they will always have Aces High to play...

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2006, 01:44:24 PM »
Ummm, I dont remember knocking anything, I just asked what it was.  The people supporting Steam seem to have more attitude than the ones putting it down.  I just simply dont install things on my computer if I dont know what they do.  Period.  I've never heard of Steam, dont know what it is, dont want to install it without knowing.  Skuzzy doesnt like it, thats a pretty good argument for me that is not a good thing.  But I'd still like to hear just what it is so I can make up my own mind.

Offline Bruno

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« Reply #17 on: December 02, 2006, 01:57:33 PM »
Quote
Ummm, I dont remember knocking anything, I just asked what it was. The people supporting Steam seem to have more attitude than the ones putting it down.


Any one single you out? Please quote it...

fyi,

This isn't the first thread about Steam on this forum thus Sunking's reply of:

Quote
Same ole responses.


Steam causes no problems for a lot of folks, others fear and hate it with a passion. RO is fun - even over Steam.

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #18 on: December 02, 2006, 04:25:28 PM »
Paranoia?  Fear?  Hate?  Phobia? I guess it is easier to chastise than to just allow others to handle thier computers in thier own manner.

You do realize that in being somewhat over-zealous in defending Steam, you are portraying the exact things you claim others are?  Just noticing.
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Offline StarOfAfrica2

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« Reply #19 on: December 02, 2006, 05:00:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Bruno
Any one single you out? Please quote it...

fyi,

This isn't the first thread about Steam on this forum thus Sunking's reply of:



Steam causes no problems for a lot of folks, others fear and hate it with a passion. RO is fun - even over Steam.


I know this isnt the first time its been mentioned, and yet not one time has anyone explained what it is.  Neither did you.  I asked a simple question.  If it causes no problems, why do so  many people dislike it?  WHAT IS IT?

Offline moot

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« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2006, 05:14:40 PM »
It's Valve Software's digital distribution program.  The scheme is to get rid of middle man publishers.
The reality is that it has some quality features, but is also getting bloated and gives some people a lot of bugs, and triggers some's pet peeves, to wit: its somewhat tentacular all-pervasiveness.

http://www.steampowered.com/
« Last Edit: December 02, 2006, 05:19:11 PM by moot »
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Offline Viking

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« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2006, 05:54:34 PM »
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Originally posted by Skuzzy
It is a shame they use Steam.  I keep forgetting why I never will play RO, then I go look and get a reminder.  If I had another computer I could dedicate to Steam, I'd be ok with it, but the Wife would have a coronary if I add another computer to our home network.  I already have 3 on my KVM switch, for myself.


My home office currently have 3 servers (2 render servers + a file/printer server), my main work/gaming computer and a laptop all networked up using 3 different OS'. The 3 servers are controlled remotely by my laptop or the main rig, which got 3 monitors and a projector hooked up to it (for better workspace). I have about fifty programs on the main rig + about twice that number of games, including games that require Steam and Starforce. I also run a custom interface shell on all the rigs except the fileserver (which still runs on 2000 server).

I've been running the same installation of XP on the main rig now for two years, even migrated it to a new computer (and I'm currently in the process of another upgrade/migration). However I do take regular backup images of all my OS' and I have had to revert to a previous backup a couple of times, but overall I have had little or no problems keeping everything working flawlessly. But I do know what I'm doing (not saying you don't, you obviously do), and of course as always "your mileage may vary". I do however think your stance on Starforce and Steam is a bit … not paranoid, but perhaps "overly idealistic". But as always, that's your choice.

Personally I've have no problems with either Starforce or Steam, and I'm actually quite fond of the Steam service.

Offline Bruno

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« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2006, 07:15:57 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by StarOfAfrica2
I know this isnt the first time its been mentioned, and yet not one time has anyone explained what it is.  Neither did you.  I asked a simple question.  If it causes no problems, why do so  many people dislike it?  WHAT IS IT?


That's right, I didn't because none following replies about Steam had much to do with your question. They were just more of the same Steam 'sucks'. I was just surprised that you would assume the 'Steam talk' that followed was directly attributed to you.



Quote
Paranoia? Fear? Hate? Phobia? I guess it is easier to chastise than to just allow others to handle thier computers in thier own manner.

You do realize that in being somewhat over-zealous in defending Steam, you are portraying the exact things you claim others are? Just noticing.


I don't care one way about or another about Steam. I use because there's games delivered over Steam I like to play. If they got rid of Steam and I would just be the cd /dvds.

We went through this in another thread about RO and Steam. I asked what was so wrong about Steam you gave nothing but the same old posts about Steam eating hard drives and consuming system resources. The same stuff every 'Steam hater' says. Those issues haven't been a problem to me or anyone I know who uses Steam, maybe we are just lucky.

I appreciate your insight into most things CPU related. However, until some one articulates exactly just what's so horrible about 'Steam' the 'Steam Sucks' mantra rings hollow.

With the amount of quality games delivered over Steam - and this will grow in the future - it just seems silly to dismiss Steam when there's a whole lot of fun to be had.

Starforce OTOH they can keep...

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #23 on: December 03, 2006, 09:23:14 AM »
Ok, you want specifics.

1)  Valve did deliver a version of Steam which did, in fact, wipe hard drives of considerable amounts of data.  I was curious about that one and did check into why or how it could happen and found it.  If they can deliver a program once, which can do significant damage to a system there is nothing to say it cannot happen again.

2)  They lost thier source code to Half Life once.  It was poor practices which lead to it.  This suggests they do not have a strong desire to allow a network admin to do the right things to secure thier network.  They purportedly fixed it, but it took a disaster to make it happen.  In my experience, when a company flagrantly ignores very basic security, it will funnel its way into the very code they provide.  
Statistically, I will not allow them the chance to provide a piece of software which could in fact create a security issue.

Those two reasons alone are enough to keep me away from it.  Regardless of who runs it without issue today, does not mean there will never be an issue.  The problems with the issues they can have are not worth the risk to me.

Risk assessment is part of my job and has been a part of my career for over 20 years.  I take it very seriously.

There is nothing any user can say which will alter the risk assessment.  Your opinions are just that.  They are void of any risk assessment value.  In this matter, the company providing the software is at the heart of the risk assessment.  Thier history suggests they should not be trusted.

Viking obviously has done risk assessment and taken what he feels is appropriate measures to insure a stable network.  While I am not saying this cannot be accomplished, I am also saying there are elements which you cannot control in this particular scenario.  Knowing that and assessing the risk is up to the user.

There is not a game made which will ever be worth exposing my networks to the risks inherent with Steam.  The risks are valid and proven.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2006, 09:25:17 AM by Skuzzy »
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Offline USRanger

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« Reply #24 on: December 03, 2006, 10:21:15 AM »
I've been playing RO through Steam almost every night now for 2-3 months.  I've never had any issues at all with Steam.  Anyway, I HIGHLY recommend RO for someone looking for awesome infantry/tank battles with beautiful graphics.

http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/4899/0000000255oc0.jpg
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Offline Pooh21

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« Reply #25 on: December 03, 2006, 10:24:34 AM »
I am trying WW2 online while waiting for my city of villians prepaid card to come in from amazon. It freezes up regularly after 5 minutes, its like I am trapped in 1998s iPanzer 44 and I cant get out!!
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Offline croduh

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« Reply #26 on: December 03, 2006, 10:42:22 AM »
I used to play Ro daily when it was just a ut2004 mod.
Funny, i haven't bought any games since 2004.

Offline Bruno

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« Reply #27 on: December 03, 2006, 12:03:56 PM »
Skuzzy most gamers I know have dedicated gaming machines, run reasonably secure networks etc... They already take measures to minimize risk like Viking. However, risk is always there.

Steam 'eating of hard drives' happened in those early betas. Even wwiiol ate a few hard drives a few years ago (weren't some of those guys ex-coworkers of HT back in WBs?).

The risk of Steam eating your hard drive is minimal by any measure.

The HL2 Source Code fiasco has been thoroughly explored and explained. Yeah it may raise questions but this wasn't really about 'Steam' per se. I guess I could be worried that some clever hacker is going to hack into Steam and steal  my account info or use Steam to hack into my computer and steal all my secrets. I could also worry about folks rummaging through my trash - stealing my mail or that negligent government worker who gives away my personal information.

Gamers today have to deal with many more issues then anything attributed to 'Steam'. Invasive piracy protection for one, in game add spyware etc... Even those crappy control panel's that are shipping with Nvidia/ATI drivers.

There's a discussion on another forum that sort of touches on all this. A poster replied:

Quote
I support solutions like Steam, for obvious reasons, and their security works, doesn't get in my face and comes in a game package that costs considerably less on account of having cut out the parasites like -scum (who appear to have learned nothing, despite the debacles already suffered with Starfarce and Boontybox).


Now I get you don't like the 'risk' - too bad RO is fun.

Offline Skuzzy

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« Reply #28 on: December 03, 2006, 12:48:32 PM »
Reasonably secure has different meanings to different people.  My local computers do not run any anti-virus programs, nor firewalls, nor anti-spyware, or anything remotely close to any of those programs.

I have been around the net since the DaARPA days, and have never been hacked, never gotten a virus, never gotten any spyware/malware and I only describe my network as reasonably secure.

Most gamers I know have atrocious security habits.  That is a relative statement though.  What is atrocious to me, may be peachy-keen to others.  Also keep in mind.  I am more programmer than gamer.  I have far too many years of work invested to risk it for some game.

I have no desire to dissuade anyone from doing what they want to do with thier computer.  I simply state my own personal concerns.
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Offline mandingo

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« Reply #29 on: December 03, 2006, 01:24:46 PM »
Steam is great.  I wish more game publishers had online distribution systems.