Hurri-C Eny Rating

[E25280]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Hurricane acts completely opposite to what finnish pilots reported during WW2. They called hurricane a clumsy plane prone to fire that was best defeated by going into turnfight and putting a couple of mg rounds in mid fuselage. This almost instantly lit the plane up, effectively burning the pilot who sat on the fuel tank.

AH hurricane turns on a dime and nobody would want to turnfight it. It's not specially prone to fire either.

Funny to see you post something like this . . . US pilots thought the Brewster was clumsy etc., but that was opposite of Finnish experience too.

Goes to show how much/little the perception of performance should matter versus the hard data HTC relies on.

For Storch's point about the 110, it could be argued (and has been endlessly on these boards) that it was the tactics used that hurt the plane's historic performance and record rather than any shortcoming of the plane itself.

Also, the hurri didn't develop further because the days of wood and fabric were coming to a close, not because it was a poor plane for 1940.

Bottom line, I would think HTC is fairly accurate with their modeling, and that it is pilot skill and tactics that make historic record and AH perceptions diverge.


That still doesn't explain the 10 ENY for the IIC in Late War . . . I agree that is too low if it warrants only a 15 in Mid War.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by DREDger
The one thing you can say about it is it teaches air-gunnery. You wont get far with spray-and-pray - those 20mm disappear pretty quick

Not sure I agree with that, besides being off subject.  20mm hit from farther than .50 or .303.  20mm are the spray and pray round of choice.

In a tiff maybe but in a hurri?  Nope to short a clip.


Bronk

[roach]

The Hurricane IIc should be a perk plane in the Early War arena.  If you visit EW you might notice that over half of the fighter kills landed are by those flying them.  It should, however, be a very inexpensive perk plane in EW, of perhaps no more than 5 or fewer points required (depending on the balance factor).

In the LW arenas the Hurricane IIc is outclassed.  This is especially true now that more and more players are migrating away from low altitude "dog fights" and towards high altitude diving combined with head on tactics.  In the LW arenas I would consider the Hurricane IIc at an ENY of 20 or higher appropriate.

[Oleg]

btw, why LW enj was changed at all? It looks strange now. F4F has enj 20 like FM or 109K4 Spit5 has 25 F4U-1D enj was lowered to 15 - i cannt get 20 perks per sortie any more

[bj229r]

Seems to me that several of the eny's are abitrary...had recent thread on "N" jug for same thing, except it was dropped to a '5', which puts it in the hangar if ANY eny kicks in...however weak a H2C seems to be, a LOT of people fly them, even in LW-- can anyone post K/D from stats page? I havent been able to pull up that page in months. (And does ANYone know what ENY is based upon? Have been several theories of late, none of which have been commented on by HT & Co.)

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by bj229r
-- can anyone post K/D from stats page? I havent been able to pull up that page in months.

For the last 4 tours 80-83, the tally is

Tour 80 (before arena changes?)  32629 kills / 22036 deaths, k/d ratio: 1.48
Tour 81  21419 kills / 14502 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.47
Tour 82  20321 kills / 12616 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.61
Tour 83  20001 kills / 11843 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.68

Obviously, these are against all types in all arenas, so doesn't account for use in EWA, MWA, LWA.

So as a basis for comparison, over the same tours, Hurri II vs. Spit 16 and Hurri II vs. P-51D

Tour 80:  Hurri enjoys a 1.42 and 1.33 k/d ratio over Spit16 and PonyD respectively
Tour 81:  Hurri enjoys a 1.35 and 1.21 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively
Tour 82:  Hurri enjoys a 1.49 and 1.38 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively
Tour 83:  Hurri enjoys a 1.47 and 1.33 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively

Theoretically by looking at these stats, the Hurri II should have an ENY that is lower or equal to either plane in the Late War arenas, as it has demonstrated itself to be a KILLER over two of the hottest planes in the LW set.  Again, I contend that the quick turning coupled with the cannon is the overriding factor, as the Hurri can shoot people in the face quicker than almost anything.  I fly the Jug a lot, and typically I won't even bother with Hurri's because you get on their 6 o'clock with 500 mph indicated, and they just turn into you at 2.0-3.0k out and start blazing with the cannon.  I'll typically zoom up away from the fire-breathers and look for easier prey, or at least something that gives me an opportunity to avoid jousting.

[storch]

Originally posted by Stoney74
For the last 4 tours 80-83, the tally is

Tour 80 (before arena changes?)  32629 kills / 22036 deaths, k/d ratio: 1.48
Tour 81  21419 kills / 14502 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.47
Tour 82  20321 kills / 12616 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.61
Tour 83  20001 kills / 11843 deaths, k/d ratio:  1.68

Obviously, these are against all types in all arenas, so doesn't account for use in EWA, MWA, LWA.

So as a basis for comparison, over the same tours, Hurri II vs. Spit 16 and Hurri II vs. P-51D

Tour 80:  Hurri enjoys a 1.42 and 1.33 k/d ratio over Spit16 and PonyD respectively
Tour 81:  Hurri enjoys a 1.35 and 1.21 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively
Tour 82:  Hurri enjoys a 1.49 and 1.38 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively
Tour 83:  Hurri enjoys a 1.47 and 1.33 k/d ratio over Spit and Pony respectively

Theoretically by looking at these stats, the Hurri II should have an ENY that is lower or equal to either plane in the Late War arenas, as it has demonstrated itself to be a KILLER over two of the hottest planes in the LW set.  Again, I contend that the quick turning coupled with the cannon is the overriding factor, as the Hurri can shoot people in the face quicker than almost anything.  I fly the Jug a lot, and typically I won't even bother with Hurri's because you get on their 6 o'clock with 500 mph indicated, and they just turn into you at 2.0-3.0k out and start blazing with the cannon.  I'll typically zoom up away from the fire-breathers and look for easier prey, or at least something that gives me an opportunity to avoid jousting.

wow.  could I trouble you to see how they fare against the La7 and the 109s?  you are smart to avoid them, I on the other hand am dumb.  I hunt the bassturds, and then taunt them irrespective of the outcome which is usually me lawn darting.  if the almost truth be told it's usually the result of 10,000 BoPs congregating in woobieness and doing the only thing they can which is gang on singles on the way to capture another undefended back base.

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by storch
wow.  could I trouble you to see how they fare against the La7 and the 109s?  you are smart to avoid them, I on the other hand am dumb.  I hunt the bassturds, and then taunt them irrespective of the outcome which is usually me lawn darting.  if the almost truth be told it's usually the result of 10,000 BoPs congregating in woobieness and doing the only thing they can which is gang on singles on the way to capture another undefended back base.

I may be able to post that later tonight after I get back from work.  Need to go make my $15 for the month right now...I'll even see if I can't make some K/D ratio comparisons with other aircraft.

[Bucky73]

In BoB the hurri accounted for 5 out of every 7 kills........................ ................

[Brenjen]

I find it odd that people will bash someone for flying the Hurri2-c...it's slow as a sloth. So it can turn...so it has a few 20mm, the Nik has all that & more, the spits are too uber, the nik is too uber, the typhie is too uber,...come on. I have now heard every plane set in AH bashed by someone except the Hurri-1 & that's only because Shatzi hasn't shot you down in one yet.

 Fly what you like, like what you fly.

[Benny Moore]

I think that the reason that the cannon model costs what it does is because it was not nearly as widely used historically as it is in the game.

[Laurie]

Hurricane mk1 and 2 c can be deadly IF you fly them properly, i find the hurri1 an especially fun ride, and its nota death trap either, i have landed plenty of kills in these 2 birds over my time in the game.

[SteveBailey]

I won't even bother with Hurri's because you get on their 6 o'clock with 500 mph indicated, and they just turn into you at 2.0-3.0k out and start blazing with the cannon. I'll typically zoom up away from the fire-breathers and look for easier prey, or at least something that gives me an opportunity to avoid jousting.

I do not mean to offend you but I tend to be direct.  Your tactics against the hurri are wrong.  Properly dealt with a hurri is a target you can attack with impunity.  That is, with little or no risk of exposing yourself to its deadly hispanos.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Bucky73
In BoB the hurri accounted for 5 out of every 7 kills........................ ................

Because they were tasked to go after the bombers while Spitfires tangled with the fighters.  Purely against a fighter vs. fighter standpoint the margin was less than that for the Hurricane against the Bf109.


ack-ack

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by SteveBailey
I do not mean to offend you but I tend to be direct.  Your tactics against the hurri are wrong.  Properly dealt with a hurri is a target you can attack with impunity.  That is, with little or no risk of exposing yourself to its deadly hispanos.

I'm partial to the D11.  By all means, enlighten me...