Jeremy Clarkson-The Good The Bad The Ugly

[Viking]

That a German road car is Teutonic engineering is sort of a given. To me "driver's car" means the company wants to sell more of its new crap box's by making it sound sporty.

[Skuzzy]

Originally posted by FastFwd
US cars = crap.

Sticking with my 1998 Honda.

Found this in another thread.  Not sure why he would be happy to post what he drove in that thread and then not be so forthcoming in this thread.  Odd that.

[GtoRA2]

Originally posted by Skuzzy
Found this in another thread.  Not sure why he would be happy to post what he drove in that thread and then not be so forthcoming in this thread.  Odd that.

lol thats almost a prenus.

[Mark Luper]

Well I don't agree with his belief that US Cars = Crap but the '98 Honda is a good car. I wonder which model it is.

Mark

[Excel1]

Originally posted by Viking
That a German road car is Teutonic engineering is sort of a given. To me "driver's car" means the company wants to sell more of its new crap box's by making it sound sporty.

Bronk's description of a drivers car is the description I'm familiar with.

It's the type of car that is harder to drive and requires more concentration and experience when it's driven hard, or maybe not even near ten/tenths, it depends on the car. Its usualy, but doesn't necessarily have to be a high performance machine . An inexperienced driver or unwary day dreamer is more likely to get caught out by a performance characteristic that is outside of what is considered normal.

[moot]

I dunno, that would make the spin-happy testarossa a driver's car...
A driver's car sound like something focused on.. driving, aka the opposite of "people mover".  Something that is built around an efficient compromise between power and handling.
I'm pretty sure there are a few outstanding examples of this sort of car, that are almost anemic in outright performance, but really do fit the bill.. I can't recall which one(s) it is at the moment, though.

[1K3]

Originally posted by Mark Luper
Well I don't agree with his belief that US Cars = Crap but the '98 Honda is a good car. I wonder which model it is.

Mark

Compare to its contemporaries Honda accord (I-4/V-6 models) is the best out there.  Accord was always on the top 10 for 20 years.

--------------------------

US cars may not be 100% crap but it's 66% crap because of GM and Daimler/Chrysler making pointless P.O.S. models.  GM should downsize their division by getting rid of Pontiac, Saturn, Hummer, SAAB, GMC, and Oldsmobile.

I like Ford's new strategy because they are trimming down the number of car models and increasing the quality at the same time.  Check out the Ford Fusion.  Fusion is head-2-head with Accord and Camry in quality.

[moot]

Big corps should be left to make the cookie-cutter management board-designed people movers, and the rest of the brands should concentrate on their trademarks.
Triumph can't compete in sales numbers with Japanese mass-produced bikes, and yet they've made a big splash with "underdog" designs like their triple-powered 1050 S3, 675 sportbike, and RocketIII cruiser.

Fire the unions or whatever, and let the brands be true to themselves.  Look at how small Ducati is.. compare the passion they light up in their fans compared to.. GM or Citroen.  
Anyone heard of Citroen road cars worth mortgaging your house for?

[Excel1]

Originally posted by moot
I dunno, that would make the spin-happy testarossa a driver's car...
A driver's car sound like something focused on.. driving, aka the opposite of "people mover".  Something that is built around an efficient compromise between power and handling.
I'm pretty sure there are a few outstanding examples of this sort of car, that are almost anemic in outright performance, but really do fit the bill.. I can't recall which one(s) it is at the moment, though.

I don't disagree that a car that's designed from the drawing board with a good balance of power, handling and braking and has the emphasis on pure driving pleasure rather than people moving is by definition a drivers car.
But imo a true drivers car is one that’s not up to scratch by todays high standards in braking or has handling quirks or whatever and needs a higher level of driver expertise than a more balanced car to keep it shiny side up

If I was to pick out one car in the JC's video (thread title) that I consider to be a good example of a drivers car it would be the drum braked 1968 Mustang 390GT

[lazs2]

I wonder if fastfwrd knows if his honda is front or rear wheel drive?   Bet he has never changed the oil in it and I bet the person he sells it to won't think it's such a great car.

My whole point is that if you drive a honda around then maybe your opinions on performance cars and the whole performance car scene might not be to.... ah.. hands on?

It is even more certain that you would know nothing of the American hot rod scene other than to shake your fist impotently at them from the cramped little cabin of your honda as they roar by making your rear view mirror shake and fall down.   I have nothing but contempt for such a persons opinion on the American modified vehicle scene.

lazs

[Viking]

Originally posted by lazs2
I have nothing but contempt for such a persons opinion on the American modified vehicle scene.

You're contemptuous toward the opinions of others? Then why do you even care to read these forums, let alone post in this thread?

[Bronk]

Originally posted by moot
I dunno, that would make the spin-happy testarossa a driver's car...
A driver's car sound like something focused on.. driving, aka the opposite of "people mover".  Something that is built around an efficient compromise between power and handling.
I'm pretty sure there are a few outstanding examples of this sort of car, that are almost anemic in outright performance, but really do fit the bill.. I can't recall which one(s) it is at the moment, though.

Like I said Moot doesn't have to be any balance of power:handling.

You take a '64 Tbolt , this was a 10 second car from the factory.
Now your average joe he might be able to get it into the 12-13 second range.

Take the same guy and put him in one of these "supercars'  and he will get much closer to the advertised  1/4 mile times.

The reason being all the driver assist. All the guy has to to is mash the throttle and hang on.
If a tire starts to spin traction control takes over.  with no tire spin he doesn't have to worry about the car getting side ways.

If you were to try that in a Tbolt.  The car would be sideways before you foot made it to the floor.

Bronk

[lazs2]

viking /sclotzie... I did not say that I was contemptuous of the opinions of others...

I said that I had nothing but contempt for the opinion of someone who drove a honda and never turned a wrench when it came to performance and modified cars.    He is tits on a boar in any such conversation... he shouldn't be giving his opinion he should be listening to others who have the experiance.

I would say you fit in this category as well.  Nothing wrong with asking questions and saying what you might have heard or participating but to say that the people who have the real experiance are wrong is just plain stupid.

To talk about what hot rods are and what they can do..when you have never even ridden in one... is lame.

To talk about the modified scene when you don't even have a garage or any tools that don't fit in the siverware drawer is lame.

I don't know much about BMW's for instance but have driven a dozen or so and had to help change a $350 starter on one.   My son owns a tire and suspension store and says the BMW stuff is pretty much overpriced junk and that even a mustang has longer lasting suspension parts... I have looked at what he is talking about on the rack.  

I don't have a lot of experiance in this case so have refrained from talking about BMW's but.... I at least have some... probly more than a whole lot of BMW owners.

I have street raced and autocrossed and drag raced but don't pretend to know as much about racing as some of the experianced guys here do.

but to hear the opinions of some honda driver or some BMW owner who changed out his turn signal lenses...

puleeeese.

lazs

[Bronk]

Originally posted by Viking
Then why do you even care to read these forums, let alone post in this thread?

Because if and when he runs into another car nut. They can discus the pro/con with someone knowledgeable on the topic.  
FF has no business poking his nose into a topic he knows little about. If the man drives a honda and starts spouting off about performance cars. Especialyafter stating

US cars = crap.
Sticking with my 1998 Honda.

And I highly doubt he has all the ricer mods on that honda.
At least some of those guys have a clue about what it takes to "go fast".

FF is more worried about his gas mileage and saving the trees. He sounds POed Americans don't pay $7 a gallon for gas.
At least that's how he appears.

Bronk

[lazs2]

well said bronk... about the old muscle cars and about your perception of fastfwds motives.   It takes a different kind of driver to get a good quarter mile out of a standard trans car with a lot of HP and torque and no traction control compared to a slush box traction control one.

He seems to be a your-0-peean wanna be.   He would love to see $7 a gallon gas so that more people were forced to drive the boring cars he is somehow forced to drive or.... chooses to drive.

I just think he hates individuals who thwart socialist utopian plans with their selfish ways.

lazs