Author Topic: WheelGun or Semi-Auto? (Read 1514 times)

Xargos · « **Reply #45 on:** February 13, 2007, 06:47:15 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Helrazr1

BTW, if there are any LEO's on here with experience to share on the subject, I'd love to hear it. [/B]

All I can tell you is that the sound of a shotgun cycling is enough to stop an inmate climbing the fence. In this state we can shoot them once any part of their body breaks the plane of the first (inside) fence.

I know at least two inmate who owe their life to officers who have seen too much killing in battle, but I also bet that if they did not freeze when they did they would have been shot.

lazs2 · « **Reply #46 on:** February 13, 2007, 08:37:55 AM »

I reload and I have had fewer problems with my reloads than factory loads over the years... I don't want to defend one of my reloads in court tho.

disagree all you want about needing hundreds of rounds. You may... if that is how you are trained or think.

Before hi capacity semi autos cops carried six shot revolvers in mostly .357.. they seldom had to reload and the average fite was 1.7 rounds.. if you are aware of having a limited ammo supply you will go for accuracy..

now.. the average is up to 7 or 9 round a fite... it is spray and pray.. the fite only ends tho when someone settles down and aims.

Now... these are cop shootings.. ones where you can't disengage.. we civies don't get into those kinds of fights. they are close and when rounds are fired the bad guys run away before the police get there. I have been in situations where shots were fired 2 times... once I had a single action ruger in 44 mag and the other a charter arms bulldog in 44 special (a very small 5 shot revolver).

pulling the gun was enough in one case and firing a round into a car was enough in the other. cops get into gun fights... I don't intend to. I intend to find cover and to fire only if I have a shot. I plan on having them run away or me being able to. I plan on waiting em out if I have to. I plan on them wanting to get the hell out of there before the cops arrive.

I want a really loud gun with a lot of muzzle flash and the abiltiy to put someone down with one shot if need be at close range.

If I planned on getting into some kind of prolonged gunfight on the street I would carry a rifle around.

lazs

Halo · « **Reply #47 on:** February 13, 2007, 10:18:57 AM »

Good post, laz. Wish a couple carry permits had been in that Utah mall to drop the shotgun creep before he killed several people.

Hawco · « **Reply #48 on:** February 13, 2007, 11:09:40 AM »

No disrespect to anyone on here, From past experience, it's safe to say that a lot of weapon carriers would probably freeze, Injure themselves, miss the target and a few other things too.
Probably fail to finish the Job too.

Shuffler · « **Reply #49 on:** February 13, 2007, 12:39:35 PM »

Springfield XD Tactical in .45 ACP, Hornady TAP 180 gr two 13 rnd clips, shoulder holster leather. Why... well no one has said how big the guy will be who might attack me.

Slash27 · « **Reply #50 on:** February 13, 2007, 02:23:36 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Xargos
Laser, this is what I use in the hot months of summer down here in S.C.

http://www.galls.com/style.html?assort=general_catalog&style=NP056&cat=2958

You maybe able to find a cheaper one somewhere else, Galls can be very expensive.

Galls is very proud of thier stuff for some reason. Even the junk.

Halo · « **Reply #51 on:** February 13, 2007, 02:28:57 PM »

Yeah, I was thinking what I might or could do if I saw a guy with a shotgun blasting people at a mall and I had a carry, maybe even that S&W 340 .357 snubnose revolver.

First I'd have to get close enough to be effective. That would be within about 7 yards. To a guy blasting everyone with a shotgun? Not likely I could achieve that.

Second, I'd be taking the risk people would see me as another bad guy. Law enforcement responders in particular might take a dim view of me with a gun.

I'm glad many off duty LE carry guns. Great unseen reservoir of additional good guy enforcers.

I know how to shoot, I'm ex military, but unless by fate I was really close to a bad guy when he started shooting, or unless I was more or less deputized by responders seeking reinforcements, it would be a very risky thing to proceed toward a long gun shooter with only a short backup gun.

At best maybe I could distract him. Or that might just make him do more damage. Maybe a suicide charge would do it, getting off at least a couple rounds at him. Tough decisions, these life and death encounters.

lazs2 · « **Reply #52 on:** February 13, 2007, 02:34:37 PM »

hawco... you may be right.. it is said that only about 30% of soldiers will fire their weapons when they need to.

My experiance has been different is all... everyone seemed more than willing to shoot.. I know that in my case.. no real reaction seems to kick in till after... like spinning a car at high speed under power... you react to get things back to normal and when it's all over... you look at your hands shaking and laugh.

I think that because so few even want concealed carry permits.. you get men and women who are predisposed to have the will to do whatever... just as in my experiance... the criminals that carried em were quite capable of using em.

maybe next time I will freeze up but I can't imagine that happening.

lazs

lazs2 · « **Reply #53 on:** February 13, 2007, 02:38:32 PM »

halo.. with the 340pd I know I could hit him at up to 40 yards if I had time and he was not moving much. even if I missed once or twice I bet he would change his whole attitude. bet people could get away while he was worried bout his own skin.

sure... I would rather have my 44 ruger or even the Kimber 45 but... I would not feel unarmed with the 340.

I could worry about my bruised hand later.

lazs

Halo · « **Reply #54 on:** February 13, 2007, 07:49:29 PM »

laz, I've enjoyed your insights about the 340. Reminds me of my relatively brief infatuation with the Colt lightweight Special Agent in .38. I thought I really liked that gun, but one day realized I hadn't shot it in a long time.

It was only a 5-shot, and I left the cylinder empty under the hammer for extra safety, so it didn't have much firepower with only four .38s. A friend had a similar gun that he was proud about uppowering to plus loads, but I was never one for expensive hot loads even fired rarely.

I took the Special Agent to the indoor range and was surprised at the unpleasant blast and recoil even with .38s. That's when I made my even trade for a Ruger Security-Six .357 4-inch barrel that Ruger later refurbished to excellent condition.

That's the best trade I ever made. The 4-inch barrel is much more useful to me, and the heavier frame is more pleasant to shoot with .357 than the lightweight Colt was with .38.

Your points about the 340 are well taken as always. I'm amazed you can hit with it at 40 yards. I'm lucky to hit anything with even the 4-inch Ruger at 20 yards. But that's okay because I never expect to have to shoot a handgun at anything beyond 10 yards.

I researched more about the 340 and find many owners/shooters lamenting its blast and recoil but valuing it for the same reasons you mention in close quarters carry self-defense. As you say, in a crisis things are different and we need max blast, impact, and deterrence, and any discomfort is a small price to pay.

Xargos · « **Reply #55 on:** February 14, 2007, 02:04:33 AM »

How many of you who use a revolver practice loading one round then shooting ,then load another single round then shooting, and repeat on and on as fast as you can?

wrag · « **Reply #56 on:** February 14, 2007, 03:41:45 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Halo
Good post, laz. Wish a couple carry permits had been in that Utah mall to drop the shotgun creep before he killed several people.

Have you seen this???

http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/02/13/jihad-american-style-18-yr-old-bosnian-muslim-refugee-kills-6-people-on-american-soil/

Xargos · « **Reply #57 on:** February 14, 2007, 04:46:46 AM »

Thank you Wrag.

P.S. Have any of you ever used flechette rounds in your 12 gauge? I've never tried them and I'm curious of what you think about them.

lazs2 · « **Reply #58 on:** February 14, 2007, 08:45:26 AM »

xargos... I haven't done that since I carried single action revolvers a lot.

I have jet loaders that load all six (or five) at once.. my 45 acp smith takes full moon clips. When out plinking I have always loaded 2 rounds at a time in double action revolvers.

halo.. why load 4 in a detective special? it is safe to load 5.

wrag.. If it becomes more of an israel situation here in the states... I will be forced to modify my views.

I would probly carry the kimber 45 as the least powerful I would feel safe with and go with either a 4" .357 or my cut down 44 mag ruger.

I am very comfortable with the 44 and have fired maybe a quarter of a million 44 mag rounds over the years maybe more... maybe less..

I also like the .357 revolver in 4"... if you can see it you can hit it.

I am seriously looking into the new scandium 44 mag revolver...

for autos.... I trust the kimber but the 45 is a pretty weak caliber.. I would be interested in a Kimber 1911 in 357 sig tho..

Halo · « **Reply #59 on:** February 14, 2007, 10:05:48 AM »

Wrag, thanks, that article claiming the mall shooter had terrorist motives is disturbing to say the least. Could inspire more armed citizen augmentation here like Israel.

Laz, I'm ultra conservative with firearms so didn't carry a shell under the hammer in that Colt .38 because I couldn't in my older Ruger single actions. Now with a new Ruger Single-Six and its safer hammer mechanism, I'm comfortable with a shell under the hammer. Still not sure the Colt was safe that way though.

Xargos, I haven't shot anything but standard ammo through my 12-gauge Coach shotgun. I was intrigued by some of the wild novelty rounds available for shotguns, but apparently most are illegal here in Virginia.

For something different, you might want to try some of the little Aguila 1 3/8-inch minishells with four No. 1 buckshot and seven No. 4 buckshot. Only fired them at paper so far, but don't think they're lethal enough for serious home defense (still use regular No. 1 buckshot for that). They won't work in many shotguns except double- or single-barrels.

Laz, do you consider the .357 sig more potent than the .45? I've fired through the main calibers with rental guns (9, 357 sig, 40, 45) and thought the 45 had more oomph. For some reason I really like the 40 the most. I'm still thinking about getting an XD, but haven't yet decided between 4- or 5-inch barrel and 40 or 45 acp.