Author Topic: Iran isn't involved  (Read 1007 times)

Offline VOR

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Iran isn't involved
« on: February 14, 2007, 07:52:52 AM »
Mahmoud denies involvement, so this is an apparent ruse to bolster support for action against Iran for more oilz and Haliburton contractz.



Quote
The guns were part of a shipment of 800 rifles that the Austrian company, Steyr-Mannlicher, exported legally to Iran last year.

The sale was condemned in Washington and London because officials were worried that the weapons would be used by insurgents against British and American troops.

Within 45 days of the first HS50 Steyr Mannlicher rifles arriving in Iran, an American officer in an armoured vehicle was shot dead by an Iraqi insurgent using the weapon.

Over the last six months American forces have found small caches of the £10,000 rifles but in the last 24 hours a raid in Baghdad brought the total to more than 100, US defence sources reported.




Full Article

Offline Sixpence

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2007, 08:10:15 AM »
Did they sell the rifle to anyone else?
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)

Offline VOR

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2007, 08:21:05 AM »
Sure, the CIA bought a few hundred and planted them around Iraq. Other than that, I dunno.

Offline rabbidrabbit

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2007, 08:21:41 AM »
did you ever hear of matching serial numbers?

Offline Viking

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« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2007, 08:24:48 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sixpence
Did they sell the rifle to anyone else?


Probably, but the timing is very suspect. I'd say that this is a clear indication (if not proof) of Iran's involvement, not that it should be a surprise to anyone. I am however a bit surprised at the carelessness of the Iranians.

Offline Sixpence

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« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2007, 08:25:42 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by rabbidrabbit
did you ever hear of matching serial numbers?


Were any matched?
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)

Offline kamilyun

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2007, 08:25:56 AM »
Yeah, would be nice to know if the SNs matched...not mentioned in the article.

If they do match, I would suggest politely returning them to the Iranians...the ones who bombed the Revolutionary Guards that is :D

Offline VOR

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« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2007, 01:46:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Viking
I am however a bit surprised at the carelessness of the Iranians.


I have to agree with you. Iran knew the west was watching this deal, so I assume they don't care whether they distance themselves from the evidence or not. It's actually quite provocative.

What I'll never understand is the political stance of denying everything when you and the world knows the truth and you know that they know that you know, etc.

Offline tedrbr

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2007, 02:57:46 PM »
No one is really denying that "Iran" is involved.  The question is "who" in Iran is involved and in what capacity?

This could go many ways.   Corruption and little fiefdoms and such are rampant in the Middle East.  Militias a good example.  Alcohol (like Lebanese whiskey, beer, and Russian vodka) is commonly smuggled through Iraq to Iran.  Opium and Heroin at times travels in the other direction on it's way to Europe.  

In Iran you have to consider the intentions of it's government, it's religious leadership (a parallel government in it's own right), and the intelligence branches (which seems to be it's own shadowy power base, much like the one in Pakistan).

The question is if the arms from Iran are sanctioned by their government? Or by the religious leaders?  Possible?  Yes.   No proof presented as yet.  Iraqi forces can be getting that equipment from the black market or unsanctioned rouge groups.  Iranian police and intelligence agencies may be well aware of the conduit these arms and munitions are getting to Iraq though, and chose to look the other way.

Iran is certainly providing monetary funds to Iraqi Shiis groups, which would facilitate them purchasing arms over the black market, which incidentally come from Iran among other sources.


Sorry, nothing in the Middle East is ever simple or straight forward.  

And if they are, what course does the U.S. take?  Openly confront Iran?  Simple enough for Iran to restrict oil flow out of the Persian Gulf.... thus creating world-wide economic panic.  They quite literally may have us over a (oil) barrel.  That is the fault of America... it's citizens, it's (lack of) leadership in government, and it's self-involved corporate leaders.  

Pick your cliche:  Sow the sky, reap the whirlwind.  Time to pay the Piper.   So long as the United States is dependent on oil from the Middle East, it will cost America heavily in terms of taxpayer money and the lives of it's soldiers.  

You want it simple: Oil = gold + blood.    That simple.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2007, 02:59:49 PM by tedrbr »

Offline babek-

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2007, 03:30:50 PM »
Ok - Iran ist the bad guy.

That on 9/11 everywhre in iran there were demonstrations against the terroristic attack against the WTC - while the arabs were celebrating the attack could be ignored.

That Iran always fought against the sunnite Al Kaida and that the mprisoned Al Kaida members in Iran are allowed to be interrogated by international analysts could be ignored.

That Iran always fought against the Taliban could also be ignored.

Now the TV stations show that the bad bad iranians are delivering weapons to the shi ite iraquis.

But:

Why there are no reports that Saudi Arabia is the main financial supportor of Al Kaida and Taliban?

Why there are no reports that the pakistani secret police protects Mullah Omar - one of the most important leaders of the taliban. That in NW Pakistan the whole pashtuni region became the support centre for the Taliban who kill allied soldiers in SE-Afghanistan? That there are the main recruiting stations of the Taliban?

Its easy to blame Iran for this and that.

But to ignore the fact that so called US friends and allies like Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are the main supporters of Taliban and Al Kaida could result in very bad consequences.

Offline tedrbr

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2007, 04:22:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by babek-
Ok - Iran ist the bad guy.

But:

Why there are no reports that Saudi Arabia is the main financial supportor of Al Kaida and Taliban?

Why there are no reports that the pakistani secret police protects Mullah Omar - one of the most important leaders of the taliban. That in NW Pakistan the whole pashtuni region became the support centre for the Taliban who kill allied soldiers in SE-Afghanistan? That there are the main recruiting stations of the Taliban?

 


We buy a lot of oil from, and sell lot's of arms to, the first.  Besides, the Saudi family been making a list of those "with them", and those "against them" for years.....  I giggle with anticipation of the eventual "Night of the Long Knives, part duex".

We call the second an "ally" in the "Long War", and try to support it's "government" (the one calling itself the President, not the Intelligence agencies that do their own thing....).  Going into Pakistan might topple it's "government".

See.... never simple.

Offline WhiteHawk

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2007, 05:02:02 PM »
Do we think that an iranian/US war would turn out any different than the one we are in?

Offline RedTop

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« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2007, 05:46:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WhiteHawk
Do we think that an iranian/US war would turn out any different than the one we are in?


Hi WH,

Does it matter what we think?

We thought Iraq had WMD's....(me I think they did and ditched em)

Tons of politicians , some running for a VERY high office agreed , stated they agreed , made speeches that they agreed , now say they didn't mean it or were lied to or whatever other excuse they can come up with to make them seem right or deny ever saying anything. EVEN if you have it on record.

We as the American people don't have a say other than a vote. Thats it.

And what we "Think" means nothing. Cause in the end , we're just going to be told what they want us to think and believe. Media will report what goes along with thier particular agenda.

We can think what we like and what we percieve to be the truth....and all we can do is vote that way....mean while.....Washington , State and Local governments will continue to screw us all.

Still though....I can't think of anyplace I'd rather live.
Original Member and Former C.O. 71 sqd. RAF Eagles

Offline ramzey

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2007, 05:48:34 PM »
we should bomb Austria

Offline -tronski-

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Iran isn't involved
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2007, 05:56:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by babek-
Ok - Iran ist the bad guy.

That on 9/11 everywhre in iran there were demonstrations against the terroristic attack against the WTC - while the arabs were celebrating the attack could be ignored.

That Iran always fought against the sunnite Al Kaida and that the mprisoned Al Kaida members in Iran are allowed to be interrogated by international analysts could be ignored.

That Iran always fought against the Taliban could also be ignored.

Now the TV stations show that the bad bad iranians are delivering weapons to the shi ite iraquis.

But:

Why there are no reports that Saudi Arabia is the main financial supportor of Al Kaida and Taliban?

Why there are no reports that the pakistani secret police protects Mullah Omar - one of the most important leaders of the taliban. That in NW Pakistan the whole pashtuni region became the support centre for the Taliban who kill allied soldiers in SE-Afghanistan? That there are the main recruiting stations of the Taliban?

Its easy to blame Iran for this and that.

But to ignore the fact that so called US friends and allies like Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are the main supporters of Taliban and Al Kaida could result in very bad consequences.


Easy...

Saudi = good
Iran = bad
Pakistan = bad but co-operative so then good

 Tronsky
God created Arrakis to train the faithful