Bomb-crater size?

[frank3]

Are the craters of heavier bombs in fact larger?

[Denholm]

I'd have to think so. Back when I was only playing offline I expected the 4,000 lb bomb to make a larger explosion / crater than the 500 lb bombs I had loaded. I was disappointed to find out they didn't.

[frank3]

That's a shame really, I guess it shouldn't be too hard to model.
I mean, the impact craters of the vehicles are smaller too, so it IS possible to shrink 'em

[Denholm]

Very very true.

[VooWho]

How about we add a mushroom effect to the 4000Ib egg. That way we have a nuke for AH.

[Denholm]

Yeah, please the freaks who think they know WWII because they know the A-bomb was dropped on Hiroshima.

[Debonair]

nuke
is
band

[Denholm]

They think a nuke is interesting and is "elite". I would like a HYDRO BOMB!:t

[VooWho]

Originally posted by Denholm
They think a nuke is interesting and is "elite". I would like a HYDRO BOMB!:t

I'd Like to have an astroid the size of Texas.

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by frank3
Are the craters of heavier bombs in fact larger?

Depends on bomb fuzing.  A point-detonating fuze (sometimes referred to as "instantaneous) works to keep almost all of the blast and fragmentation effect above ground.  I've seen 500lb, 1000lb, and 2000lb bomb craters that are much smaller than you would think they should be.  A large portion of the dust you see in the air doesn't actually come out of the ground as much as its made up of dust from the area surrounding the crater in which the blast travels.  I can't remember exactly, but from my memory from a few years ago, a 500lb bomb made a crater approximately 2 to 4 feet around, and approximately 6-12 inches deep.  A 2000 lb bomb made a crater that was approx. 8-10 feet around, and a little over 1 foot deep.  These were unguided bombs delivered from around a 30 degree dive angle, carried by AV8's, F-18's, F-14's, F-16's, and A-10's.  I've not been up close and personal with craters made from bombs dropped from B-52's delivered from a flat profile.

If, on the other hand, a delay fuze is used, the bomb will actually penetrate into the ground before detonating, and will create a much larger crater.  I've never seen delay fuzes in action, so I don't have a point of reference on their size.  

I'll caveat this by saying that my experience is with current Mk80 series bombs, and not the bombs used in WWII.  I have no idea what type of fuzing was used on the 4,000lb Cookie dropped by the Lancs in WWII.
I've also seen pictures from the Vietnam era of the bombs dropped by B-52's that look like the craters are much larger than those I described above.  Again, I don't know what type of fuzing they were using back then, but ultimately, the time of detonation (either instantaneous or delayed) typically controls the depth and size of the crater.  The medium in which the crater is made also can effect the size, as hard, compact soil won't crater as badly as loose, less compact soil.

[Sketch]

Yes they get bigger when the bombs get bigger, especially a 4k egg.  But it also depends on what purpose the bomb itself.

General Purpose which about 50-percent of the bomb is explosive materials and weigh between 500 and 2,000 pounds do blast and fragmentation effects and the casing is about one half inch thick

Fragmentation which only roughly 10-20% of the bombs weight is explosive and the casing is scored so that it breaks into pieces.  THis of course causes the high speed frag which does the damage.

Penatrator's whcih have about 25-30% of the bombs weight is explosive and the forward end of the bomb is usually solid steel so it will not crush on impact, because if it did this it does not cause the correct effect for the blast.  Bunker busters/JDAM's (modern), which are usually a 2k egg can penatrate cement 7-9 feet thick.

One of the modern day bombs, a GBU-39 has only 50lbs of explosives and weighs only 250lbs has a blast radius of about 26ft in diameter, (compaired to a 2k bomb that makes a blast of about 80+ft), and makes this nice picture... yes that is steel reinforced concrete, six feet of it.


And like Stoney said it all depends on what type of fuze was being used.  If it was an air-burst, it will basically just flatten everything from the blast, frag and shockwave.  If it is a ground burst it moves alot of dirt and makes a nice size hole.  

I can't remember exactly, but from my memory from a few years ago, a 500lb bomb made a crater approximately 2 to 4 feet around, and approximately 6-12 inches deep. A 2000 lb bomb made a crater that was approx. 8-10 feet around, and a little over 1 foot deep.

If the above was the case... it must have been a dud...

Here is a video of a 500lb bomb dropped in Fallujah...
500lb
And another one... (about the 2 minute mark it hits)  Bye Building

Just my knowledge of working with them...

[RAIDER14]

Originally posted by VooWho
I'd Like to have an astroid the size of Texas.

I would counter your asteriod with Bruce Willis

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by Sketch
If the above was the case... it must have been a dud...

I'm not talking about the blast effect at the time of detonation, which is quite large as evidenced by your videos.  I'm talking about the crater that was left after the dust settled.  I've seen the craters left by 60mm, 81mm mortars and 155mm howitzer rounds.  I've watched all the TOW's, Hellfire, 2.75 inch and 5 inch rockets.  I've watched high-drag deliveries and the current version of napalm.  I watched numerous fixed wing attacks using live bombs of all varieties.  If it wasn't either a JDAM variant, cluster munition, or conventional bomb with a delay fuze, I've seen it leave an aircraft and hit a target or dirt.  I've even seen "dusters" or dud bombs and their impact points are less disturbed than you'd imagine.  I then had the advantage sometime later of actually walking down and looking at the effects.  I've stood on the edge of a Mk84 2000lb bomb crater.  Sometimes I even had to drive my rig down the dirt road which had been hit with bombs and usually it was just a quick bump under the tires.  The detonation is always spectacular, but the crater is not.  These were craters where typically the bomb hit flat terrain and the craters are much smaller than what you would think after witnessing the detonation, and pretty close to my dimensions posted earlier.  Wish I had taken some pictures...

Basically its a testament to the efficiency of the instaneous fuzes...

[frank3]

That's some interesting stuff guys, thanks for the replies

But I was actually referring to our AH bombs

[Sketch]

Originally posted by Stoney74
I'm not talking about the blast effect at the time of detonation, which is quite large as evidenced by your videos.  I'm talking about the crater that was left after the dust settled.  I've seen the craters left by 60mm, 81mm mortars and 155mm howitzer rounds.  I've watched all the TOW's, Hellfire, 2.75 inch and 5 inch rockets.  I've watched high-drag deliveries and the current version of napalm.  I watched numerous fixed wing attacks using live bombs of all varieties.  If it wasn't either a JDAM variant, cluster munition, or conventional bomb with a delay fuze, I've seen it leave an aircraft and hit a target or dirt.  I've even seen "dusters" or dud bombs and their impact points are less disturbed than you'd imagine.  I then had the advantage sometime later of actually walking down and looking at the effects.  I've stood on the edge of a Mk84 2000lb bomb crater.  Sometimes I even had to drive my rig down the dirt road which had been hit with bombs and usually it was just a quick bump under the tires.  The detonation is always spectacular, but the crater is not.  These were craters where typically the bomb hit flat terrain and the craters are much smaller than what you would think after witnessing the detonation, and pretty close to my dimensions posted earlier.  Wish I had taken some pictures...

Basically its a testament to the efficiency of the instaneous fuzes...

I am not saying your wrong Stoney, don't take it that way.  But, with a 500lb bomb, either modern time or AH, if it is a ground burst the hole will be bigger that a little speed bumb.  The only reason I say this is because I do work with these every day and know whet they are capable of doing.  If you work in something similar great and that is cool with me.  But like I said, if they are a ground burst, 500lbs of explosives will leave a nice hole.  

Frank, I know what yah ment bro, Stoney and I were posting what explosives with bombs will do.  From a 50kg egg too a 4,000lb egg, yes the crater holes will be a considerable amount larger and vary in size...