Author Topic: 3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran  (Read 1591 times)

Offline Rino

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #30 on: February 26, 2007, 12:13:38 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by VooWho
"Turkey will not repeat the mistake it made in 2003, when it refused to open its airspace to U.S. Air Force overflights en route to attacking Iraq."


Quick question on this. When Turkey said no and US bombers flew over, did the Turks send up there fighters and then get owned by U.S. fighters?
If I am wrong could someone tell me what mistake they did? I forget.


      I think it was more in the manner of finding new folks to send aid to.
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Offline Thrawn

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #31 on: February 26, 2007, 12:25:42 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Rino
I think it was more in the manner of finding new folks to send aid to.


Hardly.  The US didn't have a trade deficit with Turkey until after 2002.  If anything, the US government might have threatened to dump even more US dollars on Turkey.

http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c4890.html

Offline bozon

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #32 on: February 26, 2007, 12:35:08 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by LePaul
Israel took delivery of new F-16I's (conformal fuel tanks) in the last few years.  I'd think they are well within range to hit Iran if needed to.

Not really.

The whole Israeli strike on Iran is complete BS, spread either by ignorants or worse - people with an agenda trying to stir things up. Israel has no ability to execute an effective bombing campaign over Iran. One surgical strike, yes, by stretching the planes and pilots ability to the max it is possible. Unlike the old Iraqi example, this time it will not be effective. Unless the only purpose is to drag the conflict away from the no good UN and make it an all out war, which America will fight by the way - not Israel.

If anyone has any real ability to strike Iran it is the US with its forces in Saudi Arabia and Iraq (and the carrier force). Wishing that Israel will do the strike is asking for someone else to take out the trash. It will be perfect for the Europeans though, so they can keep their conscience clean and get to condemn Israel again.

I hate those retard "journalists" that keep feeding this troll. It is dangerous and stupid.
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Offline bozon

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #33 on: February 26, 2007, 12:55:47 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Anyway the point of the entire article was that it said . and I will try and quote as exactly as I canremember "It should be the goal of all American Jews to one day immigrate to Isreal"

Now it wasnt talking about just visiting Isreal. But in moving there outright.
Just curious how your average Isreali would feel about that.

Woudl they be wanted or even welcomed? Or is it more like
"We appreciate your good intentions. but please,stay where you are"?

The entire Zionist idea is based on two things: A Jew is nationality and Jews need a state (and regardless of the "Zion" in the name, the location is of less importance). The immigration to Israel is one of the highest ideals of the Zionist movement.

Therefore, a Jew that chooses to leave abroad is not a Zionist. Other ideologies consider this as "putting all the eggs in one basket" and a danger to Jewish survival btw. Some religious groups consider the Israeli state as a sin and refuse to deal with it. A lot of non-Israeli Jews support the state, not out of "Zionism" but more out of personal interests or just sympathy. This is the source of what you stated:
Quote
Whereas American Jews are all about being Jewish. Israeli Jews are more about being Israeli. If yanno what I mean.

If you are a Zionist that a Jew is a nationality for you. If you are not (as the American Jews) then a Jew is a religion for you.

Israel encourage Jewish immigration by giving significant social and economic aid to the immigrants. In the past it was related to the Zionist ideology that all Jews should live in Israel, but today it is more of a need to sustain the Jewish majority vs. the rapidly multiplying Palestinians. The "diaspora" sources for immigration are pretty much depleted after the Russian immigration in the 90s and many call for a revision of the out-dated immigration laws.
Mosquito VI - twice the spitfire, four times the ENY.

Click!>> "So, you want to fly the wooden wonder" - <<click!
the almost incomplete and not entirely inaccurate guide to the AH Mosquito.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGOWswdzGQs

Offline mora

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #34 on: February 26, 2007, 01:29:13 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Slash27
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/question/planes/q0077.shtml

http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_212.shtml

Yes. Pretty ridiculous to think that they could build nuclear weapons, and at the same time couldn't keep a few aircraft operational. Takes a lot more to build a nuke than to reverse engineer and manufacture aircraft parts.

Offline Slash27

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #35 on: February 26, 2007, 03:07:50 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by mora
Yes. Pretty ridiculous to think that they could build nuclear weapons, and at the same time couldn't keep a few aircraft operational. Takes a lot more to build a nuke than to reverse engineer and manufacture aircraft parts.



Why build when you can buy?:D

Offline AWMac

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #36 on: February 26, 2007, 04:31:06 PM »
I think bikini clad tight body Israeli women on the beach holding Uzi's are HOT!!!

:p

Mac

Offline Squire

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #37 on: February 26, 2007, 07:07:27 PM »
Agree with the jist of your post Bozon, but I think it is important for the Israelis to remind Iran of two facts:

#1 Their AF is capable or reaching Iran.

#2 They have nuclear weapons.

Just for deterrence purposes. In case the Iranians are getting too deluded into thinking the IAF could not arrive if the need was there.

A conventional IAF attack would not likely be a scenario they would contemplate though, I agree, for all the reasons stated in other posts.
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Offline VooWho

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #38 on: February 26, 2007, 07:30:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by AWMac
I think bikini clad tight body Israeli women on the beach holding Uzi's are HOT!!!

:p

Mac


Could you post a pic please? :aok
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Offline Grendel

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #39 on: February 27, 2007, 10:53:13 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Slash27
I always heard they were sold with some secret "black box" and were rendered useless when the wackos took over.:D

I ran across a magazine not long ago that went in to alot of detail on Iranian F-14s and their development there. Was very intresting and an eye opener, yet I didnt buy it.:huh


Pfffft. A lot of misinformation about the Iranian F-14s. The F-14s were never grounded and the sabotage by American engineers was limited to just 18 AIM-54 missiled, in one base only, and those damaged were repaired.

The latest research gives the Iranian F-14s over one hundred kills over the Iraqi Air Force

"It is estimated that during the Iran-Iraq war 1980-1988, from reports from pilots on both sides, guncamera/TISEO films, examination of wreckage, local and foreign intelligence and other sources, that on total the IRIAF F-14As scored 130 confirmed and 23 probable aerial victories. Iran launched possibly 70 to 90 AIM-54A missiles, and 60-70 of those scored. "

Some examples of Iranian F-14s in combat:

* The first aerial victory by an F-14 happened on September 7, 1980. Five Iraqi Mil Mi-24|Mi-25 'Hind' attack helicopters of 1st Combat Transport Hecopter Squaron attacked Iranian border posts in the Zain al-Waws region. Two F-14As were vectored into intercept. The pilot shot down one Mi-25 helicopter by cannonfire, after two Sidewinder missiles failed to hit the helicopter.
* The first combat use of AIM-54 missile by an F-14 ever happened on September 13, 1980, when Major Ata'ie shot down an Iraqi Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-23|MiG-23 'Flogger' with a Phoenix missile.
* On September 22 1980 Iranian F-14s were vectored against fast moving contact, approaching Khark oil terminals at Mach 3. The MiG-25 was shot down by an AIM-54. This was the first confirmed kill by F-14 against MiG-25s.  
* On same day, another MiG-25RB was shot down on extremely hard conditions. The MiG-25 was approaching fast and was already within 113 km, yet the F-14 RIO was unable to acquire the target. A positive lock on was made on distance of only 70 km, almost inside the minimum range . A single AIM-54 was launched in snap-up engagement mode at 64 km. The missile worked perfectly and the MiG was downed.  
* On September 22 two Iranian F-14A led by Capt. Ali Azimi detected two MiG-23s escorting a Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21|MiG-21RF 'Fishbed-J'. The Tomcats shot down the MiG-21 with an AIM-54.
* On September 24 the Iranian F-14As participated in several aerial combats against Iraqi fighter jets. The F-14s claimed kills against Iraqi MiG-21s, MiG-23s and Sukhoi Su-17|Su-20/22 'Fitter's.
* On 2nd December 1980 one of the closest range shootdowns by AIM-54 occurred. Captain F. Dehghan of 8nd TFS was flying on patrol covering Khark Island oil teminals, when number of approaching bogies were detected. Lock-on was attained only from a distance of 10 miles, too close to the minimum range of the missile. The F-14 had to use the Phoenix, though, as otherwise the plane would have been too heavy for dogfighting. The Phoenix was launched on short-range mode and it managed to hit a MiG-21.  
* At 20th November 1982 two Iraqi generals boarded a Mi-8 helicopter to visit the front lines. The Mi-8 was escorted by two other Mi-8s, Mi-25, four MiG-21s and four MiG-23s, that were replaced by additional fighters when they ran low on fuel. The formation was spotted by two Iranian Tomcats escorting IRIAF KC-707 tanker, which was waiting for Iranian F-4 strike to refuel. The F-14s were flying race-track pattern, scanning over the front line with their AWG-9 radar. Captain Khosrodad spotted a large number of targets approaching slowly from west, already within AIM-54 range. Khosrodad ordered his wingman to keep with the tanker and attacked, first firing two AIM-54s, then two AIM-7E-4s some 10 seconds later. According to Iraqi reports, one MiG-21 and two MiG-23s were shot down within a minute, forcing the Iraqi generals to abandon their mission.  
* On 20th February 1987 an F-4 lured Iraqi strike force into a trap, which was snapped by two F-14s of 81st TFS. A AIM-54 was launched at very long range, hitting the lead Mirage flown by IrAF Brig. General Hekmat Abdul-Qadr. The Iranian listening posts recorded the leader of the accompanying Su-22 flight scream" F-Arba-Ashara! Yalla! Yalla!", with the seven remaining fighters turning and feeing. In English the leader had called "F-14! Run! Run!"  
* During late 1987 Soviet Union supplied Iraq with MiG-25BM "Wild Weasel" aircraft. The planes tested the ECM systems against Iranian Tomcats and attacked Iranian targets with new anti-radar weapons. The MiG-25BMs proved they could operate with impunity at up to 69 000 ft, until on the night of 11th November a MiG-25BM was intercepted by an F-14. The Tomcat fired a single AIM-54 in Home-On-Mode. The missile guided flawlessly but failed to detonate. Yet, the missile clipped the MiG-25's fin and forced the pilot to bail out.  
* During March 1988 Iraq launched a major attack against Iranian oil exports. On 19th March, at 0100, the first wave of Iraqi Tu-22B heavy bombers and Mirages, attacked Khark island and the tankers. Half an hour later second wave arrived without losses. The Iranian F-14s had arrived on scene for the third wave, though. The US Navy warships patrolling on the area recorded several AIM-54 launches, with at least one Tu-22B bomber and a MiG-25RB being destroyed. According to US Navy, it is probable that other Iraqi bombers were shot down as well.  
* During the ending phase of Iran-Iraq war a mini war developed between the Iraqi Mirane F1 EQ-5/6 units and the Iranian F-14s between February until July 1988. The F1 pilots hunted the Tomcats aggressively and attacked the Iranians at any occasion. The F1EQ-6s were equipped with good EMC systems, and the Iraqi pilots could deny the F-14s from using their AIM-54 missiles. For example on 19th July 1988 four Mirages attacked two F-14s and downed both, suffering no losses.

Also important piece of information is that the famous Israeli attack against Iraqi nuclear reactor was made with Iranian intelligence. IriAF had already made two previous attacks at the reactor site and supplied Israelis with targeting information, recon photos and all the intelligence Israelis needed to have on their attack.
« Last Edit: February 27, 2007, 10:56:40 AM by Grendel »

Offline 1K3

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #40 on: February 27, 2007, 11:23:55 AM »
That's a very interesting history of the Persian Cats:aok

Offline babek-

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #41 on: February 27, 2007, 11:43:17 AM »
Also the F-14-pilot with the most air-to-air-kills is not an american but an iranian.

The iranian F-14 pilot Zandi shot down 9 (according US-analysis) to 12 (according iranian sources) iraqi planes.

He survived the 8 year war against the arabs and died later in an accident in Iran.

Offline Ripsnort

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #42 on: February 27, 2007, 11:58:25 AM »
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Originally posted by babek-
Also the F-14-pilot with the most air-to-air-kills is not an american but an iranian.

The iranian F-14 pilot Zandi shot down 9 (according US-analysis) to 12 (according iranian sources) iraqi planes.

He survived the 8 year war against the arabs and died later in an accident in Iran.

Only because of more "targets of opportunity". ;)

Offline babek-

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #43 on: February 27, 2007, 12:44:08 PM »
Yes - and because he fought 8 long years while US pilots are taken out earlier from combat.

He was a true iranian hero - he didnt liked the mullahs but fought bitterly against the arab invaders. Often he had problems with his superiors because of his anti-mullah position.

May he RIP.

Offline ~Caligula~

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3 Gulf states agree to IAF overflights en route to Iran
« Reply #44 on: February 27, 2007, 03:40:27 PM »
us israelis don`t like the mullahs either.
would that mean we have something in common?