Vermont Votes to Impeach Bush/Cheney

[oboe]

Interesting development in the Green Mountain state.   Not sure that 36 towns constitutes speaking for the whole state, but it is sort of surprising.  How about those Vermonters?    

Vermont Votes to Impeach

This is from the resolution passed by Middlebury:

We the people have the power -- and the responsibility -- to remove executives who transgress not just the law, but the rule of law.

The oaths that the President and Vice President take binds them to "preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States." The failure to do so forms a sound basis for articles of impeachment.

The President and Vice President have failed to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution" in the following ways:

1. They have manipulated intelligence and misled the country to justify an immoral, unjust, and unnecessary preemptive war in Iraq.

2. They have directed the government to engage in domestic spying without warrants, in direct contravention of U.S. law.

3. They have conspired to commit the torture of prisoners, in violation of the Federal Torture Act and the Geneva Convention.

4. They have ordered the indefinite detention without legal counsel, without charges and without the opportunity to appear before a civil judicial officer to challenge the detention -- all in violation of U.S. law and the Bill of Rights.

When strong evidence exists of the most serious crimes, we must use impeachment -- or lose the ability of the legislative branch to compel the executive branch to obey the law.

I think proving #1 may be problematic, I think #2 is completely true and even admitted by the administration, numbers #3 and 4 are also true but the passage of the Military Commissions Act made these practices legal under U.S. law, and gave retroactive protections to persons involved in the practices while it was illegal.    I notice #4 doesn't say in particular WHO was being detained, though I think in fact it is both US citizens and non-citizens.

Am I off base?   Is it gonna go anywhere?

[Chairboy]

The problem is with #1, it's an inherently subjective statement and weakens the rest of the message.  Argumentum ad captandum (basically, playing to the crowd) is flashy, but has no inertia.

[lasersailor184]

Those who go to town meetings have politics on their minds.


It means nothing until there is a general vote of the public.

[john9001]

how can a province of Canada impeach a american president?

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by john9001
how can a province of Canada impeach a american president?

[storch]

Originally posted by john9001
how can a province of Canada impeach a american president?

[Yeager]

americans do love their politics

[Holden McGroin]

I'll have to read the constitution once again, but as I remember it the US House of Representatives is the body that writes the Articles of Impeachment and then passes it on to the Senate for trial.

So as I see it, a state which passes articles of impeachment based on unconstitutional behavior of the executive is itself practicing unconstitutional behavior.  

Looks like they are true blue constitutionalists.

[Furious]

did you read the article?  

seems to me that they know that all they are doing is trying to force their elected officials hands.

from the article:
"...Organizers of the grassroots drive to get town meetings to back impeachment resolutions hope that the overwhelming support the initiative has received will convince Welch to introduce articles of impeachment against Bush and Cheney...."

[Holden McGroin]

By the time any impeachment came around the election cycle would be in full swing and half the senate would be running for president, one third will be running for re-election, and all of the house will be up for renewal.

I read the article, they are wasting their time.

[Bodhi]

I was born and raised in Vermont.  36 towns do not speak for the state.

Unfortunately, too many liberals have moved into the state and they hold the rest of the true nonflatlanders hostage by numbers.

It is the same with allowing homos to marry.  Now, it is doing nothing but clogging the courts as people seek to have their novelty civil unions dissolved.

[Flatbar]

Originally posted by Bodhi


Unfortunately, too many liberals have moved into the state and they hold the rest of the true nonflatlanders hostage by numbers.

 

The way I see it, it's because of this republican administration that we are the majority now and our numbers are growing every day that GWB is in power and through some real oversight, his antics are comming to light and that's helping the fence sitters make their decision.

IMO.

[Bodhi]

you can believe all you want that you are the majority.  Fortunately you are not.  The big issue that is causing so many to support the liberal manifesto is that the news they hear and see is so biased and full of outright lies, that they are unfortunately led down the wrong path.

It will all change when the liberals roll back our security and military down to a point that the terrorists attack us in the US again.  Then, everyone will hopefully really see the liberals and their manifesto for what they truly are... idiotic.

[Kieran]

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
By the time any impeachment came around the election cycle would be in full swing and half the senate would be running for president, one third will be running for re-election, and all of the house will be up for renewal.

I read the article, they are wasting their time.

This is exactly as I see it. No way it could run its cycle in time to matter, making it a monumental waste of money. More than that, it would put the conservative base in defensive mode, and they would turn out in droves during election- not exactly a winning formula for the liberal side. No, too much risk to go for it.

Of course, it would be refreshing to see the libs go for it if they truly believe they have a case- you know, stand on principle whatever the cost. Who knows, I might even support them. It'd just be so... different... for politicians to put the people and country first.

[AquaShrimp]

Originally posted by Bodhi
you can believe all you want that you are the majority.  Fortunately you are not.  The big issue that is causing so many to support the liberal manifesto is that the news they hear and see is so biased and full of outright lies, that they are unfortunately led down the wrong path.

It will all change when the liberals roll back our security and military down to a point that the terrorists attack us in the US again.  Then, everyone will hopefully really see the liberals and their manifesto for what they truly are... idiotic.

You need to either move to another country or at least move to the deserted countryside.  It seems like you are living in a constant state of delusional fear.  

The big thing in the U.S. is (brace yourself) FREEDOM.  No one wants an American version of the KGB or Gestapo running wild.  

Our enemies catch us by surprise about once every 50 years, no matter what party is in office.  But then again, the U.S. has always been a reactive country, a sleeping giant if you will.  That is what allows us to have our freedoms and liberties.  

So as soon as you say the word, I'll start a collection here in the o'club to buy you a ticket to the most locked-down, liberty-less, high security country of your choosing.  Maybe you will feel safe there.