Buffs vs. CVs need to be nerfed

[moot]

Nilsen, NOE runs are fun.  It would throw out the baby with the bath water.. until there is no doubt that what you suggest is the only choice, we shouldn't just nerf things like that.
Sort of like the HO defense cone in AW or WB, or whatever game it was.
Skip bombing would not work either, with such a nerf.

Originally posted by Bruv119
Frosty usually porking the ord before the enemy know its there does the trick.

That won't make sense to some people who just want to furball.  They want to have their furball, but not work for it.

[frosty]

Hornet, if realism is what we're talking about, well, buffs never, EVER attacked CVs in WW2.

Game balance is what matters.

1 person in a flying barcalounger being able to destroy what amounts to a an entire field in a single run is retarded.

[Tilt]

I see no need to harden CV's any more..........just make bombing less accurate............

As soft as WWII CV's were how many were hit by formations of level bombers?

[frosty]

I should add that buffs will always be able to bomb CVs in game.  No way around that.  

Take away the laser precision of the bombs and that would likely solve the problem.

I don't get why so many buff fans defend the realism of their bombing CVs when they have what amounts to laser precision bomb sites and ordinance that falls 100% predictably, on top of being able to fly 3 planes with 1 pilot.

So yes, perhaps a buff COULD destroy a CV in real life, but it would have to be insanely lucky.  The bombs just were not that accurate.  Most of them would land in the ocean from any sane altitude.

[Hornet33]

Originally posted by frosty
Hornet, if realism is what we're talking about, well, buffs never, EVER attacked CVs in WW2.

Game balance is what matters.

1 person in a flying barcalounger being able to destroy what amounts to a an entire field in a single run is retarded.

Well if that's the case then why do we have spitfires fighting P-51's and Bf109's fighting Fw190's??? You seem to be saying that level bombers shouldn't be allowed to bomb a CV. If that's the case then any aircraft from the same real country shouldn't be allowed to attack each other either. No more P-38's shooting down B-17's or spits mixing it up in a furball. That NEVER happened either in real life.

This game allows for allot of "what ifs" and level bombers hitting CV's is just one more excample of that.

The fact is the CV's in the game are harder to kill than what real life tells us they were. It doesn't matter that no CV was ever attacked by level bombers, that's not the point.

What's retarded is the guy who lets the CV get bombed by the single guy in the barcalounger. Turn the thing so it doesn't get hit, don't bring it in range of the shore batteries, provide an extended CAP, and pork the ords at the nearby bases.

Do something stupid with a CV and it will be killed. Use it smart and it'll be around for awhile.

[Warchief]

Here we go with another I HATE BOMBER THREADS!!!!!

1) As previously stated TURN THE CV!!!

2) The Auto ACK on a CV is already enough what more do you want. How much footage can be seen from WWII of Torp PLanes making successful runs on CV's!!! This is because ACK wasnt as accurate.

3) Due to High number of ord needed to kill a CV Bombers are your best bet.

4) IN real life or any game with CV realism a single SBD Dive Bomber can cripple any CV.

Now if you want to make bombing a CV harder then how about you turn off auto ack and you can bombing a CV with buffs Harder. You will see more Torp Runs and Dive Bombing Runs. But wait that will lead to complaints about CV's being able to be sunk by Torp PLanes wityh ease.

So leave it as is. It is much better for those on the CV's then already needs to be. By the way numerous bombers in RL in WWII did do some dive bombing. Think before you speak!!! Things could be alot worse!!!

[Easyscor]

These anti-bomber threads are way out of hand, they’ve gotten really old.

“Take away the formations,:cry  nerf the guns,:cry  go back to manual calibration,:cry  toss in more drop error,:cry  add wind,:cry  harden CVs,:cry  stop fighter bombers from dive bombing. ”

Add your wind, I love wind! Make it 35 mph if you like but start it a ZERO elevation.  Make everyone learn to deal with it on take off and landing the way it should be. Hate the laser gunsights on the bombers, learn not to cry about it until you figure out where their convergence point is and learn not to fly there any more once you do.  Bring back the manual calibration, I liked it before and the very guys sinking your CVs will still be able to do it even if you harden the ships.  Oh and btw, two or three guys in 110s can sink a CV in one pass using only cannon but you probably didn’t know that but now that you’re aware of it, you’d better nerf the 110s too, right?

The only thing it takes to protect your CV from a single formation of bombers boys and girls, is a skipper willing to watch after it and turn it at the right time when the bombers fly in. Enough of this silliness.

[xREAPERx]

Originally posted by FALCONWING
CVs are kind of silly imho...what major air to air battle ever occurred off a cv?  and what CV ever captured a land target???.

                                                                                                                                                    many

[hubsonfire]

Wind doesn't work because it's an advantage to one country (or 2) and a constant disadvantage to the other (or 2). Hardening CVs doesn't work, because then the only way to sink a CV is even more bombers. The torp thing doesn't work, because then if the horde country porks ord, the other country doesn't have any way to sink it.

I'd say maybe HT could give us real flak, instead of the magic box of fighter doom. Maybe a proper sight or radar or something to help aim it, have both AI and mannable, more ack guns, etc.

I know certain wellknown buff types have great success at sinking CVs, and I've been able to sink a CV or cruiser in a single pass at low alt, and make it through the flak alive. It really is quite simple to do, and it's very difficult to prevent.

Aside from the flak (which after 7 years, I'm not thinking HT plans to fix ), the only feasible solution is removing the formations until such time as bombing can be made realistic. However, HT hasn't expressed any interest in changing bombing, or removing uberforms either, so it's probably going to be like this until HTC closes it's doors.

Sad, but it's only cartoon ships. You get new ones after a few minutes.

[715]

Solution: increase the angular dispersion of falling bombs.  

I had never flown buffs, never bombed, had no clue about the calibration, hadn't even mapped the key for calibration.  Yet I took up some Lancs, followed the onscreen directions, and was able to place all of my bombs on target from 20K+ within a dispersion measured in a few feet.  That is some special aerodynamics to fall within a few feet from 20,000 ft.

No wonder that the appearance of high alt buffs means the CV has a 99% chance of going down.  The only way bombing could be made easier were if it only entailed clicking on a map of things you want to blow up.

PS:

The Auto ACK on a CV is already enough what more do you want

 I've never understood most peoples opinion of the auto puffy ack.  In many many years of playing, I have never seen it hit anything at all.  Manned ack yes, auto puffy ack, essentially never.  So I guess to a buff driver, an auto ack that never hits him is perfectly modeled

[toadkill]

yeah. why waste time changing stuff that works fine? why spend time argueing about worthless whines? (o wait. its fun )

Anyway. last night my squad made a concerted effort to defend a stolen cv after we took an enemy port. We defended that cv for at least an hour and a half against some established pilots. With about 8 coordinated pilots we provided mid-high level CAP, along with turning the cv out from under bombs at least 3 times when the CAP couldnot hold off teh attackers.

what im saying is thise whole thread is a waste of bandwidth.

(And i dont want cvs hardened, because i like sinking cvs with my Ki67s. escpecially when i hit 5 in one scenario frame )

[Xasthur]

Originally posted by Warchief
1) As previously stated TURN THE CV!!!

This won't work with any stick with more than an hour of experience in buffs.

A turning cv provides no challenge for most, all one needs to do is just adjust the direction of your bomb-lead.

Of the few CVs i've bothered to bomb (always level bombed), turning never impacted my accuracy severely.

I always fly JU-88s or Ar-234s for CV attacks too, so it's not like i'm lobbing 4000 pound 'nooks' at it either.

[toadkill]

Originally posted by Xasthur
This won't work with any stick with more than an hour of experience in buffs.

A turning cv provides no challenge for most, all one needs to do is just adjust the direction of your bomb-lead.

Originally posted by Toadkill
Anyway. last night my squad made a concerted effort to defend a stolen cv after we took an enemy port. We defended that cv for at least an hour and a half against some established pilots. With about 8 coordinated pilots we provided mid-high level CAP, along with turning the cv out from under bombs at least 3 times when the CAP couldnot hold off teh attackers.

[Tango]

The easy fix would be to not bring the CVs next to the enemy AF. Thats what gets them killed faster than anything else.

[E25280]

Originally posted by frosty
Hornet, if realism is what we're talking about, well, buffs never, EVER attacked CVs in WW2.

Just FYI, this is not true.  B-17s bombed the Japanese fleet at the battle of Midway.  They claimed several hits, but what they probably saw was the destroyers attempting to form a smoke screen.  Although none of the bombs hit, the attack had the fleet turning in circles for a bit trying to avoid the bombs.

Proof.