F-4 Phantom II

[zorstorer]

Originally posted by Serenity
....I might just get some sleep tonight...

Just get a girlfriend!!

[Serenity]

Originally posted by zorstorer
Just get a girlfriend!!

Had one. Still didnt get any sleep At least this doesnt b*tch at me. Wait. Nevermind, I forgot about furball and Bronk.

[Viking]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
1965
YF12A Interceptor (interceptor version of the SR-71)
Absolute Altitude: 80,257.86 ft (24,390 meters)... YF-12A # 60-6934

Absolute Speed Over a Straight Course: 2,070.101 mph...YF-12A #60-6936

Absolute Speed Over a 500km Closed Course: 1,688.889 mph...YF-12A #60-6936

Absolute Speed Over a 1,000km Closed Course: 1,643.041 mph... YF-12A #60-6936

September 01, 1974
SR-71A #61-17972
New York to London (World Record-Speed Over a Recognized Course): Distance: 3,461.53 statute miles...Time: 1hr 54 min 56.4 secs. Average Speed 1,806.95 statute mph.  

September 13, 1974
SR-71A #61-17972
London to Los Angeles (World Record-Speed Over a Recognized Course): Distance: 5,446.87 statute miles...Time: 3hrs 47min 39secs. Average Speed: 1,435.59 mph

March 06, 1990
SR-71A #61-17972
West Coast to East Coast of USA (National Record-Speed Over a Recognized Course): Coast to Coast Distance: 2,404.05 statute miles...Time: 1 hr 07 min 53.69 secs...Average Speed: 2,124.51 mph

Los Angeles To Washington D.C. (World Record): Distance: 2,299.67 statute miles...Time: 1 hr 04 min 19.89 secs...Average Speed: 2,144.83 mph

St Louis To Cincinnati (World Record): Distance: 311.44 statute miles...Time: 8 mins 31.97 secs...Average Speed: 2,189.94 mph

Kansas City To Washington D.C. (World Record): Distance: 942.08 statute miles...Time: 25 mins 58.53 secs...Average Speed: 2176.08 mph

On November 20, 1965 an A-12 Blackbird exceeded Mach 3.2 and a sustained altitude of 90,000 feet. A stripped down, highly modified Soviet Mig-25 did break some of the Blackbirds records, however the SR-71 regained those records in July, 1976.

The 1989 Guinness Book states that a record airspeed of 2,193.167 mph (980 m/s) was achieved by a Lockheed SR-71-A

The SR-71 "Blackbird" holds the official Air Speed Record for a manned airbreathing jet aircraft with a speed of 3,529.56 km/h (2,188 mph). It was capable of taking off and landing unassisted on conventional runways. The record was set on 28 July 1976 by Eldon W. Joersz near Beale Air Force Base


ack-ack

Thanks, so I guess the SR-71 still holds the speed records.

[Viking]

Originally posted by Krusty
I think the Mig31 Foxbat was way faster than the Mig25. It was the Mach2.5 intercepter. Short duration but high speed.

No the 31 is a redesigned two-seat 25 derivative, re-engined with turbo-fans for cruising and loitering. The MiG-25(R) is a mach 3.2 capable (clean) plane while the 31 is mach 2.8 capable (clean).

[AWwrgwy]

Originally posted by Serenity
Had one. Still didnt get any sleep

Hmmmm.....You stud you(?)


Anyway, I present you Chico....



linky


wrngway

[Ball]

Originally posted by Serenity
Had one. Still didnt get any sleep At least this doesnt b*tch at me. Wait. Nevermind, I forgot about furball and Bronk.

[Angus]

How about SL speeds? Wasn't the Tornado supposed to be a swift one down there?
Then there is one quite fast aircraft, - the BAC Lightning. Know a former wingco who flew it, - said it was a delight and a stellar performer.
(with the naughty habit of catching fire between the engines if I recall right)

[Charge]

Note that the top speed was achieved without wing slats. The slatted models were quite a bit slower but the slats were considered such an improvement over the unslatted one that many export versions had them, too.

One of the undesired handling quality discovered during Vietnam era was the unwanted tightening of turn when the a/c decelerated in turn. The elevators sudddenly started to bite into the airstream and the turn could tighten so much that the wing could not handle it anymore and that resulted in an accelerated stall. The wing slats improved the  handling and these "spectacular departures" pretty much ended.

-C+

[StuB]

The F-4 was originally designed as an INTERCEPTOR, not a dogfighter.  This is why it did not come equipped with an internal gun.

My father flew F-4 C's, D's and E's in SEA in 1971-72.  
Most of his missions were air to ground (which he had alot of previous experience with from flying B-57's during a previous SEA tour in 1965-66).

According to him,  most of the time he carried conventional bombs and Zuni rocket pods....but sometimes he carried daisy cutters, LGB's and gun pods.  The max number of bombs would depend on the type of bomb (500, 1000 and 2000 lbs .....which were dictated by the mission) carried as well as the air temp/humidity and tanker availability.

He says that the Phantom used fuel like nothing else.  Because of the heat and humidity they would have to use afterburner during just about every takeoff and it was still hard to get airborne.  They would then climb out and hook up with a tanker, refuel, and then run the mission route.  After dropping ordinance they would roundezvous with another tanker and refuel before heading back to their base in Thailand.

Of the few Mig CAPS he flew, he said that on one, a missle flew between him and his wingman.  After a little bit of frantic looking around they saw what looked like a Mig 19 nearby.  The started trying to get on it and as they got close to firing off a missle they were told it was a Navy A-7 so they broke it off.  The Migs were attacking the other element of the CAP flight at the same time and one of his good friends was shot down and KIA.
To this day, it still bugs him....was that really a Navy A-7 or was it one of the migs that shot down his buddy?  They never got close enough to visual ID it, so he'll never know.

Originally posted by Serenity

Next, weapons. Since the F-4 was designed as a fighter, Ive got a lot of sources for A2A weapons loadouts, but remarcably even with google I can find next to nothing about bombs! So, what was the maximum NUMBER OF BOMBS (NOT maximum WEIGHT of ordenance, because a classic example, the B-17 could carry a lot more WEIGHT but due to the physical dimensions of the bombs, it only carried a limited number) the F-4 carried WHILE carrying external fuel and Sidewinders? Without external fuel? And how were the bombs mounted?
[/B]

[Serenity]

Originally posted by StuB
The F-4 was originally designed as an INTERCEPTOR, not a dogfighter.  This is why it did not come equipped with an internal gun.

My father flew F-4 C's, D's and E's in SEA in 1971-72.  
Most of his missions were air to ground (which he had alot of previous experience with from flying B-57's during a previous SEA tour in 1965-66).

According to him,  most of the time he carried conventional bombs and Zuni rocket pods....but sometimes he carried daisy cutters, LGB's and gun pods.  The max number of bombs would depend on the type of bomb (500, 1000 and 2000 lbs .....which were dictated by the mission) carried as well as the air temp/humidity and tanker availability.

He says that the Phantom used fuel like nothing else.  Because of the heat and humidity they would have to use afterburner during just about every takeoff and it was still hard to get airborne.  They would then climb out and hook up with a tanker, refuel, and then run the mission route.  After dropping ordinance they would roundezvous with another tanker and refuel before heading back to their base in Thailand.

Of the few Mig CAPS he flew, he said that on one, a missle flew between him and his wingman.  After a little bit of frantic looking around they saw what looked like a Mig 19 nearby.  The started trying to get on it and as they got close to firing off a missle they were told it was a Navy A-7 so they broke it off.  The Migs were attacking the other element of the CAP flight at the same time and one of his good friends was shot down and KIA.
To this day, it still bugs him....was that really a Navy A-7 or was it one of the migs that shot down his buddy?  They never got close enough to visual ID it, so he'll never know.

Yeah, when I said fighter, I meant as opposed to a bomber. Its a fleet interceptor, and the dogfighter was the Corsair II. The question that really bugs me is the time the fuel lasts. Thanks for all this information, and is there any way you could ask him about how long his fuel lasted? In all my searching, all fuel information is listed in liters/gallons carried, and number of miles. But I know as you increase power, you burn more fuel. AND range is fine and dandy, but since you dont have an odometer in a plane... Yeah. Basically any data on how many minutes the fuel lasted would be like christmas comming early!

[Serenity]

Originally posted by AWwrgwy
Hmmmm.....You stud you(?)


Anyway, I present you Chico....



linky


wrngway

Oh, and any idea what that little under-nose pod was for BEFORE the gun was added on the Echo? Is that radar?

[Rino]

Originally posted by AWwrgwy
Hmmmm.....You stud you(?)


Anyway, I present you Chico....



linky


wrngway

     That is a really odd weapons mix on that E model.  Cluster bombs and
2 extra pods..apparently he's going after ALOT of soft targets

[Serenity]

Originally posted by Rino
That is a really odd weapons mix on that E model.  Cluster bombs and
2 extra pods..apparently he's going after ALOT of soft targets

I hear that people are quite soft...

I dont think thats an E though, I dont see an opening for a gun below the nose. Thats probably a Delta. Just a guess though...

[Old Sport]

Originally posted by Serenity
I dont think thats an E though, I dont see an opening for a gun below the nose. Thats probably a Delta. Just a guess though...

It's an E, and the painting is signed by the pilot, so you'd think he might have noticed if Meyers misrepresented the cannon. In WWII guns were taped over. I suspect that the cannon had some cover to protect from FOD.

The D originally did not have the small radome anyway. Later D versions did.

Phantom II

The small radome of B's and N's was "called" the IR radome, but when I was in we never used it for IR. I think we once had a hop scheduled were the Com/NAV guys installed some ECM there. The rest of the time it was empty. That was from '76-'81.

Best regards

[Rino]

Originally posted by Serenity
I hear that people are quite soft...

I dont think thats an E though, I dont see an opening for a gun below the nose. Thats probably a Delta. Just a guess though...

     Definitely not a D..has the long nose so E or a G model
with the radar receiver under the nose.  As he calls it a gunfighter
I'm going with the E.  Btw we never used a cover over the gun shroud,
the gun barrels are actually well behind the end of the shroud.

     It's also a later model E because the original gun shrouds had a sharply
angled "receding chin line".  They had to modify the shroud because the
engines were injesting the gunpowder residue when firing.

     Just my opinion, but using twin 20mm pods on people is just plain silly.
It's been a long time, but I'm virtually certain the gunsight would be almost
useless with wing mounted guns.  It's been over 20 years, but I vaguely
remember that the air-ground mode of the LCOSS sight automatically
compensated 2 mils down for the relative position of the gun under the
nose.  There was no selection for left or right.

     Since both guns would have to be fired together to prevent yaw, you
are talking massive amounts of overkill for people potting.