Author Topic: High School 1973 vs 2006 (Read 1597 times)

Xargos · « **Reply #30 on:** April 05, 2007, 11:13:59 AM »

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/2/16/204756.shtml

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Public schools are run by the National Educational Association. They are not run by people you can hold accountable, such as teachers, superintendents and school boards. The NEA opposes merit pay, charter schools and any decision by any school administrator that has not been determined in advance by collective bargaining.

Simply put, the NEA opposes everything except its own power.

Torque · « **Reply #31 on:** April 05, 2007, 12:09:24 PM »

after two decades of appreciation, jack should of sold his house to a city dweller for ten times what he paid.

then jack should of moved to another part of the country that agreed with his lifestyle.

but, maybe jack just liked his cable modem porn too much.

silly jack.

rpm · « **Reply #32 on:** April 05, 2007, 12:27:52 PM »

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Originally posted by Maverick
Nope the mook just posts a b*tch about it.....

Ah, just wondering. That same e-mail gets posted about every 3 months in here.
Net result? Back then was roxxorz, now suxxorz. Shock and awe.

indy007 · « **Reply #33 on:** April 05, 2007, 02:28:07 PM »

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Originally posted by republic
That's the solution, give our children's future to the private sector...because we all know much big business cares for the lower and middle class.

Actually, it works, very well. You can compare and contrast Oakland vs Compton. Oakland allowed a voucher type system, where kids don't have to go to their neighborhood schools. Where the kid goes, his education dollars go with him.

Oakland schools added 91 AP classes in 1 year, compared to Compton's 2. Grades are up, kids have better chances of attending more advanced classes... while Compton high school now has only 6% of their male students that can read well (algebra... 1%).

Competition makes better products. If schools have to go head to head for funding, poorly functioning schools will fold up, and their students will be rolled into far better schools than they're in now.

I guess thats a bad thing because of CORPORATE GREED(*&!#@!

lazs2 · « **Reply #34 on:** April 05, 2007, 02:30:02 PM »

the teachers union cares a lot less about students than catholic schools do.

We just enrolled my grand daughter in a catholic school. the public schools are trash. The teachers are the highest paid part time workers in the nation and care more about their salary than the kids..

The cost for these trash public schools is about twice that of a catholic school per student and they get about 50% less results for the money.. Yet.. some would continue to allow the government to subsidise the teachers union by creating an education monopoly for them that is a classic case of everything that is bad about monopolies.

I think that republic has not given the thing much thought... he acts as if to have choice is evil... that only the public school is to be trusted and will do a good job (in spite of every example to the contrary) but.. say he is right.. say you get your voucher and go to a private school and then decide it is doing a bad job...

You can always just take your voucher money and use it in the peoples republic of public schools again. If public schools are so great they should really shine eh?

As it is... if you don't like public schools.. republic would have you just like it or lump it.

how bout a little choice and we will make up our own minds about our own kids education? I could sure use a voucher to help get my grand daughter through school but...

I will do it regardless and.. she will be vastly better educated than not only the republics of the world but the poor bastards who can't afford to pay taxes and put their kids in a decent school.. republic and his ilk are all about screwing the kids and their parents.

lazs

republic · « **Reply #35 on:** April 05, 2007, 02:37:23 PM »

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Originally posted by indy007
Actually, it works, very well. You can compare and contrast Oakland vs Compton. Oakland allowed a voucher type system, where kids don't have to go to their neighborhood schools. Where the kid goes, his education dollars go with him.

Oakland schools added 91 AP classes in 1 year, compared to Compton's 2. Grades are up, kids have better chances of attending more advanced classes... while Compton high school now has only 6% of their male students that can read well (algebra... 1%).

Competition makes better products. If schools have to go head to head for funding, poorly functioning schools will fold up, and their students will be rolled into far better schools than they're in now.

I guess thats a bad thing because of CORPORATE GREED(*&!#@!

In a large metropolitan area where there are several choices in public and private schools, vouchers may be a good alternative...but in the smaller 2A and below rural schools...vouchers do nothing...it is simply a buzzword and "quick fix" to a problem that is widespread and endemic to our society as a whole... Something we can hear on the news and feel good about...so we can find out more about Anna Nicole...

The education system is foundering...but it has nothing to do with funds...it has everything to do with parenting and the degradation of TRUE morality and the American home life.

Vouchers in some situations may be a blessing...but vouchers alone does not fix a child's loveless home...which leads him/her to perform poorly and have no hope/ambition for the future.

Vouchers just makes the social-economic gap bigger and does nothing to the actual problem. Rural kids instantly lose because there are no, and will be no private schools built in low population, less affluent areas.

republic · « **Reply #36 on:** April 05, 2007, 02:46:27 PM »

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Originally posted by lazs2
The teachers are the highest paid part time workers in the nation and care more about their salary than the kids..

I agree whole heartedly. When you compare the average teacher salary down to the hours worked...they compare extremely favorably. I get so frustrated hearing teachers complain about low pay... The "low teacher pay" idea truly is a myth, and a frustrating one at that. When I hear of teachers complain about the good money most of them receive...I begin to question their motives for being a teacher...

Don't get me wrong, there are a handfull of teachers who go above and beyond the call of duty, and deserve every penny...but sadly...those are few and far between.

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Originally posted by lazs2

I think that republic has not given the thing much thought... he acts as if to have choice is evil... that only the public school is to be trusted and will do a good job (in spite of every example to the contrary) but.. say he is right.. say you get your voucher and go to a private school and then decide it is doing a bad job...

You can always just take your voucher money and use it in the peoples republic of public schools again. If public schools are so great they should really shine eh?

As it is... if you don't like public schools.. republic would have you just like it or lump it.

how bout a little choice and we will make up our own minds about our own kids education? I could sure use a voucher to help get my grand daughter through school but...

I will do it regardless and.. she will be vastly better educated than not only the republics of the world but the poor bastards who can't afford to pay taxes and put their kids in a decent school..

The problem is Laz...there are no other choices in many of the problem areas...especially rural areas. There are no salvation private schools to send my kids to. So the money going towards vouchers does nothing...unless I want to uproot my family and move. It simply draws attention away from the problem, and leads people to think it's a miracle solution for every problem for every district.

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Originally posted by lazs2

republic and his ilk are all about screwing the kids and their parents.

lazs

You, my friend, are a sadly bitter man. Disagreement doesn't require personal attacks...unless you can't defend your argument otherwise.

indy007 · « **Reply #37 on:** April 05, 2007, 03:43:01 PM »

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Originally posted by republic
The problem is Laz...there are no other choices in many of the problem areas...especially rural areas. There are no salvation private schools to send my kids to. So the money going towards vouchers does nothing...unless I want to uproot my family and move. It simply draws attention away from the problem, and leads people to think it's a miracle solution for every problem for every district.

So, basically, you refuse to move out of your rural area, even at the expense of your child's education.

Instead we should..... ?

Pay the teachers more? Wait, they're overpaid.
Pump more money into failing schools? Go visit Compton HS.
Instill "American Values and Morality" in the home? Who's morality? Christian morality? What if I'm a secular humanist?
Figure out a commuter system to get rural kids to good schools? Sounds like a winner to me.

Less complaining, more fixing.

republic · « **Reply #38 on:** April 05, 2007, 03:53:39 PM »

lol ok, I fell for the bait. Thought this might actually be a worthwhile discussion.

Soviet · « **Reply #39 on:** April 05, 2007, 06:46:14 PM »

The school district where I live has some of the highest paid teachers in the country. There are teachers earning over $100,000 a year and they're always protesting outside of the schools because they "Don't have a new contract." They've been offered dozens of contracts but rejected them because they weren't "good enough." Nevermind the fact that half of the cars in the teachers lots are Lexus, BMW, or Mercedes vehicles. The average resident in my community (And it is a working class/ middle class neighborhood) pays about $7,000 a year in property taxes. Most of these go to the school. It's crazy to the point where Long Island has a huge number of residents leaving for North Carolina and other places where they can get more house for less money paying less taxes.

BTW · « **Reply #40 on:** April 06, 2007, 08:49:55 AM »

If you fill up Catholic schools with kids that have parents that don't care if they learn or not (because they get to go FREE), you'll have public school in uniforms. With the government making increasing inroads to raising our children, even Catholic schools don't afford the discipline they once did. Thats really the crux of the matter. Its almost illegal to raise your children as individuals.

WilldCrd · « **Reply #41 on:** April 06, 2007, 09:14:22 AM »

BAH!!
Bring back corporal punishment.
When Alot of us were kids a few wacks on the buttocks made ya straighten up pretty quik!....also made u walk funny for a lil while but hey, the kids will heal up!!

Red Tail 444 · « **Reply #42 on:** April 06, 2007, 09:52:17 AM »

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Originally posted by republic
lol ok, I fell for the bait. Thought this might actually be a worthwhile discussion.

~~You must be new here...~~

lazs2 · « **Reply #43 on:** April 06, 2007, 02:44:43 PM »

republic... maybe I was hasty.. you seem reasonable. I would say that if you live in a rural area... your choices may be limited in schools but then so is your shopping and other things. you either drive your kids or you make the best of the local schools.

You don't not remodel your home because there is no lowes around the corner.

I don't agree tho that the parents are at fault.. I believe that the public schools do all they can to take away parents rights and them use them as a scapegoat when their programs fail...

The teachers have the kids for most of their waking hours and they can't teach em. Public schools and public school teachers (and their union) are cheating the public.

vouchers should be allowed for everyone even if they homeschool.. In that case maybe one parent could afford to stay home and teach.

lazs

Kuhn · « **Reply #44 on:** April 06, 2007, 03:21:01 PM »

I have 3 kids that went to the same schools. The oldest could get good grades if he wanted to. He decided not to go and became a delinquent until he was 19 and responsilble for his own actions. The middle child followed in his older brothers footsteps. He's 18 and comming home in a month or two after he finishes serving his time in a juvie center. He's been there for a year. My youngest is 13 and doing well in school. She gets very good grades and is a model student. Does the after school stuff, volunteers at the hospital etc. Now I understand the school and teachers had problems with the older boys, they blew it for themselves. But this sweet girl is having problems with teachers that her brothers had in the past. They seem to forget her track record when what I feel is a minor incident gets blown out of proportion. A few times now I have had to go to the school and remind the teachers that this is a good kid they are complaining about. Some of the things like staying inside when the rest of the kids are outside for recess should be handeled by the school. I don't need a phone call for that.

I do think many teachers are just doing the daily grind and don't want to help the kids. They just want to do their job and get the summer off. It makes me appreciate the ones that actually want to teach and are proud when a kid learns from them. Those are the people I enjoy to see at conferences and like to meet around town. They seem to be happy with their lives. OK gettting to long winded. DONE