Master of Your Domain!

[killnu]

nice Zaz.

[Zazen13]

Allow me to clarify in response to what Filth and Skyrock said. By taking responsibility for outcomes I was not insinuating necessarily flying to survive above all other concerns, albeit that could be construed as this  concept carried to the far extreme end of the spectrum. I will be the first to admit while I may only die a couple of times a tour, I learn far more from those few deaths than a hundred landed sorties in most cases.

By making oneself accountable and not externalizing resonsibility for what happens to you in-flight you gain a unique perspective, an objective one, affording you an opportunity to fathom greater insight into the dynamics of what caused the outcome whether it was a positive or negative one. This enriches your library of experience, you can draw on it anytime you wish to avoid repeating mistakes

Conversely, if you are a 'hapless victim' then your perspective is purely subjective, everyone is doing unto you, you are no longer an active participant in your own mind, you are an object and the outcomes are a result of actions perpetrated against you. That mentality is a disempowering one that leads to alot of whining, needless animosity and a general mind-set not at all conducive to learning, which in and of itself accentuates the feeling of victimization.

A healthy way to think of AH is like winning the lottery. For example, say I won a million dollars. I sit the pile of cash in my living room and admire it. It really has no value of its own, only by virtue of the buying power it represents. So, the money is like a player in the hanger who hasn't chosen a plane yet. Now, once you spend that money the value becomes the actual manifestation of its potential, it's totally open ended, you can do with it what you please. This is like a flight in AH. I could choose to invest it wisely or I could choose to buy a Kilo of Peruvian cocaine, throw a party, and blame the cocaine dealer when my heart explodes.

I would conservatively estimate 90% of all voices of discontent, posts and rantings on 200, are from those which would, with their last dying gasp, vehemently blame the cocaine dealer for their untimely demise. So, even had they not actually died from their reckless abandon they would have gleened nothing from the negative experience, become none the wiser, doomed to perpetually repeat their actions. Just like the hapless victim in AH who blames everyone else when they get HO'd, rammed, vulched, gang-raped, cherry-picked etc...A wise person would learn from it and never need to repeat the experience, holding themselves exclusively accountable for the outcomes...

Zazen

[JB88]

stares blanky at monitor.

drools.

[scot12b]

Watch out we are making sense here. Zazen  SkyRock I new you guys were wicked smart
 

[Mace2004]

Ahhh, an existentialist.  Mssrs Kierkegaard, Nietzsche, and Sartre....meet Zazen.

[WMLute]

Spot on Zazen.

I have always said much the same thing.

Actually brought up a similar point last night on chn 200.

Got HO'd?  That is your fault your are in the position to be HO'd.

Got Cherrypicked?  Again, your fault you are in that position.

Got GangBanged?  Why did you allow yourself to be in that position?

If any of those things happen to me, I know it's 100% because I put my self in a position for that to happen.  

90% of my deaths (if not more) are because I screwed up.

MY fault.  

My choice.  

Good stuff Zazen, i've said similar (with much smaller words of course) for years.

[Simaril]

Was a little let down after reading the thread title -- thought it was about something completely different, as any Seinfeld fan could tell you.


[/start old codger speech]
Culture of Blame adds immensely to our woes, both individually and nationally. Responsibility and integrity would remake the world....

.....and even more importantly, improve the AH experience!

[/end old codger speech]

Unfortunately, the guys who most need the message don't have the insight and self awareness to realize it applies to them!

[BaldEagl]

While I largely agree I don't think that the player can assume 100% accountability all of the time.  An example would be the poor soul who first drove past a windmill and got shot by someone hiding inside.  The accountability for that rests with HTC for allowing such a bug to exist.  Now that the bug has been made public however, you drive past windmills at your own risk.

To a lesser degree, you may be a good enough pilot to always win in a one on two, therefore flying into one is a good choice until the day that you do it against two superior pilots.  Did you put yourself in that position?  Yes.  Experience told you that it was a good choice but you had no way of judging your oponents until you were engaged.  I'd say accountability in this situation is somewhat less than 100%.  The luck of the draw worked against you.

Last weekend I was flying a Spit V and engaged a P-38G.  While it was my fault for not realizing it, I was out of cannon rounds and down to peashooters when I engaged.  Regardless, I got a few pings on the guy until my peashooters ran out then kept chasing him around.  When we engaged we were the only two planes within several sectors.  Even once out of ammo we remained engaged with me on his six for probably five minutes.  The total engagement was probably 10 minutes.  In the interim a countryman upped from a field a sector away and flew to the area we were in.  I mentioned that I was out of ammo and simply chasing the P-38 when my fellow countryman dropped in to finish him off.  Was it the P-38 pilots "fault" that he was engaged for such a long period that another was able to join the fight?  Had I been in a less agile aircraft he might have quickly won and been on his way.  Although he should have realized I was out of ammo and disregareded my chase had that not been the case then his decision would have been a bad one.  Again I submit that luck of the draw played a role several times in this encounter.

The best pilots in this game are those who best play the odds; flying here vs. flying there, aircraft vs. aircraft, tactic vs. tactic but there is inevitably a factor of luck that cannot be controlled by the player.  Because of this the player can never assume 100% accountability for the outcome of his flight.  He can only work to improve his odds and avoid mistakes.

I was in an extended one on three one day against a 109, a 110 and something else in a Spit IX.  I got all three and was flying home with over half my ammo remaining and my drop tank still attached when the 109 pilot 200'd me "Spit dweeb"!  Clearly someone who felt he was a victim as maybe he should.  Was his decision to engage me with two of his friends along a poor choice?  Probably not given his past experiences but he probably wasn't expecting someone who's spent years flying Spitfires.  Again, luck of the draw.

I also agree that pushing the envelope is the most rewarding learning experience.  At it's extreme playing the odds would keep you out of any multi-plane engagements.  It's in a one on two or three or even in a furball that you learn a lot about yourself, your abilities and your planes abilities that can be put to use another day.  

That said, when luck works against you, whining about it is a worthless use of time and energy.  That's where you should learn from the experience, pick up the pieces (almost literally) and go back out with new knowledge.

[Casper1]

nice points Zazen.

... but way too much trying to sound smart with all the clunky, oft unused words and run-on sentences

This one's my fav:  

"Part of that culture includes the epiphany of sorts bestowed upon us through experience whereby we realize that everything that happens to us in game is a direct result of decisions we ourselves make at critical junctures during a flight."

P.S. - stay away from me in that Typhoon of yours!

[detch01]

Originally posted by Zazen13
At the risk of surmonizing I would like to discuss, as the title suggests, taking personal responsibility for outcomes. As we get an ever-increasing influx of newer players, especially those in the younger demographic, it becomes increasingly important, as veterans, to do our part to instill in them some of that accrued community culture....

Great post Zazen.



Cheers,
asw

[Simaril]

Originally posted by Casper1

... but way too much trying to sound smart with all the clunky, oft unused words and run-on sentences
 

Wasn't going to say anything, but since it came up:


Short words are best and the old words when short are best of all.
---Winston Churchill

[Zazen13]

Originally posted by Casper1
nice points Zazen.

... but way too much trying to sound smart with all the clunky, oft unused words and run-on sentences

 

Actually, that's just the way I talk, I grew up without television so ended up reading alot...I gave up on the smart thing a long time ago. I've long since resigned myself to my plight as a mere dolt in this world.

In any event please focus the discussion on the message rather than the messenger, I believe  alot of the community's woes lie therein...


Zazen

[SkyRock]

Let me clear the air on how I feel about the topic.  I agree with your post 100%, Zaz.  It's great advice to live by even in teh real world.  But in this game situation, we need not let off the hook those who play so cheaply, by admonishing the "hapless victim" and his cry of foul!  Of course it is his mistake he died.  I would give 1000 safely landed timid gang dweebs for one fearless fighter!  I know from my experiences, it is so incredibly hard to get people to risk their virtual planes to fight, that one must litterally hang their 6 out to dry in front of peeps to even get them to come close enough to shoot, that is unless they have 6 friends around, then they miraculously become very aggressive.  So your advice would have been much more relatable to the game had you just said, "Chill on the whines!"  I will, however, give you a 10 on the positive nature of the post and it's overall real life enlightenment!  

 

Mark

[Vad]

Well said, Zazen, I knew a lot of new words And it's correct if we are talking about whining and blaming on ch200.

But I agree with BaldEagl.

It would be great if everybody blames only himself for outcomes of his actions. But it is impossible to convince anybody to blame only himself for everything what happens with him.

In point of fact it's just wishful thining. People in general and AH players in particular will never  get full responsibility for outcomes of their own actions only. It's against human nature. And direct way to asylum, btw. Blaming circumstances, luck, others is some kind of psychological defence.

Look, we make decision at certain moment of time and in certain circumstances, and we really do believe that we've made the best choice in the sence of achieving our goals. But outcomes of our decisions depend not only on them but on the changes of environment/conditions/situation which happens later. And this is the basis where people can build their  complaints.

[SKJohn]

Originally posted by KONG1
Good advise, should be applied to all of life, not just the game.

I could not agree more!  
I get so tired of watching the news at night, everybody wants to be the "victim" - gotta find a lawyer, gotta sue - can't be my fault, somebody's got to pay!  You hurt my feelings - now I deserve to get rich. . . yadayadayada