Author Topic: Perk The Sherman!!!!! (Read 2057 times)

Stampf · « **Reply #30 on:** June 14, 2007, 03:43:21 PM »

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This is not entirely correct. The "stock" sherman was at a significant disadvantage vs any of the german armor since its main gun was so inferior. since the M4 was deployed in an offensive role it had to close against superior weaponry deployed in a defensive posture on known terrain....so it absorbed tremendous losses just getting in range. There are however numerous engagements where the sherman did well in pure "tank on tank" combat. In one the german lost 54 Panthers & tigers to 17 shermans.

Agreed. And of course there were good showings by the western allied tank forces. And I was speaking of standard M4 Shermans of course as well. I think the FF is a great addition, just not how it's being overused to the exclusion of other fun vehicles. Just trying to look for an easy fix, short of development time involved in new vehicles.

Also agreed about the terrain. the Germans exceled in the defensive role and the western front terrain could not have been better suited for this role. The wide open expanses of the eastern battlefields proved that numbers and tactics could defeat these defensive skills, and superior tanks. .

P47Gra · « **Reply #31 on:** June 14, 2007, 03:57:10 PM »

I just like to kill things. If I got nothing to up a FF then I would still do so. Points blah! Maybe because I am a Noob at AH, I love to fly or roll to kill someone. Sorry guys I dont get it.

Wolfala · « **Reply #32 on:** June 14, 2007, 04:01:27 PM »

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Originally posted by Lusche
But many people just can't aim well enough. When a port is under sudden attack by many cons and the Vh is about to be dropped, I always roll a Tiger for defense, not an Ostwind. Usually I survive for a loooong time, often I can even foil squad sized capture attempts. Just don't sit still with a Tiger!

True enough, and the only reason i'm using 4K is because kills don't register on the Tiger. Normal for me, is 1 bomb, 1 plink - doesnt matter if its a Flak, M3, M16, Panzer, T34 or Firefly. But with the Tiger, you need to be excessive - even though 250 lbs of HE is more then adequate to splinter metal IRL.

Wolf

crockett · « **Reply #33 on:** June 14, 2007, 04:17:28 PM »

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Originally posted by Lusche
Introduce a standard Sherman for free, then give the FF a slight perk, maybe 10.

I agree.. I'd also say the Tiger should zoom a bit better as well. If I'm in a FF and I know a Tiger is out there, I generally don't worry too much. Only time a Tiger is a real threat to a FF IMO is in a head to head battle with little cover. Like what happens on Small Pizza map where it's a head to head fight in the canyons.

I think a cost of maybe a 5 perks with a ENY of 10 (not 5) would be good enough on the FF as long as there were normal Sherman's added to the game. If no normal Sherman's are added then I'd be against perking the FF.

Personally I'm kinda fond of the M-8 but with the terrain updates it's a tough job to use a M-8 now days. There are just not enough trees to hide in anymore.

BaldEagl · « **Reply #34 on:** June 14, 2007, 04:41:33 PM »

I can kill a Tiger w/2000 lb of ord. Nothing less but 2000 does it almost every time. 1000 on anything else and it's poof (including the Fireflys).

That's using the trusty F6F-5. Less might do but I only carry 1000 lbers.

Solar10 · « **Reply #35 on:** June 14, 2007, 05:45:09 PM »

2 500lbers from a mossie will pop a tiger, but they have to hit it direct.

wipass · « **Reply #36 on:** June 15, 2007, 05:05:32 AM »

This is a Sherman at the Overloon museum in Holland. I have visited the museum a few times.

This particular tank was hit on the side turret/mantlet by an 88, it was further hit twice on the side by an 88 with both rounds going through both sides.

If you hit a Sherman with an 88 anywhere it should be destroyed.

Regards

wipass

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y179/sjoerd1977/IMG_0007.jpg

BaDkaRmA158Th · « **Reply #37 on:** June 15, 2007, 06:59:47 AM »

Holy hell, can you all wait till we get a new plane or tank before ya'll start jumpin' on the FF's case?

At least wait till the next version.

Who knows, HTC could drop three tanks on your arses and you would all be stuck on stupid.
perk the uuuuh..uhm..the..perk..the..u hm...armor..uh..gun....perk everything with treads armor and a main gun!!

Honestly do NOT see the FF as any major threat, shut your engine down,hide and wait for the sob to go by.
Even a m8 can take one out "sure it wont be at 1.5k" but play like a moron, die like one.

Most tanks in ww2 most of the time hid themselfs, they did not go charging around fireing round after round after round, then wounder why their target killed them."well most of them didnt, the dead ones did"

Ask any tanker in the know, you hide..shut engines off..drop to N aim,fire..wait..wait..wait..wait..wait..aim..fire. rinse and repeat.
If you fire that main gun every time you hear it reload, count your seconds.
you wont be around much longer.

Cannot tell you how many time i have found a enemy tank by listening to engines, machinegun fire..and the sight of a huge tracer come from a tree line.
HTC gods gave you a x button for zoom for a reason.

Zoom in, if the enemy's main gun is facing YOU "and your NOT directly in front of him" he SEE's you.
RUn b17ch run!

Re position, aim..fire..wait..wait..wait.. wait..fire.

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaa aaaaaah

"Duck's out off stage, cant wait to see all the 'butt hurt' with this one,wee!"
Perk the SBD! its too good of a high alt fighter.

Larry · « **Reply #38 on:** June 15, 2007, 07:15:23 AM »

Sherman VC should be perked about 5 since it can take a tigers turret out and kill it with one shot from 2k.

One night a horde came into a Vbase. I uped a tiger knowing that they would be bringing tanks in. I got up on a hill overlooking the spawn. A M4 poped up I took a shot and missed, he took a shot and pop goes my turret. I run back to base and zoom down the hill trying to out run the M3s that were racing in. I got one set but the other 2 sets made it.

Grits · « **Reply #39 on:** June 15, 2007, 07:43:40 AM »

Cool, until this thread I was not even aware there were tanks in this flight sim.

Larry · « **Reply #40 on:** June 15, 2007, 09:15:54 AM »

Cool, until ths thread I was not even aware this "WWII combat Sim" was a flight sim.

crockett · « **Reply #41 on:** June 15, 2007, 01:47:31 PM »

BaDkaRmA158Th I agree the M4 can be taken out by a M-8 I've done it quite a few times myself. However a Panzer is so much easier to kill in a M-8 than a Sherman is. I just wonder if the armor on a FF was better than the armor on a Panzer in real life. (I dunno much about the tanks in real life, but I don't think it was)

When I'm in a M-8 I'm almost confident enough to take on a Panzer from the front. I can normally take out it's turret in 2 shots from the M-8 three if I'm having a bad day. Then I can normally finish off the tank in 4 or 5 shots.

When I'm up aginst a Sherman I have to be much more carful in planning my attack with the M-8. It tends to take twice the amount of hits to kill the turret before it goes. ( around 4 or 5 hits to kill the turrent then around 8 shots to kill the tank.

lol Tigers on the other hand.. If I'm in a M-8 I run for my little life. I've never even managed to track a tiger much less kill it's turret in a M-8.

Grits · « **Reply #42 on:** June 15, 2007, 01:56:59 PM »

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Originally posted by Larry
Cool, until ths thread I was not even aware this "WWII combat Sim" was a flight sim.

Now you know its a flight sim with sideshow Tonka Toys. Glad I could help.

humble · « **Reply #43 on:** June 15, 2007, 02:08:19 PM »

Armor is a combination of a variety of factors...

1) overall thickness
2) angle of slope
3) the quality and hardness of the metal

Obviously the thicker the armor the better...but slope and the hardness and "grain alignment" also played a big a big part. The sherman was a mixed bag with varying thickness/slope and both cast and welded hull produced at different places so having different "specs". From what I've read the "stock" M4 had superior armor (overall) to the PZIVH (whcih had very little slope if any most places). All in all the M4 was considered a better tank then the PZIV but grossly inferior to the Panther & Tiger. The FF was originally conceived for the "overwatch" role and allocated 1 per tank platoon. It would cover the advance of the other 3 tanks. IRL it was so effective that the germans were ordered to engage the FF at any range 1st....just like AH it would kill a Tiger or Panther at long range (I dont think it had anywhere near the survivablity it shows in AH however).

The two biggest factors in the ETO were the vastly superior US recovery capabilities and the 2 US "heavy" armored divisions. This created a battle of attrition the germans just couldnt win (at the cost of high US casualties).

US (and german) doctrine was really based on artillery. The germans never lost a single battle until they had lost there artillery coverage. The role of the tank was primarily to break thru fixed defensive positions and eliminate supply and artillery formations allowing the infantry to close and defeat the bulk of the enemy army. So we have an unrealistic view of "tank war"...if we ever got fixed artillery it would change everything...

Castedo · « **Reply #44 on:** June 15, 2007, 04:53:50 PM »

Tank war was never about armour or gun, was about mobility and tatics. This cannot be done at AH. As a whole war is about playing your cards right, chain of command, different arms, air ground sea. You cannot do it at AH, you would need a president, a general and cannon foder.