Author Topic: Ship Convoys/Rail Yards  (Read 796 times)

Offline fjaloma

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Ship Convoys/Rail Yards
« on: July 20, 2007, 11:47:51 PM »
I'd like to see some ship convoys and raildyards. We already have the 10 truck convoy, so make it bigger, use trains instead and place some railyards betweens cities and run supplies through them. Make them a strat target.

I'd also like to see some Ship convoys. Also make supplies run through them and have be a strat target as well.

Offline Latrobe

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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2007, 12:47:50 AM »
i never see anyone attacking the supply trucks now so why would we need convoys and railyards? Field supplies would still get to the bases and no one would destroy them still. The only real good thing i see coming out of this is a pretty neat screenshot by Biggles :)

Offline Uriel

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« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2007, 02:34:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Latrobe
i never see anyone attacking the supply trucks now so why would we need convoys and railyards? Field supplies would still get to the bases and no one would destroy them still. The only real good thing i see coming out of this is a pretty neat screenshot by Biggles :)


the reason why you dont is you have set up attack planes to fail.. how about some targets that are not right next to an airfield.. I continuosly have to through 10 LA-7's. I really wish their was more targets that would be for attack planes so that we would not have to furball to get to it.. try to run a p47 with 2 1000 pndrs through ten enemy con.. that is not realistic by any means

Offline fjaloma

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Still like the idea of Railyards/Ship Convoys
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2007, 09:05:43 PM »
"i never see anyone attacking the supply trucks now so why would we need convoys and railyards? Field supplies would still get to the bases and no one would destroy them still. "

Spoken like a true Furballer"  LOL.  Nobody attacks them because there's little importance to them. If, however, you add more importance to targets like these, then I think it will add another dimension to the arena. Besides, it's almost impossible to take a heavy jug etc. anywhere because you have to fight from one furball to another just to get to a target.

Places these areas somewhat away from towns and now you have to patrol a wide area. So what do you do?  Hover over a base like a lot of people or do you go on sweeps now to protect your supplies?  You'll get your dogfights in.. cause I wouldn't send a flight of heavy jugs w/o an escort.  I still like the idea.

Offline battel gnome94

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Ship Convoys/Rail Yards
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2007, 09:25:41 PM »
dont you ever look at the site there are trians and there is barges that come from port to port then a trian or convoy comes from the port to the base.

read the site:aok

Offline fjaloma

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Railyards/Ship Convoys still a good idea
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2007, 10:56:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by battel gnome94
dont you ever look at the site there are trians and there is barges that come from port to port then a trian or convoy comes from the port to the base.

read the site:aok


Sure, but my point is to (1) make the convoys/railyards count heavily regarding your base supplies (2) provide another level of stategy (3) give the A20/B26 and other Jabo guys something else to hit (4) and maybe relieve the over-base furball where 30 guys will hover over a base and wait for someone to wander in range.

Hey... its nothing more than an attempt to provide additional levels of play. Besides, I'm not going to spend time looking for 10 trucks that just MIGHT be in the area. But a ship convoy loaded with supplies I would. And I rarley see a train running. It's been months since I've seen one so I was thinking that AH took them out on the last update.... and I fly a lot of NOE strikes.

Offline Tiger

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« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2007, 02:21:50 PM »
That truck convoy is hauling butt.  I wish we had one of those for taking troops to the base :)

I'll make a pass or two ont he convoy if there are no fighters in the area.

I havn't seen the barge in a long time, but I assume it still exists.

The only time I ever see the train is if I'm the goon on an NOE mission, and then I don't see the train for long because of the uber gun it has.

Offline BaldEagl

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Re: Railyards/Ship Convoys still a good idea
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2007, 02:48:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by fjaloma
And I rarley see a train running. It's been months since I've seen one so I was thinking that AH took them out on the last update.... and I fly a lot of NOE strikes.


Drive a vehicle to a strat target sometime.  The train comes every 15 minutes like clockwork.

The trains have an uber gun that can kill anything and making it worse is that since the update the trains dissapear at the end of their run but can still shoot at you.  You've got to be careful where you set up camp at a strat in a vehicle but if you kill the car right behind the engine the rest of the train goes away along with the gun.
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Offline sparow

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« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2007, 06:12:39 PM »
Hi chaps!

Yes, we still have barges in game, I know beacause I was run-over by one when I was taking off in my trusty old Spitfire! :O

Couldn't believe my eyes, a ship in the middle of an airfield, my Spit in bits all over the place! :rofl

And trains still exist too, although no one in his perfect sense wants to tangle with that un-realistic radar-laser-ubber-cannon of them...

I say, take the gun of the trains and put some slow merchant ship convoys, unescorted, or escorted only by DDs.

Some of you will understand how this links with my submarine, fleet speed, battleship and radar range posts all scattered around this wishlist...These have been quite productive weeks, wishlist-wise...:D

Cheers,
Sparow
249 Sqn RAF "Gold Coast"
Consistently beeing shot down since Tour 33 (MA) and Tour 8  (CT/AvA)

Visit us at http://249sqn.wordpress.com/

Offline BaldEagl

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« Reply #9 on: August 21, 2007, 02:19:46 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by sparow
Hi chaps!

Yes, we still have barges in game, I know beacause I was run-over by one when I was taking off in my trusty old Spitfire! :O

Couldn't believe my eyes, a ship in the middle of an airfield, my Spit in bits all over the place! :rofl


The barge on the field bug has been reported at least once by me.
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.

Offline sparow

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« Reply #10 on: August 21, 2007, 09:14:23 AM »
Rgr that BalEagl,

I'll report it too, then. Never did it before.

Tx
Sparow
249 Sqn RAF "Gold Coast"
Consistently beeing shot down since Tour 33 (MA) and Tour 8  (CT/AvA)

Visit us at http://249sqn.wordpress.com/

Offline Sabre

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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2007, 01:27:55 PM »
Trains, barges, and trucks have always been virtually ignored in the game from their very inception.  The impact on an enemy country’s ability to wage war has never come close to justifying the effort needed to hunt them down and kill them.  Take truck convoys, for example.  For killing the convoy to have any effect, one or more targets at a base must first be destroyed; killing the convoy only slows the rebuild time, it doesn’t actually harm the base in any way.  It’s far safer and more effective to simply kill the object after it respawns, rather than killing it and they go hunting (at low level by necessity) for the convoy and killing it…over and over again.  Historically, disrupting lines of communication (LOC) was as effective (sometimes more effective) than trying to kill the units or installations they were supplying.  As often as not, disrupting LOCs wasn’t (and still isn’t) so much about killing the trucks and rolling stock themselves, but instead cutting the LOCs at crucial junctures such as downing bridges and blocking natural chokepoints like passes and rail yards.  This would limit the enemy’s mobility and hence his options.  This is what is missing from AH.

I would make a number of changes to how AH uses resupply.  First, I’d add an effect when a truck or barge convoy is destroyed.  Not only would it slow the rebuild time, by it would also reduce stocks on hand over time.  What I mean here is, killing a convoy would have the effect over time of reducing troops, fuel, and ordnance availability, without ever physically attacking the base’ bunkers.  Kill on convoy, and at the moment the convoy should have arrived (but doesn’t) reduce maximum fuel allowed in the hanger by 25% (and of course, disable drop tanks).  The maximum bomb size for any a/c would likewise be reduced, or perhaps the number of bombs and rockets in any load-out would be cut in half.  Troops would not be affected by the first missed convoy, but perhaps would be unavailable after two missed convoys in a row.

Next, I’d change it so that destroying a road bridge or RR bridge between a convoy/train and its destination would stop the convoy or train from moving for some preset amount of time (until it is repaired).

I would also add rail yards to the cities.  Destroying it would have the same effect as destroying a train, but the effect would be longer lasting.

Finally, I’d tone down the train flack; it’s simply too deadly.  First, not ever train was a flak trap; some had no protection at all.  Secondly, it’s harder to hit something from a moving platform.

I had also considered adding an effect on ground-vehicle availability when a convoy or barge is delayed (planes can fly in, but armor has to be shipped in by road and rail); however, that would make it too easy to restrict vehicle availability, unless taking out a bridge or convoy was at least as tough as taking down a hanger.
Sabre
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Offline sparow

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« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2007, 05:12:04 PM »
Sabre,

Great post, great ideas. This is such a neglected area and could have so much impact in the way people play...

Why nobody listens? This is wisdom. This is deep. This is important.

for your post, it should be made a thread by itself.

Sorry, I also get emotional like this with music masterpieces...

Cheers,
Sparow
249 Sqn RAF "Gold Coast"
Consistently beeing shot down since Tour 33 (MA) and Tour 8  (CT/AvA)

Visit us at http://249sqn.wordpress.com/

Offline Sabre

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« Reply #13 on: August 27, 2007, 12:03:53 PM »
Gosh, Sparrow...I'm humbled.
Sabre
"The urge to save humanity almost always masks a desire to rule it."

Offline whiteman

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Ship Convoys/Rail Yards
« Reply #14 on: August 27, 2007, 01:06:27 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sabre
Trains, barges, and trucks have always been virtually ignored in the game from their very inception.  The impact on an enemy country’s ability to wage war has never come close to justifying the effort needed to hunt them down and kill them.  Take truck convoys, for example.  For killing the convoy to have any effect, one or more targets at a base must first be destroyed; killing the convoy only slows the rebuild time, it doesn’t actually harm the base in any way.  It’s far safer and more effective to simply kill the object after it respawns, rather than killing it and they go hunting (at low level by necessity) for the convoy and killing it…over and over again.  Historically, disrupting lines of communication (LOC) was as effective (sometimes more effective) than trying to kill the units or installations they were supplying.  As often as not, disrupting LOCs wasn’t (and still isn’t) so much about killing the trucks and rolling stock themselves, but instead cutting the LOCs at crucial junctures such as downing bridges and blocking natural chokepoints like passes and rail yards.  This would limit the enemy’s mobility and hence his options.  This is what is missing from AH.

I would make a number of changes to how AH uses resupply.  First, I’d add an effect when a truck or barge convoy is destroyed.  Not only would it slow the rebuild time, by it would also reduce stocks on hand over time.  What I mean here is, killing a convoy would have the effect over time of reducing troops, fuel, and ordnance availability, without ever physically attacking the base’ bunkers.  Kill on convoy, and at the moment the convoy should have arrived (but doesn’t) reduce maximum fuel allowed in the hanger by 25% (and of course, disable drop tanks).  The maximum bomb size for any a/c would likewise be reduced, or perhaps the number of bombs and rockets in any load-out would be cut in half.  Troops would not be affected by the first missed convoy, but perhaps would be unavailable after two missed convoys in a row.

Next, I’d change it so that destroying a road bridge or RR bridge between a convoy/train and its destination would stop the convoy or train from moving for some preset amount of time (until it is repaired).

I would also add rail yards to the cities.  Destroying it would have the same effect as destroying a train, but the effect would be longer lasting.

Finally, I’d tone down the train flack; it’s simply too deadly.  First, not ever train was a flak trap; some had no protection at all.  Secondly, it’s harder to hit something from a moving platform.

I had also considered adding an effect on ground-vehicle availability when a convoy or barge is delayed (planes can fly in, but armor has to be shipped in by road and rail); however, that would make it too easy to restrict vehicle availability, unless taking out a bridge or convoy was at least as tough as taking down a hanger.


:aok I'd love more ground targets to hit besides the fields.