A "REAL" noob. :)

[sjohnson]

Hi all, just found AcesHigh, and I'm already addicted, I believe.

The flight model is a bit strange, or Perhaps I'm just not used to it quiet yet..

Some very basic questions - whenever I try to bank for a turn as soon as I start pulling back on the stick (A break turn) My cockpit starts to shudder, and i hear a grinding sound (Not pulling hard on the stick mind you, very gently) if I apply any more pressure, I start to stall.  What is this trying to tell me? I have tried to increase speed, decrease speed to allow for a tighter turn, but nothing really seems to work... My "dogfights" turn into a series of head on passes.   I understand we are shooting for realistic physics here, but I really turn slugglishy, any tips on how to get a tighter turn?

I'm reading over mounds of material on how I can contribute to a team, even if my piloting skills are not very good, wither that be flying cargo from one base to another, or whatever else I can find - what would you suggest that could give me some stick time, but also help the war effort?

I have quite a few more questions, but I'll stop here for now, except to ask if there are any "Mature" squads out there looking to add a loyal member, that is very willing to learn?

Would love to meet some other folks!

Thanks!

[68Raptor]

Sjohnson, that grinding/shuddering noise is 2 different forces of lift competing against each other. Basic flight dynamics and I'm sure someone will be along to explain much more in depth but basically your plane and it's energy (refereed to as "E" in the game) are traveling in a basic path and when you try a turn that results in a "G" force (changing the path the plane was following) the plane reacts with a shudder or shake telling you it does not like what you are doing and are stressing the integrity of the craft. In another way of explaining it an airfoil or wing does not care what speed the plane is traveling at, it will always stall at the time based on the wind force over the surface of the wing. Jump in the training arena and get with some trainers (I believe the is training schedule under the header of "game info" "need help") They can get you up and flying with some degree of success quickly and save you time from reading and digesting volumes of info. The physics of the flight model in this game are very nice to those that enjoy a challenge. Think of it as the “realistic” setting in other flight game. By default this game is set to almost max as compared to several other flight games you might have played. There are some built it items that make flying much simpler such as one button auto-pilot which can greatly reduce your work load.

 There are multiple Squads in the game. You will hear this more then once but don't jump in the first one that asks you to join. Fly with them for a few weeks, see when they fly, their squad nights/days, how well you get along with the rest of the squad. Welcome to team Sir. Hope you have a fantastic time here.

[waystin2]

Welcome to the addiction!  I am thinking of starting a local chapter of Aces High Anonymous!  LOL You are doing it right from the start.  STUDY, then study some more, hit the help bulletin board, check the training section info on the AH site, and check out netaces.org.  As far as your grinding and stalling sounds, what plane(s) are you flying?  It always helps those providing info.   My one suggestion to you is to turn off your stall limiter now!  I learned to fly with it on, and had to learn again when I turned it off.  My control and feel  for the aircraft increased tremendously.  Take your time on a squad, I am on my 3rd tour and still have not pursued the matter.  I have found that listening to the other pilots suggestions or plans (specifically more experienced pilots) during play in the MA helps a lot to.  You will get an idea of who those pilots are during MA play, and seeing their board responses. I am sure that there will be some more experienced pilots along shortly to drop some helpful info.  See you up there!

[Trip01]

Hi Sjohnson,

Forgetting for a moment the technically accurate explanations for buffet and stall, if you're in a fighter doing 350mph you should blackout before you get buffet. So you're either going too slowly or pulling back too hard.

Just to check there isn't something really wrong with your setup, try a zero, which is about the easiest plane to turn. If you're still getting buffet at high speeds, and your stick is properly calibrated, send me a film and I'll see if I can see what's wrong.

Trip

[StuB]

When you hear the grinding sound....it is the stall horn.  The louder it gets the closer you are getting to stalling out.

The shuddering is your plane buffeting due to the airflow over the wings being disrupted.

When You hear the grinding sound start to get louder and the plane starts shuddering you need to ease up on the joystick and/or add more power (if you aren't already at max power).  If you are still needing to turn you can lower the nose to trade some altitude for speed....but just like WEP, that runs out after a while too.

Each plane turns differently.  Stick to flying one plane type for a while and look at the comparison charts and learn which do what better than the plane you are currently in.  Then try to avoid situations where you are flying to the opposing planes strengths.  As an example, if you are in a P47, fighting a Zero, you don't want to get into a slow turn fight with it because that is where the Zero holds the advantage.

Good luck.  You are on the rigt track.

Originally posted by sjohnson
Hi all, just found AcesHigh, and I'm already addicted, I believe.

The flight model is a bit strange, or Perhaps I'm just not used to it quiet yet..

Some very basic questions - whenever I try to bank for a turn as soon as I start pulling back on the stick (A break turn) My cockpit starts to shudder, and i hear a grinding sound (Not pulling hard on the stick mind you, very gently) if I apply any more pressure, I start to stall.  What is this trying to tell me? I have tried to increase speed, decrease speed to allow for a tighter turn, but nothing really seems to work... My "dogfights" turn into a series of head on passes.   I understand we are shooting for realistic physics here, but I really turn slugglishy, any tips on how to get a tighter turn?

I'm reading over mounds of material on how I can contribute to a team, even if my piloting skills are not very good, wither that be flying cargo from one base to another, or whatever else I can find - what would you suggest that could give me some stick time, but also help the war effort?

I have quite a few more questions, but I'll stop here for now, except to ask if there are any "Mature" squads out there looking to add a loyal member, that is very willing to learn?

Would love to meet some other folks!

Thanks!

[sjohnson]

Ok, Tried the Zero, and wow...

Huge difference, I can turn *MUCH* better in it.. More of what I was expecting - Thank you.

I guess its just a matter of learning the different planes - anyone suggest a decent all around fighter to work on learning? Something with a fairly easy learning curve?

[BaldEagl]

Start with the easy things first.

Is your gear up? (would make a creaking noise if down)
Are your flaps up? (would cause the buffeting you are experiencing)
Are you at minimum speed? (stall is between 80-120 ias for most aircraft... stall buzzer would be sounding... trying to pull up or into a turn at stall speed would cause buffeting)

I don't know what would cause a grinding noise other than dragging parts of your plane on the ground.

Another source of buffeting/creaking is in a high speed dive at the point that you're stressing the airframe.

There are many older players here (me among them).  Take your time hooking up with a squad.

Read eveything you can then visit the training arena if you think you need to.  It will help you enjoy the game much more much sooner.

[EDIT]  Nevermind.  I see you got the answers while I was typing.

[sjohnson]

Is your gear up? (would make a creaking noise if down)

Hi Eagle.

Yes, I have my flaps up, gear up (although it took me a while to figure out why my gear wouldn't retract, until I realized that VEHICLE Gear up and down are different than FLIGHT gear up and down. )

The problem was my plane resisting my turning, I never got to the point of blacking out, I would just stall, or go into a tail spin when i got real aggressive.  I swapped over to the Zero - wow, HUGE difference, it turns MUCH better.. I even took part on taking an airfield, and killed 2 gun emplacements (yea, I know, but was an accomplishment to me)

I'm now looking up the "rules" on taking over places, resupplying your bases, etc. This is ALOT more detailed that I expected, so now im trying to figure out exactly what I need to do to ferry troops around... Figured even someone who is dogfight challenged could help that way =) I used a cargo plane, landed on a base wewre trying to take over, and ended sorte, and I didn't notice anything happen, so I guess I missed a step!

[Murdr]

The stall buffet kicks in when any part of one of your wings has reached stall condition.  Lift is calculated across many individual points on your wings.  It is possible to ride through the stall buffet without losing controlled flight and fully stalling one or both wings.  

Not only speed, but weight also play an important part in causing stall conditions.  A common n00b scenario is to take up a P-51 with 100% fuel, rockets and drop tanks.  Let's estimate 3/4 ton of internal fuel, plus external payload to be about 1-1/3 ton of expendable weight on your plane.  As soon as you try to maneuver and pull 2G that expendable weight effectively doubles and translates into 2-2/3 ton of wing loading.

Now let's change that scenario to only 50% fuel and no externals.  Now to reach that 2-2/3 ton of expendable weight on your wingload, you can pull almost 3.5 Gs!  I hope that conveys how much of an effect weight has on handling.  This especially applies to US fighters that are heavy to begin with, and have a very large internal fuel capacity.

[edit]I guess I should mention that there is a stall condition called an accellerated stall where you are effectively producing more G load than lift.  This can happen at speeds well above stall speed.

For a starter plane I usually suggest the N1K2 as it has forgiving handling characteristics, a strong gun package, multi-stage flaps, and good horsepower.  I also suggest the spit 8, 9, and 16, though they are minus the multi-stage flaps, and do have a bit of a rough vertical stall.  Both types should give you a good feel for the flight model, and have good enough inherent performance to keep a new player alive longer than either more heavier fighters, or more nimble, but underpowered fighters.

[68Raptor]

Originally posted by Murdr
The stall buffet kicks in when any part of one of your wings has reached stall condition.  Lift is calculated across many individual points on your wings.  It is possible to ride through the stall buffet without losing controlled flight and fully stalling one or both wings.  

Not only speed, but weight also play an important part in causing stall conditions.  A common n00b scenario is to take up a P-51 with 100% fuel, rockets and drop tanks.  Let's estimate 3/4 ton of internal fuel, plus external payload to be about 1-1/3 ton of expendable weight on your plane.  As soon as you try to maneuver and pull 2G that expendable weight effectively doubles and translates into 2-2/3 ton of wing loading.

Now let's change that scenario to only 50% fuel and no externals.  Now to reach that 2-2/3 ton of expendable weight on your wingload, you can pull almost 3.5 Gs!  I hope that conveys how much of an effect weight has on handling.  This especially applies to US fighters that are heavy to begin with, and have a very large internal fuel capacity.

[edit]I guess I should mention that there is a stall condition called an accellerated stall where you are effectively producing more G load than lift.  This can happen at speeds well above stall speed.

For a starter plane I usually suggest the N1K2 as it has forgiving handling characteristics, a strong gun package, multi-stage flaps, and good horsepower.  I also suggest the spit 8, 9, and 16, though they are minus the multi-stage flaps, and do have a bit of a rough vertical stall.  Both types should give you a good feel for the flight model, and have good enough inherent performance to keep a new player alive longer than either more heavier fighters, or more nimble, but underpowered fighters.

Sjohnson, I see the AH trainers have some along. You are in excellent hands now. I would suggest you focus on one area at a time for a few days though then move onto something else when trying to understand the game. AH has a high learning curve to it and multiple areas to enjoy the game in. Very fun though the learning process though. I've been in the game for about 7 months now, still a noob and still learning new things almost everyday. Though I have to admit, I have the ability to bail mastered

[SlapShot]

Originally posted by sjohnson
Something with a fairly easy learning curve?

Spit IX ... nimble / decent power / decent climb / very forgiving / ok guns and ammo

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by sjohnson
Ok, Tried the Zero, and wow...

Huge difference, I can turn *MUCH* better in it.. More of what I was expecting - Thank you.

I guess its just a matter of learning the different planes - anyone suggest a decent all around fighter to work on learning? Something with a fairly easy learning curve?

do yourself a favor and fly the either the Spitfire Mk IX or the XIII until you get used to the flight model and most importantly, seek the assistance of a trainer like Murdr.

The reason I suggest starting out in the Spitfire Mk IX or the VIII is that the Spitfires have a wonderful reputation of being forgiving.  They will also make getting over the learning curve that much easier.  But it is important that you also seek the assistance of a trainer like I had already mentioned.  

Two last tips...do not pay any attention to those that cry about what plane you fly.  Whether you end up flying Spitfires or a P-40, it's all about what is fun to fly for you.  Usually those that whine do so because they have no clue as to how to fight against the plane they complain about.  The other important tip I can give is to have fun.

Enjoy your new addiction.



ack-ack

[waystin2]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
do yourself a favor and fly the either the Spitfire Mk IX or the XIII until you get used to the flight model and most importantly, seek the assistance of a trainer like Murdr.

One newb to another the Mark 8 is my primary ride, and she is totally forgiving!

[Spatula]

Try building up some more speed before turning. Slower you are, the easier it is to buffet and stall. The more Gs you pull, the faster you will bleed off speed, and thus it gets harder and harder to turn without stalling.

[Latrobe]

Originally posted by sjohnson
Hi all, just found AcesHigh, and I'm already addicted, I believe.

You DO believe, BELIEVE!!

Study, practice, learn ACM, and find a good squadron to fly with. If you ever have the chance ask a trainer in the TA for help. They are always willing to help with anything!