information on ACM please

[LYNX]

Originally posted by Charlie
my squad has a monthly DA going and there are about 3 guys I cant beat.  They seem to have better ACM tactics than me.  Right now we are fighitng the hurri Mk1 and these guys jsut seem to always outturn me and I am no sllouch when it comes to furballing.

Is there an AH website that explains how the physics in AH work for furballing/turnfight etc?

cheers

Just google "Defensive Combat Manuevers" and "Combat manuevers".  

Some very interesting stuff out there.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Murdr
Yes, you can.  But that only applies as long as he is doing "X".  If he does 1/4X and then changes to Z, then do I continue to do Y?  No I adjust my tactics.  So we are saying the same thing here except you are just "doing" without putting any lables on it.  Which is fine.

Let me put this in other terms:
Charlie: Id like resources to help my golf swing
Carwash: Check out these links, there is a good article on adjusting your grip
Dedalos: Hit the driving range.  That stuff is a waste of time.
Murdr: Suggest you get with your local pro for a lesson, (and check out carwash's links too if you want), then hit the driving range.

 

OK, it probably came out the wrong way trying to answer several posts at once.  I think Slap got what I was trying to say.  I am not saying to not ask for training or read or train with a trainer.  Looking at the quote above, I think a better description of what I am saying is:

Dedalos: Hit the driving range with your laptop and an expert.

Looking at the links or talking to an expert alone will be a waste of time if you dont try it.  However, if you try you may figure it out.  Anyway, I think you need all three.  I was trying to explain that reading about ACM will not do it alone.  You need training/practice.

Here is an example.  I got jumped by a high 0 while in a 202.  I did not last long but being the smart arse that I am I made a coment about him BnZ in in a 0.  He offered to help me learn ACM in the DA so I went
The guy got on vox and explained every maneuver he was doing.  I was dieing laughing because I would wait until he would name the ACM before I would make him blow up.  He is the perfect example of what I am talking about.  He knew every single one of them.  He knew the name and how to perform them, yet they were useless to my flat right turn.  

Anyway, i hope that clears it up a little. I will stand by this though.  If you try, even without any reading, you may figure it out.  Reading is good and it may excelerate things but not by match. Unless you are reading about the 'strategy' of the fight.  After all, half of it is making the other guy guess wrong.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by 332nd outlaw
first - in real time fights thinking is just a concept.what murdr is talking about is training one to see then know what to do. the brain thinks alot faster then we can realize it does therefore if u train your mind to think about what u see it can do the thinking alot quicker then u can think. the idea is to train to reconize what u see and to get to know what ACM is effective against it so that u can do it. the training starts with talking and showing then as time goes along the thinking out loud is replaced by the unheard thinking and thus the feeling of it becoming second nature.

I know what he is saying.  We are almost saying the same thing.  Practice and training are the same thing to me.  I think thats where the misunderstanding is.

second - if all ur doing is reacting to what they are doing then 2 things will happen he will fly to his advantage and u will allow him too. the one that is in control is the one that will win a fight.

I am not talking reacting defensively.  Reacting to what he does.  Change your approach to the fight every second based on the changes in his direction, e-states, etc.  If you don't do that, you are fighting a different fight and not that guy    Trust me on that.  It works really well for me and if you think about it, it is what you do also.  Simple example, you merge with a guy and you are thinking imel.  However, the guy make a sallow left turn.  Do you still imel or do you react to what he did and change your approach to the fight?

[Spatula]

Originally posted by Charlie
my squad has a monthly DA going and there are about 3 guys I cant beat.  They seem to have better ACM tactics than me.  Right now we are fighitng the hurri Mk1 and these guys jsut seem to always outturn me and I am no sllouch when it comes to furballing.

Is there an AH website that explains how the physics in AH work for furballing/turnfight etc?

cheers

Hi Charlie. As an answer to your question, i think carwash has given you a damn fine starting point. I thoroughly recommend getting a copy of Shaw's Fighter Combat. Best money ever spent.
Think someone mentioned in this thread, but i'll pseudo-paraphrase shaw: "The angles tactician has two options: either turn harder or turn smarter." In a neutral merge, and identical aircraft, the guy who out-turns you, will thereafter have less energy than you as they bleed more than you to get around. You can capitalise on this and i think Ren mentioned one possibility on how to exploit this fact. Turning faster doesn't always yield victory - remember this and you're 1/2 way there.

Of course there are several factors which can help your turn rate, if you want to get around faster than your opponent:
 - speed. The guys who gets around inside the turn of the other is often the slower of the two (in classic dueling merge). Excess speed can be as bad as none. Learn to control your speed through throttle management and nose-up/down techniques and keep close to your aircrafts corner velocity. Don't forget flaps if your aircraft can get em out and they help not hinder your turn.
 - angles/lead-turn. They may simply be starting their turn before you do. Learn to recognise the tell-tale signs of someone attempting to set you up with a lead-turn and counter them, or better yet, set them up for your own.
 - stall limiter. If its on, turn it off! If you have been flying with it on, turning it off will give you a whole new challenge on avoiding accelerated-stalls, but once you're on top of that, you will be able to pull more deg/sec at any instance.
 - ride those Gs!

I'm a kiwi, so our time-zones are a damn-near perfect match, so PM me and i'd be happy to help you out!

[Connery]

nice userful links in here carwash thank you.