Author Topic: Oregon Governor screws Oregon (Read 1435 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #15 on:** November 08, 2007, 09:02:39 AM »

ok crok-it....

explain how forcing me to pay for your medical bills is not socialism.

lazs

crockett · « **Reply #16 on:** November 08, 2007, 10:00:10 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
ok crok-it....

explain how forcing me to pay for your medical bills is not socialism.

lazs

Sure if you explain how giving big business no bid contracts, bail outs that me as a small business owner would never see and the same with the subsidies they get as well as the unfair tax breaks.

When I mention tax breaks it's because Big Business pays far less of a percentage than a normal person or small business owner. So yes I consider that a hand out because it's basically giving them a unfair advantage, by not making them pay the same tax precentage as I do.

Do you think having a govt funded police dept is socialism? What about a fire dept? Is that socialism? Is getting your mail everyday from the US post office socialism?

Are city workers whom take care of our streets socialism? Lard the list goes on and on.. yet the only thing you righties care to claim is socialism is when it has to do with helping others.

Guess what Lard, your precious tax dollars are wasted on a crap load of things.. Why aren't you crying socialism about that? Black water just got a 15 billion dollar contract to fight narcoterrorism. Another useless made up war.

Why aren't you upset about that Lard it's "your" tax money that's being used for something that doesn't benefit you, much less anyone else. So why aren't you screaming socialism about all this stuff that the govt provides using our tax dollars?

At least show a little consistency then, maybe, just maybe you might not sound like someone whom is a selfish old hag.

Guess what, I pay taxes too and I'd much rather see "my" tax dollars wasted helping others rather than just profiting a few. Sorry, I guess I must be a Liberal someone who actually cares about other people rather than just myself.

Trell · « **Reply #17 on:** November 08, 2007, 11:48:25 AM »

wow I actuualy agree. Great post Crockett

lazs2 · « **Reply #18 on:** November 08, 2007, 02:30:43 PM »

crock-it... that was stirring but it did not answer the question... how is my being forced to pay your medical not socialism?

You are talking to the wrong guy if you think I want all the "services" you talk about given to me by the government. I think the government should raise money for legeslative and judical branches and for an army and that't it.

simply because we have some socialism is no excuse to heap on more. There is no justification there.

As for city and state services... these of course are not federal and... if you don't like to pay for streets or garbage... move a few miles. big difference between choice and force.

I am not a fan of subsidies... tell you what.. lets get rid of em.. not... add more as you want.

There is just so much wrong with what you say that I can't even begin to straighten you out without pages of explanation.

But suffice it to say that it appears that you admit that socialized medicine is socialism.

at least... that is what I got.. even tho I had to sift through a lot of mindless and incorrect rant to get to it.

If you think that "incorrect" is too harsh... I will be glad to debate every single one of your points one at a time.

lazs

Walkersteelhead · « **Reply #19 on:** November 08, 2007, 08:46:17 PM »

Living in Oregon I think they need to fix the health plan that we already have before they try to get a new one. I mailed mine in and I received a letter that my signature on my registration did not match my ballot so I have to re register to vote all together. What ever.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #20 on:** November 08, 2007, 10:48:51 PM »

Quote

Main Entry: so·cial·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈsô-shə-ˌli-zəm\
Function: noun
Date: 1837
1: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods

2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state

3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done

Municipal police departments, fire departments, and street departments are not "means of production and distribution of goods", so no socialism.

Welfare is an 'unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done', so socialism.

Distribution of health care regardless of the ability to pay: socialism

rpm · « **Reply #21 on:** November 08, 2007, 11:08:04 PM »

The Republicans call it "socialized medicine", Democrats call it "universal health care". Whatever you call it, it's not a bad thing when anyone can get medical care when they need it, not just the ones that can afford it.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #22 on:** November 08, 2007, 11:17:44 PM »

However you distribute health care, it must be paid for by a sound financial underpinnings.

Thats why I voted against this particular scheme, a guaranteed recipe for uncontrolled government bloat and eventual bankruptcy .

rpm · « **Reply #23 on:** November 09, 2007, 12:09:00 AM »

As I said before, the money would not go to healthcare. As soon as it was approved, they would reappropriate it.
The "think of the children" campaign is usually a sure fire winner for stuff like that.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #24 on:** November 09, 2007, 12:11:27 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by rpm
The Republicans call it "socialized medicine", Democrats call it "universal health care". Whatever you call it, it's not a bad thing when anyone can get medical care when they need it, not just the ones that can afford it.

Any time you take someone's money for ANY reason without their permission, it's a bad thing.

rpm · « **Reply #25 on:** November 09, 2007, 12:13:26 AM »

So any tax is a bad thing?

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #26 on:** November 09, 2007, 12:18:21 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by rpm
So any tax is a bad thing?

Any income tax is. Usage taxes are necessities.

rpm · « **Reply #27 on:** November 09, 2007, 12:23:10 AM »

So how do you propose to pay for the military? Even if they all volunteer to fight for free, you still have to feed, clothe, outfit and train them. Or are they just a bunch of socialists?

rpm · « **Reply #28 on:** November 09, 2007, 01:17:13 AM »

(tap, tap, tap) Hello? Is this thing on?
Ground Control to Major Tom....

lazs2 · « **Reply #29 on:** November 09, 2007, 09:16:05 AM »

I will answer.. all taxes are evil. the constitution does provide for supporting the government tho.. that would be an army and the legeslative and the judicial branches... nothing else.

socialized medicine is evil.. it does hurt to force someone to pay for anothers lifestyle and health. Why is health a right? why is a doctors labor the property of those who wont pay for it? why is mine?

Why do you rpm.. live in a better house than someone else? should you not pay for a home for others? should you not move some in to your home?

At what point are you uncomfortable with paying for others lifestyle?

I know what my point is.. that point would be.. I will pay to raise an army to protect us all... I will pay for a system of justice to make sure everyone gets a fair trial and that the constitution is upheld.

Anything else.. is state or local and I can participate or not. I will pay fees for services I find useful and I will give to charities that I choose.

you can shove your socialism up your butt.

lazs