Author Topic: Pattern work - gear down and locked (Read 491 times)

Chairboy · « **on:** January 12, 2008, 12:57:57 AM »

Did some pattern work today after I got outta the office. Flew over to KEUG to do some touch & goes. Sorta shared the pattern with a Navy E6 (he was in right traffic for 16R and I was nextdoor doing left traffic for 16L), that was interesting. They were doing touch & goes too, pretty impressive to watch.

Every time they got a clearance for the option, they respond back with "Marlin XYZ, cleared to land 16 right, gear down and locked". Every time, "Gear down and locked" in his readback to tower.

Is this a Navy thing? I've heard military towers say "check gear down", was he just saying the same thing he says there by rote?

When they were done, they got an IFR clearance back to Whidbey. That's about a two hour flight for me, I guess it's somewhat faster for them.

LePaul · « **Reply #1 on:** January 12, 2008, 01:38:27 AM »

707s are pretty

Here where Im at, the KC-135s are now being re-fitted with turbofans, giving up their turbojets.

Muuuch quieter, as I am on the approach path to 33

We also get a lot of traffic from C-5As and Navy P3s. I'll miss those when they leave Brunswick NAS.

ASTAC · « **Reply #2 on:** January 12, 2008, 07:09:56 AM »

"Gear Down and Locked" is standard Navy phraseology.

When I'm controlling SH-60B's on approach to the ship I have to tell them to report gear down and locked even though the Seahawk has fixed landing gear.

Jarski · « **Reply #3 on:** January 12, 2008, 10:07:50 AM »

Finnish Air Force also uses same kind of of RTF. If they do not report gear we have to ask for them before giving landing clearance. A pretty good safety feature if you ask me.

We do not have to ask that if the plane has fixed undercarriage tho... I have felt myself stupid sometimes when requesting gear check from trainer with fixed gear... oops.

ASTAC · « **Reply #4 on:** January 12, 2008, 10:36:11 AM »

Well now that I think about it, the Seahawk does have a retractable post that is considered part of the landing gear. It goes into the Recovery Assist "trap" which then grips the post to keep the helo from sliding off the deck in rough weather.

Here's a pic of one using the cable to "reel it in"

one hovering over the RAST

Yknurd · « **Reply #5 on:** January 12, 2008, 11:33:03 AM »

See Rule #4

cpxxx · « **Reply #6 on:** January 12, 2008, 11:56:34 AM »

I think the military use it a lot. I seem to remember the RAF had a guy at the end of he runway with a flare gun. If you forgot your gear he would fire a red one.

The Irish Air Corps always say 'finals three green'. That probably came about when they were taking delivery of their first Spitfire two seater. He beat up the field impressively and then landed perfectly on his belly.

It's a good idea for civilians too, at least to say it in your mind. Even in fixed gear aircraft I include 'undercarriage down' in my pre landing checks. It's a good habit.

eagl · « **Reply #7 on:** January 12, 2008, 12:12:17 PM »

USAF flying regulations require that a "gear down" call be made prior to every approach or landing, regardless of what field they are at. It's really no different than the FAA requiring pilots to repeat hold, taxi, and takeoff instructions. I assume that all of the services have a similar requirement.

Golfer · « **Reply #8 on:** January 12, 2008, 07:54:35 PM »

I believe from an ATC standpoint regarding military airplanes, if the pilot reports the gear down then the tower doesn't have to solicit/say "check wheels down" to issue a landing clearance.

Eagl would know if the preemptive gear down call does or not still require the controller to issue a check gear down call. It's been a while since I had that conversation with the guys who told me. Basically it's a way for the pilots to help out the controller and save a few seconds on the frequency.

Rolex · « **Reply #9 on:** January 12, 2008, 08:15:11 PM »

In Naval Aviation, instructors want to hear 3 gear calls in the pattern. At a military field during FCLP (Field Carrier Landing Practice) and at CARQUALS (Carrier Qualifications), the calls are part of the calls made at pattern points e.g., a/c no., position (at the 180, 90 and 45), a/c configuration (hook up or down, flaps, gear down) and fuel weight.

LePaul · « **Reply #10 on:** January 12, 2008, 10:03:42 PM »

See Rule #4

eagl · « **Reply #11 on:** January 12, 2008, 10:24:13 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Golfer
I believe from an ATC standpoint regarding military airplanes, if the pilot reports the gear down then the tower doesn't have to solicit/say "check wheels down" to issue a landing clearance.

Eagl would know if the preemptive gear down call does or not still require the controller to issue a check gear down call. It's been a while since I had that conversation with the guys who told me. Basically it's a way for the pilots to help out the controller and save a few seconds on the frequency.

I'm not too sure about the ATC requirements. I do know that if I delay a gear down call for some reason (T-37 single engine approaches may be flown gear up until the very final descent for example), I'll usually get prompted from the controller. But I don't think they will delay a landing clearance until after I give a gear down call.

Golfer · « **Reply #12 on:** January 12, 2008, 11:37:54 PM »

I don't mean that. I mean if you call up that your wheels are down they don't need to issue a check wheels down call. The way I understand it is making the call on your initial contact or coming onto final without their prompting fulfills the requirement, whichever end it's on.

Jarski · « **Reply #13 on:** January 13, 2008, 06:46:30 AM »

If the pilot reports gear at some point before landing clearance is given then gear check will not be requested by the ATC.

Yknurd · « **Reply #14 on:** January 13, 2008, 09:00:24 AM »

See Rule #4