Author Topic: Stealth aircraft (Read 962 times)

myelo · « **on:** February 20, 2008, 03:33:18 PM »

I'm trying out approximately how many combat missions stealth aircraft have flown. Does anyone have any links or ideas?

Airscrew · « **Reply #1 on:** February 20, 2008, 03:38:21 PM »

Sorties? or Operations. going all the way back to at least Panama? or was it Grenada...

myelo · « **Reply #2 on:** February 20, 2008, 03:41:47 PM »

sorties

just a rough idea, doesn't have to be precise number

AWMac · « **Reply #3 on:** February 20, 2008, 03:43:38 PM »

Panama.

Myelo just call the U.S. Air Force Public Affairs Office and ask... remember use a heavy Arabic accent and stay on the phone for longer than 3 minutes.

Mac

trax1 · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2008, 03:43:41 PM »

Well the F-117 flew 1,300 sorties in the 91 Gulf War

trax1 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 20, 2008, 03:49:44 PM »

Also what aircraft are you including in the "Stealth" category? Are you wanting to include the F-22 Raptor and the F-35 JSF? And are you wanting to include the SR-71 Blackbird which was stealthy.

Airscrew · « **Reply #6 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:02:21 PM »

heres some info, not much but a place to start

http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airchronicles/apj/apj97/spr97/arkin.html

Regulator · « **Reply #7 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:05:17 PM »

Do you have a "need to know"?

Are you a communist, a spy, a traitor or a democrat?

myelo · « **Reply #8 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:13:41 PM »

My need to know is I'm arguing with someone who says stealth AC are useless and a waste of money because they can be easily shot down despite the technology. When I pointed out that only 1 stealth AC had ever been shot down in combat, he said that's because they have rarely been used.

Airscrew thnks for the link.

eagl · « **Reply #9 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:18:36 PM »

That other guy is wrong. They've been used on thousands of sorties, and they've been used multiple times on "day one" missions kicking down the door inside a heavily defended area, without a single loss during those highest risk missions. In fact, the only stealth loss came in a mature conflict in a theater where the enemy probably had access to our air tasking order and routes of flight.

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #10 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:35:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by eagl
In fact, the only stealth loss came in a mature conflict in a theater where the enemy probably had access to our air tasking order and routes of flight.

According to the Serbian officer in command of the SAM battery, that is exactly the information he had. In an interview he gave, he said they were able to listen in on NATO radio communications, including conversations between pilots and AWACS air controllers. Through these intercepts, the Serbians were able to figure out the air routes and targets.

They also claim to have modified the SA-3 Goa's warhead to emit electromagnetic waves because our stealth technology doesn't take into account older long pulse duration radars. If they did modify their warheads, would the modification work, at least in theory?

But I believe if they didn't know the routes and targets, the F-117 wouldn't have been shot down.

ack-ack

LePaul · « **Reply #11 on:** February 20, 2008, 04:58:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
According to the Serbian officer in command of the SAM battery, that is exactly the information he had. In an interview he gave, he said they were able to listen in on NATO radio communications, including conversations between pilots and AWACS air controllers. Through these intercepts, the Serbians were able to figure out the air routes and targets.

They also claim to have modified the SA-3 Goa's warhead to emit electromagnetic waves because our stealth technology doesn't take into account older long pulse duration radars. If they did modify their warheads, would the modification work, at least in theory?

But I believe if they didn't know the routes and targets, the F-117 wouldn't have been shot down.

ack-ack

The other thing I heard on this was the Stealth's were flying the same flight corridor repeatedly. They'd get a slight "blip" and moved more SAMs to that spot...and got a luck shot that took it down.

How true that is, I dont know.

Reference the Golden BB Axiom

Airscrew · « **Reply #12 on:** February 20, 2008, 05:23:17 PM »

some more stuff

http://aviationtrivia.homestead.com/F117.html

Quote

The F-117 first saw action on 12/20/89 during Operation Just Cause in Panama. During Operation Desert Storm in January and February of 1991 the F-117 was the only Coalition fixed wing aircraft allowed to strike targets in- side Baghdad's city limits. Although only 36 F-117s were deployed in a total force of some 1,900 fighters and bombers, they flew more than 33% of the bombing missions on the first day of the war. In all the F-117 flew more than 1,250 sorties, dropped more than 2,000 tons of bombs, and flew over 6,900 hours of missions.

http://www.afa.org/magazine/dec1996/1296storm.asp

Quote

Desert Storm marked the first large-scale employment of stealth aircraft--the F-117--equipped with precision weapons. The combination has revolutionized warfare. The F-117's stealthiness enabled us to achieve surprise every day of the war, attack any target we wanted, and leverage the capabilities of other assets. The F-117s delivered the first strikes, destroying a wide array of critical targets and paralyzing the Iraqi air defense network. Their attacks on the radar sites and command, control, and communications bunkers that controlled the Iraqi defenses opened the door for wave after wave of nonstealthy aircraft to strike effectively and, most important, safely. The F-117's ability to paralyze the Iraqi air defense network in the opening minutes of the war was critical to gaining air superiority, a vital prerequisite to ejecting the Iraqi Army from Kuwait.

Quote

In 1995, my chief master attack planner from Desert Storm calculated the "value" of stealth, or the stealth "multiplier effect," in a bomber study for the Commission on Roles and Missions of the Armed Forces. He found that, in the first twenty-four hours of the Gulf War air campaign, each F-117 sortie was "worth" sixteen nonstealth sorties. As Iraqi air defenses were whittled down, this ratio leveled off about one to eight--still extraordinary. The B-2, equally stealthy but with eight times the payload and five times the range, multiplies even the F-117 "multiplier" and opens the door to large-scale air campaigns prosecuted from outside the theater. Unfortunately, not many people know this because the commission chose not to publish the data.

C(Sea)Bass · « **Reply #13 on:** February 20, 2008, 05:55:46 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by LePaul
The other thing I heard on this was the Stealth's were flying the same flight corridor repeatedly. They'd get a slight "blip" and moved more SAMs to that spot...and got a luck shot that took it down.

How true that is, I dont know.

Reference the Golden BB Axiom

I forgot where i read it, but i saw an account given by the pilot of the F-117. He said that 2 missles were fired that he knows of. The first was not even close, but the second came close enough to he aircraft without hitting it, to put it into a spin, from which he could not recover.

ChickenHawk · « **Reply #14 on:** February 20, 2008, 05:59:15 PM »

What I want to know is why the Nighthawk has an 'F' designation. Should be B-117.