P-39 Handeling

[Urchin]

Well, you sure as hell don't want to use flaps when fighting in a P-39D... Mind boggling drag. 25 second circles is simply awful. Stay away from the flaps and it's pretty good until you scrub off all of your E. It reminds me of the P-40s, but is actually inferior should you dump flaps. Not a lot of power to play with.

On the other hand, the P-39Q gets around a circle in 17.5 seconds clean, at 154 mph. That's better than the 109F-4, 109G-2, C.202, C.205 and very similar to the Spit16... As I measure it, the P-39Q fits in between the Ki-81 and La-5 in turn radius and rate in clean condition, without gun pods.

I'll do more comprehensive testing over the weekend.

Speed figures for the P-39Q were checked (no gun pods). 329 mph @ SL, 374 mph @ 9.7k (this should be critical altitude for the Q). I managed 380 mph @ 11k and 382 @ 12k. So, speed from sea level to 12k is as good or better than the F6F-5, but I don't understand why the P-39Q adheres to the MIL power speed curve by altitude. It should make its best speed at 9.7k in WEP. However, it isn't a big problem.

My regards,

Widewing

Whats with the huge difference in performance between the two models?  There is only a 50 hp difference between them, but the P-39D is an absolute dog.  Even with wingpods I found the P-39Q to be very much superior.  Anyone tried fighting the two against eachother? 

[cbizkit]

The biggest issue I found with it last night was it's terrible roll rate at low speed particularly in a rolling scissors. As Widewing indicated, flaps out kills your speed incredibly fast so getting in a scissors fight with someone who knows how to execute it will leave you wallowing. It seemed decent other then that in turning capabilities. Flaps up I was having no real trouble with your average spit/n1k2. Dodging B&Z attacks requires you to have more E then many other planes in order to roll quickly out of the way. Rudder assisted rolls definately help and it doesn't greatly increase instability.

Did anyone else feel like the P39 required a lot more stick input to get to the edge? Feels like the elevator authority is a bit weak, I wasn't having trouble reaching the buffet or stalling out right but it required a lot more pull then is common with other planes I fly regularly.

[Squire]

There has been entirely too much poorly researched quotes ala the P-39 and spins, imho. Boyd Wagner and Charles King, both USAAF aces, said quite a bit re: the P-39, and neither stated that it spun any worse than other fighters of the time.  

Personally, I think that some early, inexperienced, USAAC pilots who tried to "dogfight" with the P-39 vs the Japanese, spun it, and it started getting a bad rep with some of them. Many of the early P-39 pilots had few hrs in it before going to the SW Pacific, which excacerbated the problem.

The Russians also seemed to think it was a very manueverable fighter at low level, and it was a very popular fighter in the VVS from 1942-45. Few of the Russian pilots seem to talk about its "spinning" any more than a LA-5, or a Yak-9 series.

Can you spin it? absolutley you can. Can you stall it? yes.

P-39Q vs P-39D. The P-39Q was rated at a higher manifold pressure, it was more than just 50 h.p.

[Noir]

Indeed, you need to pull the stick a lot to get a good turn rate. Cutting power doesn't help much to turn tighter at high speed.

[Charge]

"There has been entirely too much poorly researched quotes ala the P-39 and spins, imho. Boyd Wagner and Charles King, both USAAF aces, said quite a bit re: the P-39, and neither stated that it spun any worse than other fighters of the time."

Yet there are anecdotes telling otherwise + aerodynamic prerequisites and special weight distribution to support that it may have been more prone for flat spins than more "conventional" aircraft.

What do you mean poorly researched, BTW?

-C+

[Saxman]

After playing around with my squad last night (combination of gunnery practice and just plain tooling around) F4Us should completely dominate the P-39D in most fights.

[Krusty]

"There has been entirely too much poorly researched quotes ala the P-39 and spins, imho. Boyd Wagner and Charles King, both USAAF aces, said quite a bit re: the P-39, and neither stated that it spun any worse than other fighters of the time."

Yet there are anecdotes telling otherwise + aerodynamic prerequisites and special weight distribution to support that it may have been more prone for flat spins than more "conventional" aircraft.

What do you mean poorly researched, BTW?

-C+

I agree. The plane could not be flown without ammo in the nose guns. Ballast had to be added before you could take off.

I'd like to see where HTC got their info that the P-39Q should out-turn spitfires, 109s, n1k2s, and a host of the tightest-turning planes in the game...

 

I was expecting it to turn okay, but being in the top tier of turn planes? Already they're saying the 39D is going to give a6ms the fits in FSO because of its handling and turning, and this just wasn't historically the case.

[cbizkit]

I was expecting it to turn okay, but being in the top tier of turn planes? Already they're saying the 39D is going to give a6ms the fits in FSO because of its handling and turning, and this just wasn't historically the case.

I'd want to see some real testing numbers before going that far. It certainly didn't feel like it was turning like a Spit5 or a Huri. The stability at low speeds I think is the main component at being able to turn with spits and niki's, which most of the time are not pilotted by the top tier sticks. I would be surprised if its flaps up turn radius is equal or better then say a Spit9.

[Krusty]

Same here.

I didn't really run it through the wringer. I flew a couple of sorties with the D (got 4 assists and 1 kill *sigh*), and a lot of aiming/fun/screwingaround offline, but it didn't seem as manuverable as some have been saying.

Turning with n1k2s and spixteens?

[Noir]

I did turn with 16's on the deck for a while, until I had no E. Then the P39 turned into a flapless P47

[Ghosth]

Well not everyone fly's slow speed as well as Bighorn either Krusty. 

Same here.

I didn't really run it through the wringer. I flew a couple of sorties with the D (got 4 assists and 1 kill *sigh*), and a lot of aiming/fun/screwingaround offline, but it didn't seem as manuverable as some have been saying.

Turning with n1k2s and spixteens?

[Urchin]

After playing around with my squad last night (combination of gunnery practice and just plain tooling around) F4Us should completely dominate the P-39D in most fights.

You say that like the F4U's won't completely dominate the cast majority of the planeset in most fights.

[BaDkaRmA158Th]

You say that like the F4U's won't completely dominate the cast majority of the planeset in most fights.

Agreed, the f4u's all fly like butter fly's with full flaps down, for about a week i did not even use the hook while landing on the carrier.
Beating a p39 who's slow and with flaps that HURT its turn, you won, duh.

[Old Sport]

It reminds me of the P-40s, but is actually inferior should you dump flaps. Not a lot of power to play with.

I'm sure you know the quip about the P-400.

A P-40 with a Zero on its tail.

[Saxman]

I'm not just talking about flaps down, but in the mid to upper speed range, as well.