Losing Force Feedback during game - still.

[vizwhiz]

I started a post over on Hardware BB for this, but the longer I've played with it, the more I've noticed that it is only in AH, and the losses are not consistent.  I thought it was my joystick dying, but now I'm not so sure.

I have a USB Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 twisty-stick for the last couple years, and it has served me very well.  I never had problems with losing the FF until just a couple weeks ago.  During the game, I'll be flying along, though it seems to happen most when low over a base (landing, deacking, etc.).  I'll be flying along and "poof", I lose the fore/aft force feedback...stick goes limp.  I have FF left/right and twisty, but not fore/aft.   

I tried logging and reloading game, but that didn't bring it back.  OR, when it DID bring the FF back, it brought back fore/aft and lost the left/right instead!!  This also happened when I changed planes...I was flying spitty, lost fore/aft.  Landed, upped a Typhy, and I had fore/aft but no left/right...  I really started getting suspicious at this point.  I'm thinking it's in the game.

I then tried logging and pulling the USB out (and the power) and then re-inserting and starting AH again.  This works for a short while, then "poof", it goes out again.

The thing is, as soon as I log off and close AH, the stick works fine (in just Windows) or when I bring up the Sidewinder control panel, right after it was NOT working in AH (didn't reboot or anything, just closed AH).  It only seems to happen again once I'm back in AH. 

Is there something that changed recently in AH that could be causing this??
Thanks in advance!   

[Halo46]

Have you tried using a powered USB port?

[Skuzzy]

Sounds like the stick is being reset by the USB bus.  Happens if too much power is drawn over the USB bus.  As a stick gets olders it can draw more current.

[Estes]

I have the same stick, but the only force feedback I have enabled is return to center. And, I know that if your flying along
and you loosen your grip on the stick enough it thinks you have let go of the stick and it goes floppy.

[Hazard69]

I started a post over on Hardware BB for this, but the longer I've played with it, the more I've noticed that it is only in AH, and the losses are not consistent.  I thought it was my joystick dying, but now I'm not so sure.

I have a USB Microsoft Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 twisty-stick for the last couple years, and it has served me very well.  I never had problems with losing the FF until just a couple weeks ago.  During the game, I'll be flying along, though it seems to happen most when low over a base (landing, deacking, etc.).  I'll be flying along and "poof", I lose the fore/aft force feedback...stick goes limp.  I have FF left/right and twisty, but not fore/aft.  

I tried logging and reloading game, but that didn't bring it back.  OR, when it DID bring the FF back, it brought back fore/aft and lost the left/right instead!!  This also happened when I changed planes...I was flying spitty, lost fore/aft.  Landed, upped a Typhy, and I had fore/aft but no left/right...  I really started getting suspicious at this point.  I'm thinking it's in the game.

I then tried logging and pulling the USB out (and the power) and then re-inserting and starting AH again.  This works for a short while, then "poof", it goes out again.

The thing is, as soon as I log off and close AH, the stick works fine (in just Windows) or when I bring up the Sidewinder control panel, right after it was NOT working in AH (didn't reboot or anything, just closed AH).  It only seems to happen again once I'm back in AH. 

Is there something that changed recently in AH that could be causing this??
Thanks in advance!  

I have almost the exact same problem. I have a Saitek Cyborg Evo and on occasion I lose the FF. Although in my case its both axes that go limp. The spring in the Evo is pretty lame by itself (especially compared against my earlier Cyborg 3D). This leads me to have default spring on (at all times) and when FF goes that goes too.
Might be the same issue with me as weel. Willl try using a different USB port.

[vizwhiz]

Thanks for all the feedback.  I think Skuzzy might be right about the USB resetting... I'll find out over the next couple nights.

I actually plug my joystick into a USB port on my keyboard (I know, I know...I can hear the groans) and this normally works well enough for what I do.  I get good frame rates normally and don't have much stick trouble.  (I think it's more my flying than my stick.) 
Anyway, I have it set up like this because the computer itself is in a cabinet and I can't get the cable to the computer easy, so I just plugged into my Microsoft keyboard...
So I recently changed the port on the computer that I have the keyboard plugged into (to get a faster connection for other reasons - like WORK), and I never connected the two problems until Skuzzy mentioned that...I never knew that the computer would do something like that once it was up and running.  It started happening when I heard about the game changes, and I had changed my video settings also (to 512), so I completely overlooked the change in ports.

I've moved it back and we'll see what happens now.
If this turns out to be what the problem was, is there a way to tell that port to "stop" resetting the USB hub??

Thanks to all who replied!   

[Skuzzy]

The port resets due to too much current being drawn through it.  All USB ports have a curret limit they can supply.  When it is exceeded the USB chip resets itself.

The best thing to do, in your situation, would be to get an external powered USB hub and use it.  Exernally powered USB hubs have a tendency to be more stable under higher current loads than the USB ports in your computer.

[vizwhiz]

Sounds good...I flew last night after returning the port to the old location and had no problems at all ('cept for getting shot down!), so I'm thinking that this is the right answer.  Thanks again for the help! 

[vizwhiz]

Skuzzy,
Before I run out and buy a powered USB hub, and I was thinking about this during the week, I was wondering...isn't the need for a powered USB hub usually for devices that are NOT powered by a separate power supply??
My Sidewinder FF2 has a straight 110V power cord on it!  Is that just for making the little green light turn on?
I know that when the power is disconnected there is no FF at all, so I am assuming that the FF servos/coils get their power directly from the 110V input.  If this is the case, why would the USB port be drawing any more power than it does without the FF enabled - it isn't supplying the power for the FF itself, is it?
Thanks

[Skuzzy]

All USB devices draw power fom the USB bus.  The separate power suply for the stick is to drive the force feedbakc motor as it patently exceeds the currnet draw of the USB bus.

An external powered USB hub draws all its power from the external power source and only depends on the computer supplied power to keep the bus alive. which is the least amont of power a USB device can draw.