Author Topic: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!  (Read 7288 times)

Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #90 on: April 12, 2008, 12:27:54 AM »
huh?If you take it out of context, yep.  I'm saying you cant rtb to land kills and furball at the same time.  Is that semantics?

This is different than your earlier claim, and yes, that is semantics.  Risk and furballing are not the same thing, otherwise we are guilty of serious equivocation.

When you say "at the same time," I have to interpret you as saying "furball, and then rtb"... otherwise you're pointing out something everyone already knows by definition.

Anyway, I'm very happy the furballers will continue to furball, while I energy fight and shoot them all down, followed by a 3-point landing. :D
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Offline BiPoLaR

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #91 on: April 12, 2008, 12:59:25 AM »
Dude its a damn game...not Physics class..good lord
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Offline RoGenT

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #92 on: April 12, 2008, 01:20:33 AM »
To each their own is how I see it. As for myself, I'm not Saint, I have picked numberous times. I just try to stay out of 1vs1 unless the baddies is on my squaddie/countryman's six. I mainly B/Z because that is what the pony is good for mainly. I'll TnB when I need to, regardless if I have no chance or not, i'll do it.  As for furballs, hell, I love B/Zing into hordes while avoiding baddies who are higher then me  :aok

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Offline moot

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #93 on: April 12, 2008, 05:05:19 AM »
It's semantics to argue that if you take the whole minutes required to RTB and land, you aren't actively fighting - in an argument where the difference between the two is the crux of the matter?  You concede it's not, but add that everyone knew that already?  LOL Is that energy rhetorics?
Quote
I don't see what's incompatible between putting yourself at risk and landing kills.
" I'm saying you cant rtb to land kills and furball at the same time. " = Reduced time fighting to allow for RTB = reduced time allowed for fighting = reduced risk.  Is that equivocal? 
« Last Edit: April 12, 2008, 05:07:00 AM by moot »
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Offline mechanic

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #94 on: April 12, 2008, 06:48:48 AM »
Furballing is what happens when good sticks get bored with energy fighting and say 'I can still shoot you down without starting from some kind of major advantage'.  The fact that you have an advantage to start a fight is NOT a skill in this virtual world. It simply relies on the fact that the other guy cannot be bothered. Does anyone really think you're just the smartest pilot around because you are the highest?? thats crazy talk man. If everyone played to win from advantage like this the furballers would beat smart flyers black and blue at the altitude grabbing game, you have the advantage not through skill but because furballers give it to you and still stick around to fight it out.



the simple fact comes down to this.

If you can furball and do so regularly there is a good chance you are also skilled at energy fighting

If you only energy fight and never furball you are most certainly limiting your virtual skills and forcing yourself to be a run tard when confronted by equal advantage.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2008, 06:56:44 AM by mechanic »
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Offline ink

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #95 on: April 12, 2008, 09:22:56 AM »


"...Anyway, I'm very happy the furballers will continue to furball, while I energy fight and shoot them all down, followed by a 3-point landing. :D
[/quote]







lol  and you think you "fight" 

Offline Rino

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #96 on: April 12, 2008, 09:29:10 AM »
     Man this wheel never stops....you really truly don't have to justify your playing style..really, I mean it.
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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #97 on: April 12, 2008, 10:16:22 AM »
I love this.  Each side whining at the other.

I play every aspect of the game in every style in every plane.  Doing so, I can't take sides in a debate like this because I'm not all the way on one side or the other.  I do what I feel like doing when I log on to the extent that the situation allows it (sometimes there's just no good furballs, sometimes there's just no good buff targets, etc.).  My "job" when I am logged on is to have fun!  Nothing else.  I'm not there to please anyone other than myself.

Courage?  In a cartoon game?  Give me a break.

I do play for score/rank to an extent but I'll happily dive into a me on ten to fight it out.  Playing for score/rank and fighting are not mutually exclusive.  The way I see it, fighting and killing my opponents is where I score and as long as I can take care of myself in a fight the score/rank will take care of itself (you'll notice I don't try to "protect" my fighter scores by flying in attack mode).  I love the thrill of a good heart-pounding fight but if I'm bingo ammo or low on fuel or missing half a wing you can bet I'm getting out of dodge.

Whining on 200?  Pointless.  Whining on the BBs?  Pointless.

I say go out and have as much fun as you can.  If you lack the skills to be confident in a fight, learn them.  If you decide you don't want to learn them, then don't, but you'll never get the full enjoyment from the game.

Now quit whining and let's go play!
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Offline Flash

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #98 on: April 12, 2008, 10:48:41 AM »
what if everybody where pickers, i wonder what the alt would go to. because everyone would try to get above the other. then it would take a long to to get to a fight, lots of time just riding.

Offline BnZ

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #99 on: April 12, 2008, 10:56:08 AM »


If you can furball and do so regularly there is a good chance you are also skilled at energy fighting



Mechanic,
You used the word E-fight, instead of talking about people who OPHA only and never attempt to kill anything aware of their presence, so I'm going to have to call you on it...
No, there is a world of difference between between a co-e "duel" between similar rides and trying to E fight a good-turning kite with a brick. Given pilots of equal skill, the latter is far more difficult. Getting a kill is alot easier in a ride that can out-turn/turn with and "saddle up" on what it happens to be fighting at the moment, there is not even a debate about this. In a flight sim, (as opposed to a real war) ease of killing shares at least equal desireability
with ease of survival, therefore  equal dweebishness if we wish to speak in those terms.

Altitudes of the fighters in our  "air war" will be dictated by the altitude at which the aircraft which actually win the war operate (bombers, jabos, and in our case, the goon). Since they tend to operate rather low in AH, and since local air superiority right over the bases is what moves the map in this game, its a low alt world there is virtually no action and not much point going above above 15K. Nothing to do with most players being too morally righteous to grab alt. 15K is not that high, 5 minutes or so in the worst climbing rides available.

If the strategy of the MA revolved around hordes of bombers tooling along at 25K, 90% of the action would be from 15 to 30K instead.

If everyone played to win from advantage like this the furballers would beat smart flyers black and blue at the altitude grabbing game, you have the advantage not through skill but because furballers give it to you and still stick around to fight it out."

There is no advantage which skill can give you in hitting the alt-x command :D And if one were to carry climbing to too much of an extreme, if you were hanging around at 30K in the MA for instance, there would be no point as one would be too high to protect/intercept, nay, even to see, friendly/enemy aircraft.

Circumstances also alter cases. For the lone P-51 encountering a co-e or better Spit16, it is entirely appropriate  to try a turn or two to see if the Spit16 makes any mistakes, then bug if it does not. The P-51 is unlikely to survive a stall fight with a decent pilot in the Spixteen, and building a usuable E advantage will be a long process if possible at all. If we replace the Spit with a Hurri, then the P-51 can conceivably build a usable E advantage in a practical amount of time.  If the same P-51 encounters a lone FW-190 co-e, then the P-51 driver will likely be the one pressing hard for an angles fight. The moral fiber or whatever BS we are speaking of in regards to the P-51 driver has not changed, merely the circumstance.

If you only energy fight and never furball you are most certainly limiting your virtual skills

I am a believer in keeping the tools sharp.
I was up until the wee hours of the morning last night in the DA with a squaddie, flying a low Hurricane MkI and helping him practice E fighting against a more maneuverable plane. It seems undeniable to me that in a 1v1, the man flying the Hurricane has the easier time evading attack and pushing the brick-flyer out in front than the latter does in trying to get a telling shot in without losing position. Then I was the one in a 109 and 190A5, fighting the Zeke from  both E advantage and disadvantage. Once again, while the Zeke is quite killable with abit of E to work with, let me assure that the man in the brick has the harder task in terms of thinking one step ahead and gun solutions than the man in the kite.

DA and TA are open 24 hours a day and are a much better place to hone the skills than the chaotic MA. (Using the MA for practice is abit like going to a biker bar and picking fights instead of the gym to learn martial arts.) There is no requirement to needlessly sacrifice onself to the ubiquitous horde of gang-tards by getting into a stall fight right in the middle of them,for the learning process.


Offline mensa180

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #100 on: April 12, 2008, 11:10:41 AM »
How about we agree to disagree and go shoot each other down?  :devil
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #101 on: April 12, 2008, 11:13:07 AM »
It's semantics to argue that if you take the whole minutes required to RTB and land, you aren't actively fighting - in an argument where the difference between the two is the crux of the matter?  You concede it's not, but add that everyone knew that already?  LOL Is that energy rhetorics? " I'm saying you cant rtb to land kills and furball at the same time. " = Reduced time fighting to allow for RTB = reduced time allowed for fighting = reduced risk.  Is that equivocal? 

Moot, you're still adding more to what you said before, but passing it off as the same thing.  Arguing with me has caused you take better positions that are more clear than before. :rock.

What I said was equivocal was to treat as interchangeable "furballing" and "risk."

Still, the more the argument takes on the look of a definition instead of an empirical claim, the less it becomes worth fighting over.
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Offline IronDog

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #102 on: April 12, 2008, 11:47:23 AM »
what if everybody where pickers, i wonder what the alt would go to. because everyone would try to get above the other. then it would take a long to to get to a fight, lots of time just riding.

You hit it right on the head.W/O furballers pickers,bnz'ers,E fighters,tweeners, would have nothing to do.It all comes togather in a nice WWII flight sim called Aces High.
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Offline crockett

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #103 on: April 12, 2008, 03:16:05 PM »
This is a game, not a war or a history lesson. Historical tactics don't have to be applied. A game is just about having fun and some people have fun when they can master a plane, outfly their opponent and shoot them down. Picking is so easy it doesn't deserve any attention, IMHO. But if someone picks me and even <S> because he thinks he did a good job, sorry, I'm not gonna ignore this. And you know, you were there.

Lusche said it all, about this. I totally agree with him.

Nope, it's even worse.... it has become a sort of H2H pool, with green pilots and bad fliers. You can have good fights in MA.

That's the problem, IronDog: as I said earlier, picking is so much easier than dogfigthing..... there's NO SPORTSMANSHIP in picking someone who's already involved in a fight... so the picker should expect no sportsmanship in return, since he's the one not giving any in first place.

And finally.....

Can you mind your own business when someone's spoiling it?

You pretty much said it all and I agree with it, except the DA isn't that great of  place to find a fight. Unless you get someone to 1 on 1 with you. The furball lake is worse than the MA's with noobs and gang tards. 
"strafing"

Offline crockett

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Re: OK,enuff with the furballers mentality!
« Reply #104 on: April 12, 2008, 03:29:27 PM »
You hit it right on the head.W/O furballers pickers,bnz'ers,E fighters,tweeners, would have nothing to do.It all comes togather in a nice WWII flight sim called Aces High.
IronDog

It doesn't mesh together because pickers "depend" on getting easy kills when the other guy is busy fighting. A pick tard adds no benifit to the actual fight, they are leeches. Hence the reason people get pissed of at pick dweebs. There is a major diffrence in keeping your alt and mastering energy fighting vs being a picktard.

Not to mention 80% of the time when you go after a picktard they run off to their 5 buddies because 9 times out of 10 they can't fight their way out of a paper bag in a 1 on 1 at equal alt. Soon as they lose the advantage it's run to the deck like a school girl rather than actually fight and try to learn something.

I'm not a big fan of furballs myself, because it's ruled by the gang tard mentality. I like 1 on 1 fights or maybe a good 1 vs 2 but in this day and age it's always very hard to find them in the MA's. Well not with out the picktards and gangtards showing up. In short this game is full of tards and dweebs that think landing 5 or 6 noob kills is more impressive than fighting it out in a 1 on 1 with a good stick.
"strafing"