Author Topic: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia  (Read 740 times)

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2008, 03:19:55 PM »
Police will search cars if they suspect the presence of guns or drugs, and will arrest people who do not cooperate, under a charge of failure to obey a police officer, officials said.



Right there is where that pesky "probable cause" thing comes in to play. This is a rare occasion where I think lawyers can actually improve things.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline lasersailor184

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8938
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2008, 05:14:37 PM »

Right there is where that pesky "probable cause" thing comes in to play. This is a rare occasion where I think lawyers can actually improve things.

Wrong.  Suspecting drugs or guns can mean a gut feeling.  If some hoodlum rolls up with an arsenal on the back seat, and a bong on the front, all of which is in plain sight, then you have probable cause to stop him.

If there is no actual evidence of any wrong doing, then they have no basis to search.


What was the US Code of Law that describes the punishment for violating the constitution?
Punishr - N.D.M. Back in the air.
8.) Lasersailor 73 "Will lead the impending revolution from his keyboard"

Offline lazs2

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 24886
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2008, 10:56:17 AM »
mojava...  are you saying that the liberals are not coming after our guns?   It seems that it is you who are living in a fantasy land.   I have to ask tho... since coming out in favor of gun bans goes against what the people want..  why do your beloved liberals shoot themselves in the foot (so to speak) on this issue?

I mean..  they must have an agenda if they have to hide from it.

As for liberals wanting to spend more on education?  hardly.. they want to spend more on the teachers unions and indoctrinization.

If they cared about what education is supposed to do.. they would be in favor of vochers...  it is like saying that if you give monstrous sums to the "united way" who wastes 97% of it on admin costs and bloated salaries.. that you are in favor of charity.   If you wish to take away the money and let people spend on the charity of their choice.. that is real charity.. vochers are to education as the salvation army is to charity.   the united way and public school systems are the waste.   You don't throw more money at proven wasters who get no results...

You change the way it is done.. that is true progressiveness.. you believe in simply making the same old mistakes over and over... it is like the commies saying it will work it just hasn't been tried enough yet.

You are in a liberal socialist rut.

lazs


Offline Sox62

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1159
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2008, 12:23:03 PM »
The police and justice systems are getting incredibly out of hand.

I read an article yesterday about how unemployment figures might be artificially low because of the amount of people that are in jail.In 1980,there were 420,000 people in jail.26 years later in 2006,there are more than TWO MILLION people in jail,which is quintuple the number of 1980.One out of every 100 Americans is in jail!!!

This checkpoint,sobriety checkpoints,the police being able to search your car or pull you over without probable cause is alarming.The amount of people being jailed is even more so.Is this all about "keeping the streets safe",or a reason to justify more and more police;and prosecutors and judges furthering their careers by being "tough on crime"?

Article

Offline Maverick

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 13958
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2008, 12:44:46 PM »
Sox,

That's really reaching there in that article.
---------------------
"In 2006, the most-recent year Blank's research covers, the 4.6 percent U.S. unemployment rate would have been 5 percent if people behind bars and in the armed forces had been seeking private-sector jobs and therefore counted in the unemployment statistics, she said. Among black men, the rate would have pushed up from 9.6 percent to 10.6 percent."
--------------------------
Well lets see. If there was no military then sure all those employed folks (Service people) would be unemployed and looking for work. Duh. The thing is they ARE employed and in a career field they chose themselves. If there was a large draft then you could claim the government was skewing the figure by taking folks out of the employment pool but that is not the case is it. Particularly in the lower troop levels mandated by Congress several years ago.

As far as those in prison are concerned, the article has accuracy only if you assume the folks in prison were employed or wanted to be employed to begin with. Perhaps if they had been employed and a viable part of the work force they just might not be in prison now. It's far easier to steal from folks than go out and have a job and work for the things you want.
-----------------------
"But not everyone agrees that the nation's high incarceration rate has an impact on employment. James Sherk, a fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative research group, says the unemployment rate is low simply because the labor market remains tight, with many employers seeking even low-skilled workers.

If people now incarcerated under tough drug laws had never been put into prison, the great majority of them could have found jobs if they had wanted them, he said.

Attributing the low unemployment rate to the high incarceration rate is "grasping at straws," he said."
DEFINITION OF A VETERAN
A Veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve - is someone who, at one point in their life, wrote a check made payable to "The United States of America", for an amount of "up to and including my life."
Author Unknown

Offline Gunthr

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3043
      • http://www.dot.squat
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2008, 01:26:59 PM »
My heart goes out to lawfull citizens of DC, and to the cops who are so unfortunate to work there.  The crime is at level many here have never seen... the duty for cops is such that after a few years, if they desire to get away from facing this every day, they are considered ruined by agencies around the country, and they are fundementally unemployable elsewhere.  Your experiences effect you, and this is what happens to DC cops.

I don't know what I would say to DC citizens, except, love the children.  But that doesn't seem to be  happening as much as you would hope.

« Last Edit: June 07, 2008, 01:34:05 PM by Gunthr »
"When I speak I put on a mask. When I act, I am forced to take it off."  - Helvetius 18th Century

Offline Sox62

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1159
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #21 on: June 07, 2008, 02:47:11 PM »
Sox,

That's really reaching there in that article.
---------------------
"In 2006, the most-recent year Blank's research covers, the 4.6 percent U.S. unemployment rate would have been 5 percent if people behind bars and in the armed forces had been seeking private-sector jobs and therefore counted in the unemployment statistics, she said. Among black men, the rate would have pushed up from 9.6 percent to 10.6 percent."
--------------------------
Well lets see. If there was no military then sure all those employed folks (Service people) would be unemployed and looking for work. Duh. The thing is they ARE employed and in a career field they chose themselves. If there was a large draft then you could claim the government was skewing the figure by taking folks out of the employment pool but that is not the case is it. Particularly in the lower troop levels mandated by Congress several years ago.

As far as those in prison are concerned, the article has accuracy only if you assume the folks in prison were employed or wanted to be employed to begin with. Perhaps if they had been employed and a viable part of the work force they just might not be in prison now. It's far easier to steal from folks than go out and have a job and work for the things you want.
-----------------------
"But not everyone agrees that the nation's high incarceration rate has an impact on employment. James Sherk, a fellow at the Heritage Foundation, a conservative research group, says the unemployment rate is low simply because the labor market remains tight, with many employers seeking even low-skilled workers.

If people now incarcerated under tough drug laws had never been put into prison, the great majority of them could have found jobs if they had wanted them, he said.

Attributing the low unemployment rate to the high incarceration rate is "grasping at straws," he said."


Actually,I agree with you when it comes to how they think it impacts the unemployment rate.

I was just using the article to show how many Americans are in jail compared to 26 years earlier.

Offline Suave

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2950
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #22 on: June 07, 2008, 02:54:47 PM »
When a government profits from incarcerating the incarceration rates increase. Prepare for the "War on Crime" comrades.
 

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Re: Welcome to the Soviet Socialist Districkt of Kolumbia
« Reply #23 on: June 07, 2008, 03:12:49 PM »
Wrong.  Suspecting drugs or guns can mean a gut feeling.  If some hoodlum rolls up with an arsenal on the back seat, and a bong on the front, all of which is in plain sight, then you have probable cause to stop him.

If there is no actual evidence of any wrong doing, then they have no basis to search.


What was the US Code of Law that describes the punishment for violating the constitution?

Thank you for agreeing with me. You'll understand after you re-read my post a few times I think.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!