Were smaller cal weapons REALLY this bad?

[Angus]

And, alas, aces like Bader were against the 20mm cannon in the beginning, beliving it would just inspire shooting from too far.....
BTW, I have an account where a Spit pilot peppered down a Stuka with just his 2 outboard Mg's. Interested?

[Tony Williams]

I have read of an incident in which the rear gunner of a Ju 87 (1 x 7.92mm MG) shot down the P-61 night fighter which was stalking him (4x20mm + 4x.50).

I have also read of a verified incident in which a British army officer in North Africa shot down a Bf 109 with his .38 service revolver (the bullet struck either a fuel or coolant tube, I forget which).

In a war as diverse and long-lasting as WW2, almost anything could happen - and probably did.

Tony Williams: Military gun and ammunition website

[Angus]

The one I referred to had a cannon jam and had lightened his aircraft by removing 2 of the mg's. He locked on a Ju87 and killed it by some bursts from the .303's. Probably at very close range.
When you think of it, a .303  coming your way at 50 yards is not a nice thing, and some thin metal will not make much of a protection....and then it's a mixed lot of bullets with DeWilde here and there....

[Karnak]

And, alas, aces like Bader were against the 20mm cannon in the beginning, beliving it would just inspire shooting from too far.....
BTW, I have an account where a Spit pilot peppered down a Stuka with just his 2 outboard Mg's. Interested?

As I recall the three aces present for that meeting were Bader, Malan and Tuck and they spoke in that order.  Bader and Tuck almost came to blows as Bader got more and more incensed by Malan's pro-20mm comments and when Tuck said that Malan had basically spoken for him and all he'd add is that he was sure they'd have gotten more of the hun if they'd had 20mm cannons it was too much for Bader and he decried Malan and Tuck for talking rubbish.  So of those aces one was for maintaining the all .303 armament and two were for getting 20mm cannons in service as soon as possible.  Bader's resistance is pretty much the only reason there was ever such an animal as a Spitfire Mk Va as far as I understand it.

[Krusty]

So early in the war, the Hispano probably still had teething problems. I'm sure if Bader knew how reliable the cannon would be, he'd not have had much objection.

[Karnak]

So early in the war, the Hispano probably still had teething problems. I'm sure if Bader knew how reliable the cannon would be, he'd not have had much objection.

No, he didn't think any change was a good idea mid-stream.  The question was if a larger calibre weapon was desireable.  Bader was just being conservative.

[Krusty]

Ah, I see.

No doubt this is hind-sight and all, 60+ years later, but IMO a change was needed. Mid-stream or no, the rifle-caliber guns just weren't cutting it against stronger and stronger enemy aircraft.

I've read more than one report of Hurricane Mk.Is and Spit Is making group attacks on the same light bomber (dornier or heinkel) and after all had expended their ammo, it limped away. Might not have made it back to land, but it wasn't a definite "kill"