Author Topic: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!  (Read 680 times)

Offline SOB

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2008, 10:37:15 PM »
Advice: "Don't forget the condoms.  If you do forget the condoms, find the penicillin."
« Last Edit: June 11, 2008, 10:49:02 PM by SOB »
Three Times One Minus One.  Dayum!

Offline SOB

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2008, 10:48:25 PM »
.
Three Times One Minus One.  Dayum!

Offline midnight Target

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2008, 07:08:13 AM »
And that means what exactly?  It doesn't mean anything. 

Lies, damn lies, and statistics.  When your own statistics get debunked, use new ones that corroborate your socialist theories.

Global average temperature peaked in 1998.  It has been going down ever since.

When you "debunk" something it usually takes some form of evidence other than ... well... the complete lack of it that you are providing. My chart from NASA says you are mistaken. Maybe if you type in caps?


Offline Hap

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2008, 07:17:53 AM »
The article said that the lack of sun spots could be signs of a cooling trend, not a warming trend...

It could be signs of a trend of a trend.

Offline lazs2

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2008, 08:17:43 AM »
MT.. where did you get that chart?   NASA says that their data shows that 1934-1935 were hotter even than 1998?

That would make your chart an old one and... wrong.   This warming period is nothing new to the planet or even exceptional..  it has been pleasant but we can't expect it to last.   It will get colder and less pleasant no matter what we do.

http://www.norcalblogs.com/watts/2007/08/1998_no_longer_the_hottest_yea.html

You can't do anything about the weather.

lazs
« Last Edit: June 12, 2008, 08:24:21 AM by lazs2 »

Offline Nashwan

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2008, 08:38:23 AM »
Quote
NASA says that their data shows that 1934-1935 were hotter even than 1998?

No, NASA says 1934 was the warmest year in the 48 contiguous United States. 2005 was the warmest year globally, followed by 1998 and 2007, which tied for second.

Quote
The year 2007 tied for second warmest in the period of instrumental data, behind the record warmth of 2005, in the Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS) analysis. 2007 tied 1998, which had leapt a remarkable 0.2°C above the prior record with the help of the "El Niņo of the century". The unusual warmth in 2007 is noteworthy because it occurs at a time when solar irradiance is at a minimum and the equatorial Pacific Ocean is in the cool phase of its natural El Niņo-La Niņa cycle.
http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2007/

Offline midnight Target

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2008, 08:39:08 AM »

This says otherwise: http://www.dailytech.com/Temperature+Monitors+Report+Widescale+Global+Cooling/article10866.htm

http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/2007/

Quote
The year 2007 tied for second warmest in the period of instrumental data, behind the record warmth of 2005, in the Goddard Institute for Space Studies (GISS) analysis. 2007 tied 1998, which had leapt a remarkable 0.2°C above the prior record with the help of the "El Niņo of the century". The unusual warmth in 2007 is noteworthy because it occurs at a time when solar irradiance is at a minimum and the equatorial Pacific Ocean is in the cool phase of its natural El Niņo-La Niņa cycle.


NASA

Offline lazs2

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2008, 08:45:57 AM »
MT.. given that the margin of error is 2 degrees and the HUGE warming trend is only...   half a degree?   it is not too much to get upset about.. in fact..  it is downright pleasant.

NOTHING bad has happened.. it has all been good.. now.. it is gonna get cooler.. that will be bad but.. nothing we can do about it.

The global temp is measured... how?    the NASA data for the continent is probly the most accurate we can get..  and it shows the thirties as being warmer here.   

lazs

Offline ROX

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2008, 09:25:33 AM »
The woman who wrote this article has exhibited the absolute WORST kind of journalism....not doing her homework.

She is taking someone's quote and ASSUMED that the 11 year Sunspot Cycle works on some sort of solar alarm clock and exact every cycle.  Yeah, she noted the 50 year "Maunder Minimum" (Mini-Ice Age) in the 1600's.  Tree ring research indicated this sort of thing happens 10,000 to 15,000 years or so.

But all radio amateurs know (because it's in the study materials and sometimes on the exams) that sunspot cycles can be as short as 9 years and can even go 13 to 14 years, but 11 is the "average".  A sunspot "minima" usually heralds the end of a cycle, and we've had a long stretch of no sunspots (visible to Earth) for 7 days.

Here is a copy & paste from the Amateur Radio Relay League's Propagation email from June 6th:



SB PROP @ ARL $ARLP024
ARLP024 Propagation de K7RA

ZCZC AP24
QST de W1AW 
Propagation Forecast Bulletin 24  ARLP024
From Tad Cook, K7RA
Seattle, WA  June 6, 2008
To all radio amateurs

SB PROP ARL ARLP024
ARLP024 Propagation de K7RA

We had seven days of no sunspots this week, but a sunspot was
emerging on Thursday, June 5.  Helioseismic holography revealed a
high latitude sunspot on the opposite side of the Sun.  Until
recently, we had no idea what was happening on the far side of the
Sun, the side directed away from earth.  Go to
http://www.spaceweather.com/glossary/farside.html and to
http://solarscience.msfc.nasa.gov/Helioseismology.shtml for more
information on helioseismology.

As promised last week, here is an update to the three-month moving
averages of sunspot numbers.

Sep 05 39.3
Oct 05 28
Nov 05 36
Dec 05 40.6
Jan 06 32.4
Feb 06 18.1
Mar 06 27.7
Apr 06 38.5
May 06 39.7
Jun 06 28.9
Jul 06 23.3
Aug 06 23.5
Sep 06 21.2
Oct 06 24.1
Nov 06 23.1
Dec 06 27.3
Jan 07 22.7
Feb 07 18.5
Mar 07 11.2
Apr 07 12.2
May 07 15.8
Jun 07 18.7
Jul 07 15.4
Aug 07 10.2
Sep 07  5.4
Oct 07  3
Nov 07  6.9
Dec 07  8.1
Jan 08  8.5
Feb 08  8.4
Mar 08  8.4
Apr 08  8.9

I was able to calculate the value for April because we have all the
data for March, April and May.  The total of all daily sunspot
numbers for those three months was 818.  Divide that value by 92
days gives us approximately 8.891 as the average.

Note the average sunspot number has increased only slightly since
last Fall.

Jeff Lackey, K8CQ of St. Simons Island, Georgia noted that in the
table of zero-sunspot days presented last week, there was at least
one error.  They counted as 36 days the period from May 27 to July
31, 1996.  You can look at the whole website, not just the page we
linked to last week at, http://users.telenet.be/j.janssens/Spotless/Spotless.html.  Jeff
checked data in the table against an archive of sunspot data on the
ftp site, ftp://ftp.ngdc.noaa.gov/STP/SOLAR_DATA/SUNSPOT_NUMBERS/.
He found that the 66 days they reported as 36 days were actually
over two periods, but neither was over 20 days.  Jeff wrote,
"Indeed, the run that ended on 31 July began on 8 July, thus it was
a 14 day run.  The beginning date of 27 May was for a run that ended
on 7 June.  Between 7 June and 8 July, the sunspot numbers were all
non-zero."

The NOAA Space Weather Prediction Center sees a constant and quiet
geomagnetic planetary A index of 5 through June 14.  Geophysical
Institute Prague predicts quiet conditions for June 6, quiet to
unsettled June 7-8, and quiet again June 9-12.



As you can see, there were 36 days in 1996 (the END of the previous cycle) that had no sunspots....roughly a little longer than 11 years ago.


Some of you may want to hold off on preparing for an Ice Age coming next year and plan a cruise instead.



ROX


Offline Bones

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2008, 10:36:32 AM »
That chart is interesting midnight target.  If you look at the average mean, you will find most sudden temperature drops coorelate to explosive (or worse) volcanic activity.

1883: Krakatoa
1886: Mount Tarawera
1902: Santa Maria, Mount Pelee
1912: Novarupta
1913: Mount Vesuvius
1921: Mount Pinatubo
1924: Kilauea
1943: Paracutin
1944: Mount Vesuvius
1947: Hekla
1952: Paracutin
1961: Tristin da Cumba
1963: Mount Agund, Surtsey
1967: Surtsey
1973: Eldfell
1980: Mount St. Helens
1982: El Chichon, Galunggung
1985: Nevado Del Ruiz
1991: Mount Hudson
1992: Mount Spurr
2000: Mount Usu
2001: While Island
2002: Mount Etna

Fascinating.

Offline wrongwayric

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #25 on: June 12, 2008, 10:43:58 AM »
Mommy i'm hot......Darn global warming!     Later that same year.         Mommy i'm cold.......Yea so much for global warming!

There's a reason we have seasons/cycles and until the scientists can go back to the begining of time and take measurements through all those years, well, it's all just theories and assumptions.

Offline avionix

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Re: Oh Noes the Sun spots are missing!!!
« Reply #26 on: June 12, 2008, 10:50:15 AM »
Thank you Wrongway.  Haven't they found fossil in Antarctica that would indicate it was once warmer than it is now?  Come on people.  The natural ebb and flow of heating and cooling has been going on for millenia. 
treekilr in game.   
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