Help w/ TnB Plzor

[Yenny]

Hey people,

Lately I've been bored w/ BnZ and begun to explore low on the deck tnbing. I've found my favorite two planes for that job, G2 and K4. I'm getting the concept of reversing, scissors, etc. I still have a few problems with learning to lead my shot w/ TnB, at least when it comes to the tater.

How do you guys aim your tater? Let say in a tnb situation, I usually have my piper on my target, but not through. Usually the range is between 100-200 yards. I have my conversion set at 200, for both tater and 13mm mgs. When I BnZ I usually shoot at 200 yards, with my piper directly on my targets. That doesn't seems to work too well w/ TnB. Do I need to have my piper through target? Even though it's at 200 yards? Is it better to shoot just the tater alone? I've been firing both tater and mgs at once when I have a shot.

I don't know many tricks in the G2 and K4, other then scissor reverse, rolling scissors, and chop throttle nose down reverse. Only been experimenting with TnB for about a week, so I'm still lacking a lot of knowledge. If you guys can input some other trick it would be awesome, maybe a film to go along w/ the trick and some explanation. I've record some film of my k4 tnb action last night. My intent is to get some feed back of what I need to do to improve on the tnb side. If you guys could watch and and tell me what I'm doing wrong. You could see I'm "missing" a lot of my tater shots.

http://files.filefront.com/TnB1ahf/;10607479;/fileinfo.html

PS: I know you guys love the flaming, but let's try to keep it off this thread this time.

Thanks,
Yenny

[Speed55]

TnB and getting a good shot with the tater is difficult.  I didn't watch the film, but basically you want to get your piper pointed where the enemy WILL be and let him fly into the bullet stream.  Even with 50 cals it takes  practice setting up your snapshots, which is what you'll wind up with most of the times.

When you go up against turn planes, it's especially important to hit your first shot because sometimes your wont get another.

[Lusche]

Is it better to shoot just the tater alone? I've been firing both tater and mgs at once when I have a shot.

Yes, especially when still learning them. The MG tracers & hit sprites make observing the taters difficult.

[ODBAL]

Yes, especially when still learning them. The MG tracers & hit sprites make observing the taters difficult.

wtf is a tater?

[Lusche]

wtf is a tater?

Colloquial term for the Mk-108 30mm rounds

[BaldEagl]

wtf is a tater?

30mm German cannon.

You'll most likely be shooting "blind", with the con under your nose expecting him to cross over it from underneath (a lead shot) or from some other direction (a snap shot).

[Strip]

When fighting more manueverable (but slower) planes make sure you fight uphill.

The 109K4 has a fantastic climb rate so use it to overcome the weak turn radius.

Strip

[evenhaim]

yenny pm me when your on, ill give you a course in slow and low 109 fighting.

[Motherland]

If you can see your target in the 109K you're not leading enough.

[Messiah]

Needs more cowbell.

[ODBAL]

Colloquial term for the Mk-108 30mm rounds

I'm on the low carb diet, so if you all could show me some support and refrain from shooting me with taters it would be much appreciated.

Seacrest out....

[spit16nooby]

Ok a bit off topic from the getting the hits but the first thing u should change is T&Bing in the K-4.  It is NOT made for that. It was made as an interceptor with a big, strong, inaccurate gun meant to kill big lumbering bombers.  It also had fast speed and unmatched climb rate to be able to get to the bombers quicly.  The speed and climb are the strengths you should play to.  Also it would help you tons if you try something such as a spiral climb or rope instead of the scissors because the 109 is only an average roller.  Also if you look a little further down the page agent 360 has some great films you can watch.

[BnZ]

The K4 out-turns a good number of planes you'll see flying in this game. Any P-51, any 190, the Jug if you know what you are doing. It is also fast enough to run all of these down.

Anyway, not a K-4 guy, but as general advice, you might try setting up out-of-plane snapshots. That means when you are on someone's tail in a turn, lets make it a flat turn for simplicity, you do abit of a low yo-yo, your nose dips down below the plane of their turn abit, you bring it back up to a point ahead of their airplane and fire with them crossing horizontally through your windscreen. Hope this makes sense, wish I could draw a picture. Of course with the taters, this should be done at very close range, fortunately, it only takes one.

[Spatula]

Im no 109 experten, but i have spent some time in them and have a soft spot for them.

How do you guys aim your tater?
I find that on average you need to lead almost twice as much as a 50cal armed aircraft. So if you're used of 50cals, then whatever amount of lead you think is enough, will only be half of enough for the tater. I would say you would lead about 70% more than what you would for 20mm hispanos too.

I have my conversion set at 200, for both tater and 13mm mgs.
Personally, cause i only use the 13mm to scare people into turning, i would set them out at 650 or so. Being nose-mounted, convergence isn't as much of an issue. I think i have my tatergun set at 280 - but again since its center-line mounted, convergence is not as bigger issue as wing-mounted guns. The only difference is the amount of 'loft' it dials in.

Do I need to have my piper through target?
That depends on the relative movement of the aircraft to your piper and your G loading at that point. If they dont appear to be moving relative to your piper and you're pulling 1G (eg not turning), then put the dot on em and fire. The more of either will necessitate a requisite amount of lead. But because of the relatively low muzzle-velocity of the tatergun you will need to learn to 'lob' your rounds at your opponent - think of it more as a motar than a lazer if you get my drift.

Is it better to shoot just the tater alone?
IMO, yes. I normally only ever shoot the tatergun. the 13mms are reguarly left untouched. I occasionally use 13mms to scare people a bit when i dont want to waste a tater on a low-probability shot. You only got 60 odd, so fire them one or two at a time - one or two audible "thuds" at a time. Your timing needs to be very good. Practice, practice, practice.

Like i said, im no 109 guru, there are plenty of others who frequent this board who may have differing opinions.

[Adonai]

Your biggest problem is switching from g2 to K4 so often you cant get use to the aiming process.

I fly G14/K4 considerbly enough it doesn't effect me to much but i still find myself misleading the 30mm. You must
seriously stick with one aircraft and fly it for good. Basically find a convergence you like in the 30mm and stick to it,
keep your 13mm for defensive purposes only (i.e run outa taters with 1 con left in a fight) when your outa taters
consider that your cue to go home.
95% of my shots with the 30mm are done by planes i cant see, or on a snapshot, I hardly EVER get someone attempting to run away
more so because they are a "dead" kill - also learn to tap trigger for 30mm, only need 1 round to take a plane down, you have
7 seconds of firing time and that goes easily quick after few bursts.