Questions with death

[ink]

i do agree that human life is very precious and should never be taken!!

but    someone who Molests children or murders(for no reason)or rapes, should be taken out, plain and simple.

life is the most precious gift we have been given, and when you do the three things mentioned above you lay your life out you are no longer human in my eyes you are a demon, or the son of satan.

[Baitman]

but    someone who Molests children or murders(for no reason)or rapes, should be taken out, plain and simple.

Sometimes different punishments would be better though. For rapests maybe a casteration with no drugs and use rusty knives or a big hammer. I believe that sometimes a punishment of death is to easy (chemical) and maybe an incentitive like pain beyond belief would more suffice. It sure would curb some of the problem we are having.

[Motherland]

Sometimes different punishments would be better though. For rapests maybe a casteration with no drugs and use rusty knives or a big hammer. I believe that sometimes a punishment of death is to easy (chemical) and maybe an incentitive like pain beyond belief would more suffice. It sure would curb some of the problem we are having.

Castration with a big hammer... now THERE is a punishment worse than death.

[DmonSlyr]

what if killers were just grim reapers that were sent by god to kill random people, its just lodged in there brain but they dont know. they just want to kill for some odd reason. if we didnt have killers or catastrophies then the world would be over populated. isnt is strange to any 1 else how after 20,000 years are world still isnt over populated. its because it all works in 1 big conjunction a cycle everything moves in a cylcle. to me the universe seeeeems soooooooooooooo complicated if you think about it in the big picture. just think about math and science and how it goes sooo deep. there is so much CRAP in the universe with 40 trillion stars how could only 1 man do so much. think about how small we are. what about bugs and animals, there arnt any better then us if you want to put us in a big picture with everything. where do they go when they die???? i think darwin had the best understanding of the earth. because it reality it is servival of the fittest. smarter lives longer. but in the big picture of everything a human in a cell we are tiny tiny tiny little things. so why would god care more about us then anything else in the whole damn universe????

[wrag]

Sometimes different punishments would be better though. For rapests maybe a casteration with no drugs and use rusty knives or a big hammer. I believe that sometimes a punishment of death is to easy (chemical) and maybe an incentitive like pain beyond belief would more suffice. It sure would curb some of the problem we are having.

Not saying you're wrong here....


BUT I have to ask.......


what about FALSE accusations of the above!



YOU KNOW such things happen!

Reports constantly occur of wives accusing their ex- of MANY things that later prove UNTRUE but they did so because their attorney advised it for a better result in court!

Child abuse charges get hurled around like leaflets at rallies.......

Then there are ladies of the night that sometimes get angry and make charges that....

Don't know about you but I would sure hate to punish someone for a doing the above and then find out later the accuser LIED!

Would you care to be on the receiving end of such?

[Baitman]

Not saying you're wrong here....


BUT I have to ask.......


what about FALSE accusations of the above!



YOU KNOW such things happen!

Reports constantly occur of wives accusing their ex- of MANY things that later prove UNTRUE but they did so because their attorney advised it for a better result in court!

Child abuse charges get hurled around like leaflets at rallies.......

Then there are ladies of the night that sometimes get angry and make charges that....

Don't know about you but I would sure hate to punish someone for a doing the above and then find out later the accuser LIED!

Would you care to be on the receiving end of such?

I agree Wrag. I would hope a punishment like this would not happen to a first time offender. But as Ink pointed out, serial rapests, and the like need ought be delt with. This is the same problem that is run into with the death penalty.

[mtnman]

back than (almost 3000 years ago)  people thought the world was flat, how did this man know the world was circular ?  he God and when you know God you know the truth.

it reads different in each bible that ive checked out, but it all says the same thing. the world is round.

That's true, most Christians still thought the earth was flat back then.  They hadn't yet reached the same conclusions that some (many?) of the Native Americans had...

Some of the "heathen" groups in Europe are also believed to have reached the "round earth" conclusion quite early as well.  Thier attention to the stars, planets, and moon helped them reach that conclusion.

Galileo- how did he fall from favor in the eyes of the church (and end up imprisoned?)?  Wasn't it by claiming the earth was round, and that it orbited the sun, rather than the other way around?  Why were Christians so reluctant to accept the "round earth" theories, especially if the bible told them the earth was round?

[Masherbrum]

i do agree that human life is very precious and should never be taken!!

but    someone who Molests children or murders(for no reason)or rapes, should be taken out, plain and simple.

life is the most precious gift we have been given, and when you do the three things mentioned above you lay your life out you are no longer human in my eyes you are a demon, or the son of satan.

They'll meet their maker in due time.   I'm not on this Earth to judge a single person, every human is unfit for the role.   This is my opinion though. 

[Baitman]

They'll meet their maker in due time.   I'm not on this Earth to judge a single person, every human is unfit for the role.   This is my opinion though. 

I can't throw a stone either.........

[Simaril]

That's true, most Christians still thought the earth was flat back then.  They hadn't yet reached the same conclusions that some (many?) of the Native Americans had...

Some of the "heathen" groups in Europe are also believed to have reached the "round earth" conclusion quite early as well.  Thier attention to the stars, planets, and moon helped them reach that conclusion.

Galileo- how did he fall from favor in the eyes of the church (and end up imprisoned?)?  Wasn't it by claiming the earth was round, and that it orbited the sun, rather than the other way around?  Why were Christians so reluctant to accept the "round earth" theories, especially if the bible told them the earth was round?

In Galileo's time, the roundness wasn't really the issue -- it was whether the earth revolved around the sun, or the reverse. The trouble was that the organized bureacracy of the church had thrown its lot in with Aristotle's view of science, and had found some Biblical quotations to back Aristotle up. On the other hand, Augustine (a "church father" who lived hundreds of years before) felt that the passages in question were best viewed as poetic imagery, especially since they were in songs (recorded as psalms). The Pope's official position was that the favored doctrine should not be discarded without solid objective proof to the contrary, but Galileo was felt to have ignored that restriction and pushed his views before the proof was in hand.



But that story is just an example of a bigger issue. The absolutely central, core essence of Christianity is that people start out flawed and selfish -- but through Jesus' sacrifice they can be both forgiven, and gradually regenerated into something new and different. That means guaranteed people who call themselves followers of Christ are going to be messed up to one degree or another -- we're all going to be in the process of growing more like the one we follow. I believe when it says we are made "in his image" that includes the ability to freely choose, even though it hurts him to see us ignore his way of life. And so -- there WILL be times we're a bit embarrassing to the boss!

What's absolutely unbelievable is that He loves us at all, given how we Christians behave...individually and collectively.



That's what we call Grace -- the totally unwarranted, undeserved, overwhelmingly incomprehensible love and forgiveness of God through what Jesus did. Unfortunately its way too easy for followers to get stalled out in their growth, to become comfortable and self satisfied. And that stalling out is what gives Christianity (the structured religion) a bad name that Christianity (the actual "Way" of following Jesus' footsteps day by day) doesn't deserve.

History...the news...and our neighborhoods!...are full of people who call themselves Christians but who show self righteousness, arrogance, hatred, and bigotry that have absolutely nothing to do with Jesus. Galileo's case falls under that umbrella, IMHO.

[ink]

very well written Simaril

 

[Baitman]

Well that explains why some people can be complete prettythangholes and $crew everybody they come in contact with. They can go to church say some hail mary's and be saved just to go out the next week and do it all over again.

Every time I hear God bless I watch my prettythang

[moot]

Simaril,
From what you say, it sounds like the church back then hadn't thought things through enough.  Science and Religion have no overlap.  They didn't need to hear any sort of approval/disapproval from anyone scientific or theistic.  Their clinging to one empirical fact or theory of any sort was a mistake.  Their punishment of Galileo for his arguing a purely empirical stance was out of line.

[SD67]

Well that explains why some people can be complete uncleholes and $crew everybody they come in contact with. They can go to church say some hail mary's and be saved just to go out the next week and do it all over again.

Every time I hear God bless I watch my uncle

It's funny you should say that.
When I was a member of our church council what really blew me away was the level of hipocracy I saw amongst the congregation as a whole. The place was rife with it.
I've also seen many fair weather Christians who pick and choose their adherence to their faith. It's surprising how many "good Christians" you see in front of a Judge that quickly change their tune as soon as the walk out of the doors.
At least the non believers stand by their convictions.

[Simaril]

There's no doubt that what you guys have seen is way too common. But I'd suggest that it may not be to the point of what Christianity is about.

There are plenty of fakes in church. First, there are people whose religion is just a tradition, with nothing personal in it. Then there are those who use church as another field to conquer, who are focused on power and prestige. (These are the ones who are perfectly happy to see a church split over picking the "wrong" pastor or carpet or whatever.) Can't forget the con men in polyester suits, either -- guys like Elmer Gantry (old movie) who happen to have found a fertile field of suckers among the pews.

In my opinion, these people have very little to do with Christianity. They "represent" the faith the same way the Oklahoma City bombers represent the American values they claimed. In essence, it's not fair to judge a belief system by looking at people who don't follow it -- no matter what they SAY they do.

And don't forget...God is not exactly stupid. Just for the sake of argument, imagine that the God of Christianity is real. Would an all powerful, all knowing God be fooled by things WE can see through? Seems pretty unlikely. And look at what Jesus had to say about the hyper religious hypocrites of his day: "They are like whitewashed tombs, beautiful on the inside but inside filled with putrid corruption." Elsewhere he said that at the end of time there would be many people who said in essence "We preached your name, we even did miracles for you!" and Jesus will say "Get out, I never even knew you." He doesn't put up with "calling it in" either -- using food as an illustration, he said "I wish you were either hot or cold. But since you're just lukewarm, I'm going to spit you out of my mouth."

If we look at what Jesus taught, it's clear he's no weak kneed Mr Rogers clone. He's every bit as disgusted by hypocrisy as you guys are, and in fact the hardest words in the bible are spoken about religious hypocrites -- maybe because he knew just how much damage they do to real people.