Modern tank cannons - smooth vs rifled

[slipknot]

Which begs the question - isn't the M1 really just a European tank with a gas-guzzling turbine engine stuck in the back?

No more than the US is just e European country with some Mexicans cutting the grass.

[GtoRA2]

Didn't we improve on the Armor, by incorperating depleted uranium in it on the M1?

[evenhaim]

Our merkava tanks uses a similiar smoothbore gun to what the brits use, and they work just fine

[mietla]

It was the only armored vehicle in both gulf wars to not lose a single tank to enemy fire.

How many have you deployed? If you had two Challengers among thousands of M1, what was a chance of being even targeted.

The Challenger also has the longest confirmed kill of another tank..... 5,100 meters.  Abrams? Forget about it after 2000 meters....it's not hitting.
 

I've read reports of M1 engaging Iraqi tanks at 3000-4000 meters and killing them with ease. Some Iraqi tank were even killed while they were hidden behind the sand.

[63tb]

Thanks for all the great info!

Can a smooth bore gun only fire a sabot round?

63tb

[33Vortex]

SABOT rounds is in the sub-caliber category. There are similar projectiles for small-arms. Like the Barrett .50 cal can fire sub-caliber rounds to achieve high-velocity, flat-trajectory ballistics, much like a tank gun actually. In order to hit targets at extreme range with great accuracy.

[GtoRA2]

Thanks for all the great info!

Can a smooth bore gun only fire a sabot round?

63tb

The gun in the M1 can fire sabot and Heat rounds and I think the Army has a HE round in the works.   

[bustr]

120mm M830 HEAT-MP-T   
Chemical Energy Anti-Tank Multi Purpose Ammunition

The M830 High Explosive Anti-Tank - Multipurpose - Tracer (HEAT-MP-T) service round for the smoothbore 120mm combustible cartridge case tank ammunition employs a full diameter shaped charge to defeat a wide spectrum of targets. Extremely effective against buildings and bunkers, as well as armored vehicles and other targets, the M830 serves as the companion ammunition to the kinetic energy M829 series anti-tank munition. The M830s safe and reliable fuzing ensures detonation on frontal impact or graze. The combustible cartridge case has proven to be safe, rugged and capable of withstanding the rigors of field service.

Look here for a full line up of 120mm rounds for the M1A2 tank.

http://www.gd-ots.com/sitepages/dirfire.html


 

[hlbly]

If you look historically the germans make the best guns . The brits make the best armor , and the US makes the best automotive systems . The isrealis just improve everything .

[AquaShrimp]

The M1 uses a 122mm smoothbore Rhinemetal cannon.  Rifled barrels can wear out extremely quickly.  The Russians actually had to carry extra barrels with them into battle as their rifled cannons were wearing out at an extremely quick rate (Post-afghanistan, not exactly which conflict this was, in the desert some where). 

[33Vortex]

Chechnya.

[Hornet33]

M1 ABRAMS ARMAMENT
The main armament is the 120mm M256 smoothbore gun, developed by Rheinmetall Waffe Munition GmbH of Germany. The 120mm gun fires the following ammunition: the M865 TPCSDS-T and M831 TP-T training rounds, the M8300 HEAT-MP-T and the M829 APFSDS-T which includes a depleted uranium penetrator. Textron Systems provides the Cadillac Gage gun turret drive stabilisation system.

The commander has a 12.7mm Browning M2 machine gun and the loader has a 7.62mm M240 machine gun. A 7.62mm M240 machine gun is also mounted coaxially on the right hand side of the main armament.

[Hornet33]

The M1 uses a 122mm smoothbore Rhinemetal cannon.  Rifled barrels can wear out extremely quickly.  The Russians actually had to carry extra barrels with them into battle as their rifled cannons were wearing out at an extremely quick rate (Post-afghanistan, not exactly which conflict this was, in the desert some where). 

See my above post. 120MM gun not 122mm.

Also the Soviets last tank that had a rifled barrel was the T-54/55. That had a 100mm rifled main gun. The T-64/72/80/90 ALL use a 125mm smooth bore main gun, the T-62 used a 115mm smooth bore main gun, so I don't know what tanks they had that they were carrying extra barrels into battle. Also changing the main gun tube on a tank is NOT something the crew can do on their own, and is NOT something you stop and do in the middle of a battle. Also the most commonly used tank by the Soviets in Afghanistan was the T-64. The Soviets supplied old T-55's to Afghan Army units. Desert Storm the Iraqi's were using T-62's T-72's for the most part. Some units were equipped with the old T-55's, but I never saw an Iraqi tank with a spare barrel strapped on the side and I saw ALOT of blown up tanks over there.

[2bighorn]

Can a smooth bore gun only fire a sabot round?

Both, rifled and smooth bore guns, fire loads of different ammo types, from APFSDS, HEAT, HEFRAG, etc, all the way to guided missiles.

The reason why smooth bore guns are more common, is development of armor. Composite armor proved a bit much for shaped charge rounds, so they went back to kinetic penetrators, for which very high muzzle velocity is a must and that is easier to achieve with smooth bore guns.

[Fishu]

The gun in the M1 can fire sabot and Heat rounds and I think the Army has a HE round in the works

They just need to supply the rounds to the crews first. Anti-personel capability of Abrams has been worse in Iraq than it should be.

US makes the best automotive systems . The isrealis just improve everything .

You call the poor suspension and gas guzzling engines of the US cars as the best automotive systems? The cars might be manly, but the systems hasn't been as good until the very recent years, though often suffering from design faults.

I'd say the US takes the israelis place as the improver of everything, even israeli inventions

The most reliable automotive systems seem to come from Japan - their cars can be seen on the roads far longer than any western car. Mercedes used to be the innovator of automotive systems, but I haven't seen many innovations recently.