KOTH idea

[dedalos]

Just thinking how to make this event better so here it goes.  Would it be better if the third guy arriving to a fight would just announce himself with a check6 and then just circle until the fight was done?   He would still maintain his alt / e advantage but it would give the winner of the fight a chance.

The reason I say this is because SA really is gone since I am required to head to the closest fight.  SA would tell me to make a wide turn while climbing so we all get at the fight at the same time, but I am not really allowed to use SA.  I have to head straight for the fight.  I could throttle back but then I'd be just low and slow.  Some of the fights are so intense that even if you had time to check for the third guy, there is nothing you can do about it.  Last night I spent about three hours like that.  Get into a fight and get picked by the third or fourth guy coming in.

I think winning KOTH would mean more if the cherry picking was not encouraged and it would probably be more fun.  Right now it is more about location/position management than it is about fighting.

Thoughts?

[2bighorn]

Thoughts?

Not a bad idea, but what would happen if two guys already in fight are about equally matched and their fight would last 15 minutes? What would the third guy do? Wait the whole time?

[dedalos]

Not a bad idea, but what would happen if two guys already in fight are about equally matched and their fight would last 15 minutes? What would the third guy do? Wait the whole time?

Not sure.  Head for the next closest guy maybe?  3 hours of being picked does not make it fun.  I know how to use the current system if I want to have a good chance at winning.  However, this event should not be about position management or avoiding being the first to reach an opponent.  I also know how to play stupid and start asking which way to go so can can buy a few seconds and alt by heading the wrong way 

The current reason/excuse used is SA.  If I do what my SA tells me to do, I will be breaking the rules.  Getting into a turn fight with someone knowing a third guy will be there in 20 seconds is stupid.

[TequilaChaser]

Not sure.  Head for the next closest guy maybe?  3 hours of being picked does not make it fun.  I know how to use the current system if I want to have a good chance at winning.  However, this event should not be about position management or avoiding being the first to reach an opponent.  I also know how to play stupid and start asking which way to go so can can buy a few seconds and alt by heading the wrong way 

The current reason/excuse used is SA.  If I do what my SA tells me to do, I will be breaking the rules.  Getting into a turn fight with someone knowing a third guy will be there in 20 seconds is stupid.

If I am in a fight with another person, I am still scanning the skys for possible incoming badguy(s)........ I continue to fight but at the same time I am looking for the breakoff point/time to set my opponent up to be between me and the incoming bad guy ( who most times is already beginning his dive in to be at same alt as the fight. so he can make a guns pass and then zoom back up )

knowing this is going to happen...I am setting my original opponent up to be picked while he is chasing me, and also knowing that when the 2nd badguy pounces my Trailer, he will 1- kill him and zoom up, 2- cause him to break off hard break turn and the 2nd badguy will climb up.both offering me a chance to reverse and catch either of them from behind..

If you watch my films from the different fights last night. you will see/hear me warn of me joining in on a fight already in progress ( my gentleman courtuoesy ) you will see me break off from any stalemate and extend to reset the fight, you will see me do as I just described above in setting up my trailer, to offer me a better chance of survival.

Even though I set up the original guy I am/was fighting, I already had warned him that another plane was coming and was entering the fight, it is his own faught for not paying attention of my actions....

but then again, I fully understand your concern and comment, Dedalos.....some people go to the extreme of stretching the rules, and cut thottle fly in an off direct line to next path several degrees, wait to be the last 2 or 3 flying.....

This falls back on all good AH sumaritans to pick up on these people and point them out to the KOTH CM's....

[TonyJoey]

Love the idea ...I hate being the one to come in and break up a good 1v1, and get called a picker when there's not much else I coulda done, and I hate to be on the recieving end of a great 1v1 being broken up because of a pick too.

[fuzeman]

The ONLY way we could ever run a 'perfect' KOTH would be to have each player implanted with telepathic sensors that report their intentions to the CM. The robot-CM located behind the player will get directions from the CM and when adverse sensory output is detected the robot-CM would smack the player outputting adverse sensory responses with a 2x4.
Personally I usually say 'knock-knock' or something to that effect when entering a fight. I would also mention that giving information about someone entering a fight comes very close to giving tactical info regarding people inflight.

You have to remember this is KOTH and not a ladder type event built on a series of 1 on 1s.

[TequilaChaser]

I would also mention that giving information about someone entering a fight comes very close to giving tactical info regarding people inflight.

You have to remember this is KOTH and not a ladder type event built on a series of 1 on 1s.

I am not the greatest at SA ( Situational Awareness ) but I feel it is beneficial to acknowledge another opponent entering my fight, especially to a player that may be limited in his SA abilities, so he doesn't go off spewing that so&so just picked him and creating a flamefest.......

I do know, personally what is over the limit and what is breaking the rules. I personally don't think it is breaking a rule if I inform the opponent I am fighting "heads up, another plane is entering our fight" . I find it , that it is up to my opponent at that time to recognize the threat and make adjustments accordingly. If he decides to ignore my info then it is to his on demise......

If I am wrong in doing this , or if I am wrong in telling 2 people fighting that I am inbound then please correct me and I will no longer do it.....

[Hoarach]

I 100% agree, after last night's KOTH every round I was pretty much getting bounced by 2 and I seriously lost interest in it.....

I just kept thinking great have to dodge more picking....

Sorry for the ranting but last night was really bad for me at least...

[fuzeman]

I guess it's time to have a talk with AKDogg on this. I can definitely see both sides. Officially we say you shouldn't say it but for better fights and less picking it would help the not so observant people know someone is about to com into the fight.
As I stated personally I give a little clue to the the fight I'm about to enter. So far it hasn't been an issue and I probably shouldn't develop it into one.

[jerkins]

I dont know how well this could be implemented.  I think making an announcement when entering mandatory is a good idea (i do it anyway).  I have had a case or two where i was in the last three and two were already fighting.  Ive always wanted to ask the cm and other two fighting for permission to hold off and reset on equal terms at the conclusion of the fight.

[AKDogg]

Let me ask this, how many rules u guys want?  I really don't want to keep adding rules.  I actually would like to get rid of some rules but a few made that hard to do.  I would love to go back to the honor system.  Koth is a 1 many airforce, U against everyone else.  U don't get a call on the radio in real life situations saying "Hey, I coming in to kill ya".

[dedalos]

Let me ask this, how many rules u guys want?  I really don't want to keep adding rules.  I actually would like to get rid of some rules but a few made that hard to do.  I would love to go back to the honor system.  Koth is a 1 many airforce, U against everyone else.  U don't get a call on the radio in real life situations saying "Hey, I coming in to kill ya".

That is true D but at the same time, the rules force me to do something I would normally would not do.  I do know how to stretch and bend them in order to get the results I want if that is preferred. 

[Golfer]

In the strictest sense then you'd be cheating yourself Dedalos.

KOTH in its heyday was a wild crazy fight that put you on the edge of your seat for 5-10 minutes.  You agains the world with no rules other than kill the other guys in the most basic sense.  No wingmen, no squads, no friends while the fight is on.

I've sat and watched some bad apples play hell with one of the most basic and fun events that AH and Air Warrior had to offer and it's a shame it's come to that for those who didn't have the opportunity partake back then.

I don't have a dog in this fight but in my peanut gallery opinion KOTH doesn't need more rules.  It needs the players to do a better job to get the love muffines to stop being love muffines or not play in the event.  Fuze and Dogg do their best with what they're dealt but in the end it's the players that make it what it is.  Who would have thought the day would comes you'd need to send films in for validation?  Who would have dreamed you wern't allowed to talk a little friendly smack because guys were winging up.  If you see guys winging call them out on it.  If it looks fishy, speak up.  It's about the honor system in this event more than any other because everything cannot be seen by a hosts eye.

I'd appeal to all the KOTH faithful to help Fuze and Dogg get the event back to what it once was.  One of the crown jewels of special events that goes back to Kesmai and Air Warrior.  Heck with making more rules and more with having fun!

[dedalos]

In the strictest sense then you'd be cheating yourself Dedalos.

KOTH in its heyday was a wild crazy fight that put you on the edge of your seat for 5-10 minutes.  You agains the world with no rules other than kill the other guys in the most basic sense.  No wingmen, no squads, no friends while the fight is on.

I've sat and watched some bad apples play hell with one of the most basic and fun events that AH and Air Warrior had to offer and it's a shame it's come to that for those who didn't have the opportunity partake back then.

I don't have a dog in this fight but in my peanut gallery opinion KOTH doesn't need more rules.  It needs the players to do a better job to get the love muffines to stop being love muffines or not play in the event.  Fuze and Dogg do their best with what they're dealt but in the end it's the players that make it what it is.  Who would have thought the day would comes you'd need to send films in for validation?  Who would have dreamed you wern't allowed to talk a little friendly smack because guys were winging up.  If you see guys winging call them out on it.  If it looks fishy, speak up.  It's about the honor system in this event more than any other because everything cannot be seen by a hosts eye.

I'd appeal to all the KOTH faithful to help Fuze and Dogg get the event back to what it once was.  One of the crown jewels of special events that goes back to Kesmai and Air Warrior.  Heck with making more rules and more with having fun!

I don't think you got what I am trying to say.  There is no fight, and there are no jack arses.  The rules require people to pick.  They would have been breaking the rules if they didn't.  Slowing down going to a fight is not against the rules and some times required in order to regain wep and save fuel.  And no, I would not be cheating my self by doing that since the picking only happens at the early stages of a round.  At the end, you have to kill the last 2 or 3 to win it.  Right now, I am cheating my self by not playing "smart"

[Vudak]

In my opinion, KOTH would be better if less people tried so hard to win it.