Hydrocarbons on Titan

[Mojava]

 I guess we need to redefine where we think hydrocarbons come from, http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/space/07/31/cassini.titan.ap/index.html?iref=mpstoryview   
There's all the fuel we need, how do we get it?

[Furball]

a big straw?

[moot]

There was actualy a study of using a straw scheme to terraform venus, and it would effectively suck out some of the excessive (for our purposes) atmosphere into space (or across some other lower pressure gradient), provided you can build the straw..

Resource exploitation on Titan isn't happening anytime soon, for now.. Even mining the moon or mars or nearby floaters is beyond profit because of the cost of dealing with earth's gravity well.  A real shame...  All it'd take is an initial payment in launches and equipment.

[Masherbrum]

"I have a milkshake and you have a milkshake.   I have a straw that goes allllllllllllllllllllllllllll ll the way over to your milkshake.  I drink your milkshake!"

[dkff49]

I guess we need to redefine where we think hydrocarbons come from, http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/space/07/31/cassini.titan.ap/index.html?iref=mpstoryview   
There's all the fuel we need, how do we get it?

If you think gas is expensive now let them try this. It will get even more expensive.

I found one site that estimated the average cost of space launch was about $22,000 per kilogram. That would be the cost of getting what ever space craft off the ground here.

It took the Cassini-Huygens spacecraft almost 7 years to get there

$3.26 billion was the total cost of the mission and that spacecraft only weighed in at 2500 kilograms. I am sure any vehicle would need to be vastly bigger than thay thing was to get enough fuel back here to be worth the 14 year round trip.

There is also the much bigger cost and it is not in dollars. The cost to our planet in the amount carbon that would be released into the atmosphere. The carbon being released now was at one time in the atmosphere or on the surface and it is causing problems now, imagine adding millions of tons more carbon that was not even here in the first place.

Of course as I usually do I am probably blowing this out of proportion, after putting all the time into some of the research I came to realize that there is the possiblity that you were joking. However I had done the work so I figured I'd post anyway in case anybody did think that this was a good idea.

[Maverick]

"I have a milkshake and you have a milkshake.   I have a straw that goes allllllllllllllllllllllllllll ll the way over to your milkshake.  I drink your milkshake!"

Your milkshake is in your gravity well under pressure sufficient to allow the milkshake to progress up your straw. The pressure my milkeshake is under will only allow flow up to 12". The distance you have to draw from is over 36". You can suck all you want but all you'll do is suck while I drink MY milkshake. Do you really enjoy sucking for nothing like that? 

[CAP1]

I guess we need to redefine where we think hydrocarbons come from, http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/space/07/31/cassini.titan.ap/index.html?iref=mpstoryview   
There's all the fuel we need, how do we get it?

put it to burt rutan at scaled composites....and possibly paul allen at vulcan engineering.

while nasa is formulating a plan, these guys will have tested methods already.

[MajIssue]

There was actualy a study of using a straw scheme to terraform venus, and it would effectively suck out some of the excessive (for our purposes) atmosphere into space (or across some other lower pressure gradient), provided you can build the straw..

Resource exploitation on Titan isn't happening anytime soon, for now.. Even mining the moon or mars or nearby floaters is beyond profit because of the cost of dealing with earth's gravity well.  A real shame...  All it'd take is an initial payment in launches and equipment.

The really interseting thing about this subject is that with the abundant water on Jupiter's moon Europa and hydrocarbon "lakes" on Saturn's Titan, there is all the fuel we need for exploration of the outer planets. Personally, I'd like to find that asteroid made of gold or diamond.

[Cthulhu]

I found one site that estimated the average cost of space launch was about $22,000 per kilogram. That would be the cost of getting what ever space craft off the ground here.

Back when I was working on the radiators for the International Space Station, that number was ~$5000 per pound. Looks like the cost has doubled in the last 10 years.

The really interseting thing about this subject is that with the abundant water on Jupiter's moon Europa and hydrocarbon "lakes" on Saturn's Titan, there is all the fuel we need for exploration of the outer planets. Personally, I'd like to find that asteroid made of gold or diamond.

Yes, but there are also aliens on Europa who said they'd kick our bellybutton if we went there.

[moot]

The really interseting thing about this subject is that with the abundant water on Jupiter's moon Europa and hydrocarbon "lakes" on Saturn's Titan, there is all the fuel we need for exploration of the outer planets. Personally, I'd like to find that asteroid made of gold or diamond.

There's bigger lumps of diamond out there, the size of stars

[Cthulhu]

There's bigger lumps of diamond out there, the size of stars

Besides, without the DeBeer's to limit availability, diamond's would have hardly any value at all.

[dkff49]

Besides, without the DeBeer's to limit availability, diamond's would have hardly any value at all.

this simple fact has been the cause of many arguments in my house, since I refuse to buy diamonds due to that. I refuse to support the OPEC equivelent of the diamond world. What a way to increase profits with hold supplies with the intent of increasing the price.

[Cthulhu]

this simple fact has been the cause of many arguments in my house, since I refuse to buy diamonds due to that. I refuse to support the OPEC equivelent of the diamond world. What a way to increase profits with hold supplies with the intent of increasing the price.

You must have some kind of death wish.  Lawyers are a Hell of a lot more expensive, and most people hate them more than OPEC.   But you're right. The truth is that industrial diamonds are physically superior to the natural flavor and cheaper to boot.

[Masherbrum]

Your milkshake is in your gravity well under pressure sufficient to allow the milkshake to progress up your straw. The pressure my milkeshake is under will only allow flow up to 12". The distance you have to draw from is over 36". You can suck all you want but all you'll do is suck while I drink MY milkshake. Do you really enjoy sucking for nothing like that? 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URjeS5-NaXY&feature=related

[dkff49]

You must have some kind of death wish.  Lawyers are a Hell of a lot more expensive, and most people hate them more than OPEC.   But you're right. The truth is that industrial diamonds are physically superior to the natural flavor and cheaper to boot.

most of time we have an agreement, She doesn't ask and I don't buy. only time it is an issue is anniversary and Christmas.

oh well she knows when I feels something is wrong then I won't support it. she usually walks away ,mad then