We are getting a T-34 85... so what tank gun of the tanks is best?

[Karnak]

Agreed. The Russian 85mm is third most powerful of the guns we have available now.

The Russians won't have anything approaching the power of the 17Lb gun until you get the Russian 100mm gun.

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According to the penetration data that is out there the T34/85's 85mm DT-5 or 85mm ZiS-S-53 will be the fourth best tank gun currently in AH, behind the 17lber of the Sherman Firefly VC, 88mm KwK 36 L56 of the Tiger I , and 75mm KwK 40 L48 of the Panzer IV H.

[valdals]

Not really.  With basic AP ammo the T-34/85 cannot penetrate the Tiger's armor from anything other than short range.  The Tiger's 88 will go through the T-34/85's armor like a hot knife through butter.

why is it so many of my tiger rounds keep being absorbed by the t34/76 before he finally dies

[Iron_Cross]

Ok, All the available data I have suggests the 85mm gun will be 4^thin penetration beyond 1600m. Closer than that, the mass of the projectile will win through the 75mm gun on the Panzer, but just barely.

The Russian gun technology of the time lagged a bit behind.  Most of the tank guns had lower velocities than their German counterparts, therefore had inferior penetration characteristics.  To make up the difference they went with weight of shot to provide the force to penetrate the thick armor of the German tanks.  Newton said it best ( F=ma ) Force = Mass times Acceleration.  The Russians knew they didn't have the acceleration part down, so they upped the mass to apply the same force.  How do you get more mass, you get a bigger caliber gun.

[Karnak]

Yeah. There is no doubt that the T34/85 will be a far, far deadlier tank than the T34/76 we have now.

[Iron_Cross]

Yeah. There is no doubt that the T34/85 will be a far, far deadlier tank than the T34/76 we have now.

It should be equal to the Panzer IV(H) we have currently.  Beyond 1600m tho, main gun effectiveness drops significantly.  Speed is what this baby has.  I foresee this as the LTAR's favorite base-taking machine.  Survivable from medium-long range due to its sloped armor, and an effective gun from short-medium range, plus high speed, what is not to love?

EDIT:  Their is still room for the Panzer IV.  It's still effective beyond 1600m with its 75mm high velocity gun.  The T-34/76,  will still be useful, but we will see it IMHO more as a hoard tank.  Only useful unless in great numbers overwhelming any defence. I.E. the LTARs

[Nilsen]

How much speed will the T34/85 lose with what must be a heavier turret? Anyone have data on that?

[SmokinLoon]

All I wish for regarding this T34/85 is that the turret isnt made of cheese like the current AH2 T34.  A drunk peasant with no arms can throw a rock and disable the turrent in the current T34.  What a shame.

Anyone who has ever studied WWII armor understands that the Soviet 76mm on the T34 was "inferior" to the Pzr IV's 75mm (unless HVAP was used), but it was the armor toughness and design/slope and speed that propelled it ahead.  I dont ever recall reading where T34 turrets got knocked out easily.  Lets hope they fix that bug when they introduce the T34/85. 

I cant understand why people aregue that the T34 was the "best" practical tank of WWII, its gun was barely more a penetrater than the US 57mm or UK 6lb'er AP (which were good in their own right), the gun was slower than a 7 year itch to relaod, and the gun optics were severly inferior to the Pzr V's as well.  1v1 it gets owned by the Pzr V.  With that said, the T34 and the US/Sherman shared the "overwhelm" tactics book and fought the Pzr V in a 8 or 10 to 1 ratio.  Guess who wins.

   

[Cthulhu]

Ok, All the available data I have suggests the 85mm gun will be 4^thin penetration beyond 1600m. Closer than that, the mass of the projectile will win through the 75mm gun on the Panzer, but just barely.

The Russian gun technology of the time lagged a bit behind.  Most of the tank guns had lower velocities than their German counterparts, therefore had inferior penetration characteristics.  To make up the difference they went with weight of shot to provide the force to penetrate the thick armor of the German tanks.  Newton said it best ( F=ma ) Force = Mass times Acceleration.  The Russians knew they didn't have the acceleration part down, so they upped the mass to apply the same force.  How do you get more mass, you get a bigger caliber gun.

This has nothing to so with acceleration. Penetration is a function of either energy, or momentum. What you're describing is momentum, which usually is a poor substitute for kinetic energy when it comes to penetration. Let me give you an example:

9mm (124 gr ball) vs .45 (230 gr ball) against oh, let's say, Level II body armor.

9mm has higher energy, .45 has much higher momentum. Which one gets thru the armor more easily?

9mm. It's all about the energy.

And if you're thinking ,"Hey, but 9mm is smaller in diameter and pointier", you're right. But special light weight .45 rounds (and hence higher energy) can be made to penetrate just as easily as 9mm.

[GtoRA2]

All I wish for regarding this T34/85 is that the turret isnt made of cheese like the current AH2 T34.  A drunk peasant with no arms can throw a rock and disable the turrent in the current T34.  What a shame.

Anyone who has ever studied WWII armor understands that the Soviet 76mm on the T34 was "inferior" to the Pzr IV's 75mm (unless HVAP was used), but it was the armor toughness and design/slope and speed that propelled it ahead.  I dont ever recall reading where T34 turrets got knocked out easily.  Lets hope they fix that bug when they introduce the T34/85. 

I cant understand why people aregue that the T34 was the "best" practical tank of WWII, its gun was barely more a penetrater than the US 57mm or UK 6lb'er AP (which were good in their own right), the gun was slower than a 7 year itch to relaod, and the gun optics were severly inferior to the Pzr V's as well.  1v1 it gets owned by the Pzr V.  With that said, the T34 and the US/Sherman shared the "overwhelm" tactics book and fought the Pzr V in a 8 or 10 to 1 ratio.  Guess who wins.

   

The T-34 got its rep very early in the war, 1940, and 41, when most german armor had 50MM guns at best, or a short 75. Neither was all that good at hilling T-34s.

The Panzer 4 we have in the game was upgunned with a long 75 to deal with the T-34 and it does it well. They started doing this in early 42.  After that the T-34 was still good, but nothing really special. Also an ergonomic nightmare for the crew.

[Cthulhu]

The T-34 got its rep very early in the war, 1940, and 41, when most german armor had 50MM guns at best, or a short 75. Neither was all that good at hilling T-34s.

The Panzer 4 we have in the game was upgunned with a long 75 to deal with the T-34 and it does it well. They started doing this in early 42.  After that the T-34 was still good, but nothing really special. Also an ergonomic nightmare for the crew.

The true quality of the T-34 wasn't it's lethality. It was it's mobility and reliability. Much like the Sherman, but with superior protection.

[Nilsen]

...and numbers

[mipoikel]

I wish more authentic gunsights. Same way like in red orchestra.

[SmokinLoon]

I wish more authentic gunsights. Same way like in red orchestra.

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Ya mean that ... right now... we dont have an accurate gun sight???    Sometimes I wish that HTC would accept help from volunteers to help devise and code some of the little things that could and would help the game along.  I can only imagine there would be an army of coding volunteers if they openned up.  Everything from fixing gun sights to improving graphics, to researching stats, facts, and testimony of the planes and vehicles in the AH2 game.

[Cajunn]

I wish more authentic gunsights. Same way like in red orchestra.

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I like this....might put some spark back into the game for me!!!

[Scherf]

^ word.

They'd need to have some means to use it though - gameplay/strat has been static for how long now?

Not meant to be a swipe, just my own sad experience / perception.

I guess we're all still "Waiting for CT."