Author Topic: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft  (Read 1216 times)

Offline Skuzzy

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Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« on: August 06, 2008, 09:53:09 AM »
Microsoft has published a Vista Performance Guide.  It does require SP1 for Vista to be installed.

I have not completely read it yet, but thought I would go ahead and point it out.

I am part way through it and it is full of bogus information regarding ReadyBoost and SuperFetch.  The rest seems pretty generic.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2008, 10:01:10 AM by Skuzzy »
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Offline 633DH98

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2008, 10:13:00 AM »
More a sales pitch than useful information?  :huh
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2008, 10:35:12 AM »
Well, it is a given that most information available from Microsoft will be funneled through the marketing department and enhanced to put forth the "we are wonderful and good and perfect and benign" vibe that has made Microsoft the stalwart of philanthropy and goodness everyone has come to know and love.
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2008, 12:20:06 PM »
It all boils down to: Use the fastest drive you can buy. Install as much of the fastest RAM you can. Disable background services that are not needed. Optimize your system by defragging on a regular basis. If you have a piece of hardware that could be faster then replace it.

All that readyboost and readdrive business will not be ineffective in boosting the performance of a video game because its designed to speed up Windows. I tried it with a 4Gig USB flash drive and it does speed up Windows at startup and thats about it.

My current MB (P5N-E SLI) is PCIe 1.0 so I thought about switching over to the Asus P5Q so I could get PCIe 2.0 speeds (a PCIe 2.0 card in a PCIe 1.0 slot will only get x8 speed) but the only game that can actually benefit from that much horsepower is FSX. I also thought the 16Gigs of RAM the P5Q supports would be nice but even Vista x64 only delegates 4Gigs of memory to single applications so unless I want to run two games at the same time it wont do much for me.
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Offline Denholm

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #4 on: August 06, 2008, 01:04:22 PM »
I'm surprised Microsoft released this considering they're trying hard to throw Vista under the carpet.
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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #5 on: August 06, 2008, 01:08:22 PM »
I'm surprised Microsoft released this considering they're trying hard to throw Vista under the carpet.
They're not doing it fast enough...
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #6 on: August 06, 2008, 01:32:32 PM »
I dont think Microsoft knows what it is doing. It sure looks like they jumped the gun announcing the next operating system. Historically MS has never gotten an OS out the door on time and there is no reason to believe its true for the next one either. MS jumped the gun releasing Vista when they should have gotten things in order first. Nvidia nearly did the OS in by offering drivers that blue screened at every oppurtunity and now users have gotten into a negative mindset that will never be overcome.

Meanwhile Vista users (mostly gamers) are really enjoying the OS and taking benefit of the 64 bit environment that Ultimate offers. The more things change the more people want them to remain the same. I know people that are running XP on the same system they ran 98 on and now with Vista they want the OS to conform to their hardware and when it doesnt they complain the OS is terrible. With Vista you absolutely MUST throw more power at it with hardware and that is not likely to change in the next OS MS releases.

For me Microsoft finally offered what I have been looking for and since SP1 I havent had a single OS glitch that I didnt cause myself. I have had older software programs crash. The same programs would crash XP Pro and that would result in a system crash and forced reboot. With Vista after SP1 the OS announces the program has crashed and must be closed and then searches for a solution (there never is a solution because the program was poorly written by somone outside of MS). The OS does not crash although I do usually reboot to avoid issues I might not be aware of. The thing that is missing there is the potential for a crashed file system jumbled page file and an OS that wont boot and must be reinstalled as I often saw in XP Pro. I took steps to avoid problems then and I still do just in case. I will let you know if I ever have a major system meltdown or some catastrophe strikes but it really has been smooth sailing so far.
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Offline Hoarach

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #7 on: August 06, 2008, 01:45:16 PM »
Im still waiting for AMD to write a dual core patch to Vista though... :cry
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #8 on: August 06, 2008, 01:56:52 PM »
Meanwhile Vista users (mostly gamers) are really enjoying the OS and taking benefit of the 64 bit environment that Ultimate offers. The more things change the more people want them to remain the same. I know people that are running XP on the same system they ran 98 on and now with Vista they want the OS to conform to their hardware and when it doesnt they complain the OS is terrible. With Vista you absolutely MUST throw more power at it with hardware and that is not likely to change in the next OS MS releases.



Most of our customers that are Vista users that contact my company for tech support on any of our games, the majority of the time issues they face are Vista OS related, mostly driver issues.  Frankly, for gaming Vista is not a good choice.


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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #9 on: August 06, 2008, 02:21:08 PM »
Drivers for what? What games?
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #10 on: August 06, 2008, 03:20:38 PM »
I feel your pain Ack-Ack.  Even in its smallish numbers, Vista has more than doubled our support load.  Out of the box, Vista is an abomination for gaming.  Its default settings are just horrible.

Personally I never could use Vista due to the borked up sound system.  I do too much audio and video editing to even think about using Vista.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2008, 03:22:16 PM by Skuzzy »
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Offline Fulmar

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #11 on: August 06, 2008, 03:26:45 PM »
Microsoft could have saved money if they would have just shipped Vista as XP but with pair of mittens.
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Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2008, 03:37:45 PM »
Vista was designed by committee and it shows.  Unfortunately, it looks like Microsoft is going that way from now on so I hold little hope for a reasonable operating system to come from them in the future.

And the reason they are posting this type of information is in a disparate attempt to get people to use the operating system.  They know out of the box the OS is too full of bloat to do much of anything real time. The performance on the same hardware as XP is abysmal without bringing any real benefit.

People accuse others of being resistant to change, but change for the sake of change has never been a good thing.  Change for the sake of making things worse, is also not a good thing.

I am sure some will perceive Vista as a good thing if they are coming from some three or four year old XP installation that has been hammered by various spyware/malware programs and/or viruses over the years.  XP was a massive security hole begging to be exploited.  It has gotten better, and can be even better still when you ignore the default installation settings MS chooses.

I have access to both XP and Vista.  I have yet to find any reason for Vista to be used over XP.  In most cases XP is a better choice.  I cannot say that for Vista.
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #13 on: August 06, 2008, 03:42:00 PM »
I dont think Microsoft knows what it is doing. It sure looks like they jumped the gun announcing the next operating system. Historically MS has never gotten an OS out the door on time and there is no reason to believe its true for the next one either. MS jumped the gun releasing Vista when they should have gotten things in order first. Nvidia nearly did the OS in by offering drivers that blue screened at every oppurtunity and now users have gotten into a negative mindset that will never be overcome.

Nvidia drivers were pretty bad, overall. However, DirectX 10 itself isn't exactly stelar. You code something that has to interface with DX10, and no matter how well YOUR code is, DX10 could still mess up the end result.

Meanwhile Vista users (mostly gamers) are really enjoying the OS and taking benefit of the 64 bit environment that Ultimate offers. The more things change the more people want them to remain the same. I know people that are running XP on the same system they ran 98 on and now with Vista they want the OS to conform to their hardware and when it doesnt they complain the OS is terrible. With Vista you absolutely MUST throw more power at it with hardware and that is not likely to change in the next OS MS releases.

The 64-bit comment might not be accurate. 64-bit is still buggy and highly unsupported, compared to 32-bit, which itself isn't a dream to compare things to.

As for hardware requirements: Going from Win98 to XP was a little bit of a step up. Nothing major. However you can NOT run Vista properly without a dual core and 2 GB ram. Vista needs a frickin' GIGABYTE of ram and its own CPU core just to run the OS and nothing else. That's one of the stupidest arbitrary code bloat increases ever! There's "progress" then there's "MS getting plain sloppy" and this falls well into the latter category.

For me Microsoft finally offered what I have been looking for and since SP1 I havent had a single OS glitch that I didnt cause myself. I have had older software programs crash. The same programs would crash XP Pro and that would result in a system crash and forced reboot. With Vista after SP1 the OS announces the program has crashed and must be closed and then searches for a solution (there never is a solution because the program was poorly written by somone outside of MS). The OS does not crash although I do usually reboot to avoid issues I might not be aware of. The thing that is missing there is the potential for a crashed file system jumbled page file and an OS that wont boot and must be reinstalled as I often saw in XP Pro. I took steps to avoid problems then and I still do just in case. I will let you know if I ever have a major system meltdown or some catastrophe strikes but it really has been smooth sailing so far.

You must have had a seriously screwed up version of XP Pro. I've beat my system up with my own stupidity and COUNTLESS programs, games, tools, utilities, settings, and have almost NEVER had XP Pro crash on me ever, since I first got it. It's a major leap above Win98SE (high praise from me!) and far more stable. I haven't had a BSOD in probably almost a decade now. I have NOT had a forced reboot since Win98SE and even then I only had 2-3 in the entire span of years I used that OS as well.

As for "recovery, tries to solve it," that's a standard feature of Windows XP.

You seem quite biased  when you type the above and include comments such as:

"(there never is a solution because the program was poorly written by somone outside of MS)"

You blame other programs that function normally in XP for crashing in Vista. You blame the instability on the other programs and imply nobody outside of MS can program properly. Let us not forget that MS has so much code bloat that they HID an entire little 3D flight sim inside MS Word at one update and nobody at MS caught it until well after the fact.

End of the line: On the same hardware that runs Vista with no problem, XP runs noticably better. That means it's NOT just a matter of having the hardware to run it, even WHEN you do it's worse that what we've already had for almost a decade now. Given that, and the fact that XP will still run most games just as well as Vista, but can do so on 1/8th the system requirements, it means Vista was a bad idea.

To quote [paraphrase] Bill Gates, "Yeah, Vista was a bad idea."

Edit: Sorry if I came off as a crab, was in a bit of a mood. Edited.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2008, 04:08:28 PM by Krusty »

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: Vista Performance Guide from Microsoft
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2008, 03:54:21 PM »
Lighten up Krusty.  For some, Vista's appeal is that it seems more stable if they came from an XP box which was not stable.

As to why one computer is more stable than another computer is anyones guess.  Hardware and software configurations you can put together in a Windows system are boundless.  Some will be more problematic than others.  That is just the way it is.

It also leads to these discussions which cover so many extremes on who thinks what is best. In all of it there is no reason to bag on some user who is expressing his/her personal experience.  I have no doubt Challenge believes what he is saying.  I feel equally the same about those who have nothing but trouble with Vista.

Vista has a lot of problems and Microsoft has admitted as much.  They want to replace it as fast as they can.  Hopefully they learned a lesson with Vista and will not repeat the same mistake with Windows 7.  Only time will tell.
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