It's the refineries stoopid!

[Sixpence]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26321642

BTW, Toad, if you are out there, corn and pellet stoves are hard to come by up here, even during the summer, I should have got one two years ago.

Here in the northeast something like 80% of all households heat with oil. Everyone is scrambling to get a pellet stove.

Found this http://www.fahrenheittech.com/index.html  , thinking of making an investment. I have forced hot air and something like this could run into the duct work.

I have to make a decision soon, I can't afford to fill my tank once, let alone twice.

[Baitman]

Looking for heating you house check out this link.


Geothermal heat pumps....... Very cheap to run..... Mine has been in since '99 and I have been in the industry since '94

Heating, cooling, Saving the environment and saving money at the same time..


http://www.igshpa.okstate.edu/

[lyric1]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26321642

BTW, Toad, if you are out there, corn and pellet stoves are hard to come by up here, even during the summer, I should have got one two years ago.

Here in the northeast something like 80% of all households heat with oil. Everyone is scrambling to get a pellet stove.

Found this http://www.fahrenheittech.com/index.html  , thinking of making an investment. I have forced hot air and something like this could run into the duct work.

I have to make a decision soon, I can't afford to fill my tank once, let alone twice.

Friend of mine has a pellet stove he loves it.

[Trell]

At least in Michigan Electricity is regulated but Natural gas is not.  If this keeps up it will be cheaper to heat the house on electric where i live.

[pokecheck]

I know what I'll do, I shall remove the roof of my house and replace it with saran wrap .the sun will heat my house and the saran wrap wil keep me fresh that extra 2-3 days

[sunfan1121]

Pellet stoves are the way to go IMHO. Especially if you have a larger house and need to heat it up with as little energy as possible.

[gwano]

the problem with pellet stoves is the supply of pellets can and has been sometimes outpaced by the demand as the sales of stoves increases.
The pellets need to be manufactured and a constant supply of wood by-products must be readily available.
here in the pacific northwest the wood products industry has been hit real hard by the housing market slump and environmentalists locking out the timber industry from the forest.

I think that could make the long term supply not cost effective.
most national forests still allow wood cutting for personal use wood burning stoves.That is by far the most cost effective way to heat, but not practical for more urbanized areas.

[Toad]

You can burn almost any grain with corn giving more energy than the others.

Problem is corn has gotten pretty high too!

[Maverick]

It won't take long before the proliferation of pellet stoves and other wood burning heating options gets the look over by the eco folks. It wasn't that long ago that I recall seeing bans on wood burning fireplaces in communities over the air quality. You still have the old negatives since you are burning hydrocarbons, releasing CO and CO2 as well as other stuff into the air.

Before you spend a ton of money keep in mind that it's not the cleanest option for heating and may be a problem in the near future.

[Baitman]

Looking for heating you house check out this link.


Geothermal heat pumps....... Very cheap to run..... Mine has been in since '99 and I have been in the industry since '94

Heating, cooling, Saving the environment and saving money at the same time..


http://www.igshpa.okstate.edu/

Check it out. No flame, gas or oil required in your house. Just electricity, works out to be 300% to 400% more efficient than straight electricity. Can be used as far north as the Arctic circle. Doesn't pollute. Cheapest form of heating period.

Pellet stoves pollute and can be a target of government in the future just like the wood stoves.

[indy007]

I have to make a decision soon, I can't afford to fill my tank once, let alone twice.

Move to the south. It takes 80% less energy to cool than it does to heat.

[Toad]

Talk to me Baitman.

I am thinking about building an all-electric out in the country.

What's the best way to do geothermal? I have a pond that could hold the coils.

Brands? Methods? Tips?

[CptTrips]

Move to the south. It takes 80% less energy to cool than it does to heat.

  ???

I've been trying to research alternative energy for a house I want to build off grid.  Its my impression that it is a LOT easier to build an offgrid house that needs to be passively solar heated than passively cooled.  It would be a lot easier to build offgrid where heating is your main load.  Solar cooling is tough. 

YMMV,
Wab

[indy007]

???

I've been trying to research alternative energy for a house I want to build off grid.  Its my impression that it is a LOT easier to build an offgrid house that needs to be passively solar heated than passively cooled.  It would be a lot easier to build offgrid where heating is your main load.  Solar cooling is tough. 

YMMV,
Wab

I probably should have read more of the post If you're going to build the house from scratch and not convert something existing, look into insulated concrete forms. It's far superior to a stick built house in terms of both durability and efficiency. Do you have running water on the property? If so, you could easily drop down some off-the-shelf turbines and have plenty of power. The maintenance is basically keeping the intakes clear. With the off-grid, battery backed-up systems they have now, you can run all sorts of generators at the same time.. hydro, wind, solar.

There's a magazine called Home Power you can find at Barnes & Nobles. There's a lot of good info in it.

[Baitman]

Talk to me Baitman.

I am thinking about building an all-electric out in the country.

What's the best way to do geothermal? I have a pond that could hold the coils.

Brands? Methods? Tips?

Toad

I don't have Nat gas here so it was a no brainer for me to put in geothermal. (Ground Source Heat Pump) Even when nat gas was low priced in the 90's it was costing less to heat my house 3000+sq/ feet than my first house 1200sq/ feet with gas.

It can be retrofitted like mine (house built in the 70's geo in '99. Or installed in a new house. I haven't been involved in many lake or pond loops but go on the website that I provided earlier. It is the OK State University they do LOTS of work with testing and promoting Geo.

Owning a drilling company that specializes in the drilling of geoloops (water well and exploration also) I have installed many vertical loops for the Geo market. BUT my own house has a horizontal loop that we dug in with a excavator, because it was cheaper. We typicaly drill 180'+- boreholes per ton of heating (=360' of loop) or 1000' of loop laid in a trench. Makes a difference if the loop is dry or wet though, see the UOK website for pond loop information.

This is not new stuff, everyone at one time or another has burnt their hands a on the back of a fridge. Same thing only different.

Saving are quite good per month and you get heating and air conditioning. Plus it adds value to the house.

I put them in for myself cheap but if you let contractor do it they will take a nice profit.