Heath care and Hillary

[Jackal1]

I never could understand how these poor people who can afford a $100 a month for cable and $50 a month for cell phones can't afford maybe $75 a month for health care insurance.

lazs

I want the name of that company that has $75.00 a month health care insurance.

At any rate, health insurance is expensive enough as it stands. The price of my freedom and rights is damn sure a price I am not willing to pay.

[SD67]

Health insurance is THE most costly thing outside of rent/home repayments there is these days. And in some cases it can be even more expensive.
Here's an example of the approximate difference between your (USA) health care system and our (Australian) taxpayer funded health care system.
The Birth of our Daughter Brianna.
2 Week stay in Hospital in private room for Sarah due to extreme hypertension.
Emergency C-Section at 34 weeks gestation.
3 week stay in the NICU for Brianna with oxygen in the humidicrib and jaundice treatment until she was well enough to come home.
Cost to us in the USA, easily $100000-$200000
Cost to us in Australia, NOTHING, nil, nada, zip.

[Samiam]

That we have wound up calling what most people get from their employers health "insurance" is part of the problem.

In most cases, it's not insurance, it's a pre-paid health plan.

If what most folks really had was insurance - where they paid for all routine medical expenses out of pocket except for catastrophic events (say, over $10,000) like other insurance, then the cost of healthcare would be set by the market and the cost of insurance would be relatively low.

Make an impact - get a high deductible health plan and shop for your health care and spend your own money for it.

[SD67]

Employers don't offer health plans here.
You have two choices, you can pay unrealistically high (for the average family) premiums for health insurance and get a small tax break or pay what is called the Medicare levy (which is actually quite reasonable) and get almost the same level of healthcare for "free".
The only place that the public system really drops the ball is in dental care. It's cheaper in the long run for us to pay out of our own pockets for dental since most heath insurers will usually only refund you half anyway.

[Yeager]

Yeah, I'm also tired of hearing about it. It's time to actually do something about it.

Easy enough to say.......

[kamilyun]

The problem with healthcare...is that capitalism doesn't really jive with saving lives.  The best thing to do is collect $$$ from healthy people, then hope sick people die in a few hours.  Of course, this doesn't sound great to most people.

That said, I think the biggest problem with healthcare is the pharmaceutical industry.  A bunch of freeloading, lobbyist pigs.  The industry is probably next on the chopping block after other trendy investments that have recently failed.

[Hangtime]

The problem with healthcare...is that capitalism doesn't really jive with saving lives.  The best thing to do is collect $$$ from healthy people, then hope sick people die in a few hours.  Of course, this doesn't sound great to most people.

That said, I think the biggest problem with healthcare is the pharmaceutical industry.  A bunch of freeloading, lobbyist pigs.  The industry is probably next on the chopping block after other trendy investments that have recently failed.

Their profit margins go down, the price goes up. The 'industry' will not abandon is percentage without a gun to their heads. Same old crap.. just another world class screwing for joe public..

"Next..."

[Druss]

Look at the VA hospitals and you'll see what government healthcare reform will bring to the masses. 

Amen to that, brother! Anybody who thinks that federally underwritten healthcare will be just the same as their current healthcare are incredibly naive. I have seen the worst docters and nurses in VA facilities (not every single doctor and nurse, just most of them in my experience). I have seen a doctor pronounce a serious condition that needs prompt surgical attenttion check his calendar to schedule the surgery, find he is booked up for the next month so HE CHANGES THE DIAGNOSIS TO SOMETHING INNOCUOUS BECAUSE HE DOESN'T HAVE THE TIME TO DO IT! I have seen my dads (WW II vet, tank driver) doctor end his examination of my dad because HE HAD ALREADY USED UP THE 20 MINUTES ALLOTTED  FOR EACH PATIENT! This doctor only schedules patients appointments for 1 visit per 3 months. That's it. 20 minutes every 3 months. This is that doctors policy. When visiting my dad in one VA hospital, a man was being given a enema 6 feet from him in a 4 man ward. A short cotton curtain was the only thing separating the pairs of patients on each side of the room. Imagine your loved ones trying keep you company at your bedside while a man is blasting his bowels out into a steel bedpan a few feet away on the other side of a flimsy partial curtain.

BTW, on the other side of my dads bed was the rooms sink. The nurse (?) that came around to empty the urinals in each room was so damn lazy, she would simply dump them into the sink by his bed. Didn't even bother to rinse the sink out. Each time I entered the room the smell of old piss would nearly make me retch. He spoke to the head nurse about it and nothing was done.

I was there when these events took place. There are more events I could detail. These events took place in Jackson, Ms. and Big Springs, Tx.

My dad is now 84 years old. He has been suffering from injuries inflicted in WW II and is in constant pain. He is a veteran and the best man I ever met, yet he has been subjected to that kind of care in those federal hospitals. Yeah, the federal government really knows how to provide great health care.

BS!

[myelo]

Cost to us in Australia, NOTHING, nil, nada, zip.

Are you really so naive about basic economics to think that you don't pay for that? The money for the doctors, staff and hospitals just comes out of thin air?

[Getback]

Healthcare costs were low until the government got involved. I believe there are studies on this.

[SD67]

Are you really so naive about basic economics to think that you don't pay for that? The money for the doctors, staff and hospitals just comes out of thin air?

You neglected to read my follow up post didn't you?
I know it's not "free" every taxpayer is charged a Levy which goes toward the public heathcare system.
Those that can afford private health cover get to claim 50-75% of their fees and Medicare tops most of the gap up. They usually find themselves a little out of pocket.
For the most part the Public patients receive their health care free of charge. Most Doctors bulk bill, those that don't the patients receive a refund when they lodge their claim at a Medicare office either in person or by post.
Some specialists, like the ones Sarah needs to see to manage her chronic hypertension in her pregnancy charge above the rebate so we are a little out of pocket each visit but that's the way it goes.
All in all, it's been an effective working system in Australia for about a hundred years. Seems pretty sustainable to me.

[lazs2]

Oh wait.. I missunderstood...   you guys don't want health care.. you want unlimitied and free health care... sorry.

the $75 a month stuff has a $4000 deductible and does not pay for doctors visits or perscriptions.

If a $4000 deductible is going to ruin you then you should never own a car.. a transmission going out will cost more than that.. sometimes the glass.

If a $100 doctor visit is going to ruin you then you should not own a car or a cell phone..  Every time you take your car in for anything it is $100 to $500 or more..  some careless and useless texting will run your cell phone bill to $100

I average about 1 doctor visit every 10 years..  usually in an ambulance.    Always covered by some kind of insurance.   

I have had a heart operation that was a birth defect.. a  valve.. pretty common. thing.   It cost about a quarter million bucks.. I had insurance.. if I had a $4000 deductible I would be no worse off but.

The operation I had did not exist in the 50's.. the famous singer james darrin died from the same operation in the 60's  In the 50's you lived with it or died with it.

Any national health care is going to have to ration health care.   Any national health care is going to force you to live like a socialist in a nanny state.. you will be at their mercy and will be told what to eat and do and when to go to the doctor.

and... you will end up with british teeth anyway.

lazs

[indy007]

You neglected to read my follow up post didn't you?
I know it's not "free" every taxpayer is charged a Levy which goes toward the public heathcare system.

The problem is you're holding up the 100k-200k like it's a legit number. No woman I know has ever had to pay a bill like that. At most, they paid a few hundred in deductibles over the span of their pregnancy, from prenetal vitamins all the way to delivery. They're paying monthly private insurance premiums just like you said the pregnant women in the land down under do.

[Hap]

Time for this country to reform their health system where all Americans can afford to be protected no matter their income level, putting a price on whether a person lives or dies is shameful, disgraceful and not what America should be like.

Flat out true!

[Hornet33]

I look at it like this. If they want to raise my taxes to fund a national health care program, that's fine AS LONG as I still retain the option of providing my own insurance and still get to pick what doctor I go and see, AND my insurance premiums are tax deductable.