Author Topic: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama  (Read 1122 times)

Offline crockett

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #30 on: September 05, 2008, 09:39:41 AM »
O'Reilly tried to get Obama to admit he was wrong about the surge. Obama wouldn't do it. It occured to me that even though it's obvious he was wrong to anyone with half a brain there are those who will believe anything he says. He knows this which is why he won't admit the obvious. Kinda reminds me of our first black president.

Try to get Bush to admit it was wrong to pull our troops out of Afghanistan and go to Iraq. Try to get Bush to admit he screwed up at the start of Afghan and could have likely killed or captured Bin Laden but he didn't put enough troops on the ground. Try to get Bush to admit he messed up by not having a plan for once we took over Iraq just in case they didn't welcome us with "open arms". Obama isn't going to admit to anything like that just like no other politician would.

Overall I thought Obama could have been much better, he seemed to fumble around a bit which isn't common for him, so IMO it wasn't a very good interview for him or at least not one of his best. On the surge stuff yea can't really expect the guy to admit anything, because when he made that vote Bush had a bad track record in Iraq and we were losing ground. Voting yes or no was really just nothing more than taking a gamble, because with just the surge alone Iraq wouldn't have gotten better.

The deal is politically there wasn't much to gain by voting No or Yes because it's a lose lose situation. If he voted Yes then if it didn't work he looks bad, if he voted no and it didn't work the right blames him for the failure. If he voted no and it worked the Right use it against him. The important part is he voted with what he believed not, what would look the best politically.

I'd say the biggest thing that helped us, was the fact most of the insurgents turned sides and started helping us. Had that not happened the amount of troops would have been meaningless, because no army has ever out lasted a organized insurgency.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 09:44:07 AM by crockett »
"strafing"

Offline Gunthr

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #31 on: September 05, 2008, 09:52:27 AM »
I really can't listen to OReilly on the radio and I'm a talk show junkie.  He seems overly pompous as though he is unknowingly struggling against some sort of inferiority complex or something.  It grates on my nerves.

Past that,  I will ocassionally watch his tv interviews.  I'll watch Obama on his show tonight.  I don't think this kind of venue is Obama's forte at all.  If OReilly tries to pin Obama down on the tough questions I think Obama could have a problem.  He will have to try to hide or dilute his real feelings on issues in order to make them palatible to OReillie's audience, and the only way he knows how to do this is to start parsing his *** off... like at saddleback.
"When I speak I put on a mask. When I act, I am forced to take it off."  - Helvetius 18th Century

Offline AKIron

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #32 on: September 05, 2008, 09:53:11 AM »
Sometimes Crockett it really is as simple as there being a right choice and a wrong choice. Obama made the wrong one but is unwilling to admit it. If you're looking for excuses life can always be complicated enough to provide one or two.
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Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #33 on: September 05, 2008, 10:12:41 AM »
Try to get Bush to admit it was wrong to pull our troops out of Afghanistan and go to Iraq.

"But Mommy, Charlie's parents let him do it!"

Does that excuse ever work?
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Offline SkyRock

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #34 on: September 05, 2008, 10:18:55 AM »

Like I said before and I'll say again, he's better than NBC or CNN,
you make no sense, how can an anchor be better than a network?   you say you don't like him then you say hes the best out there.  :huh

Bill O'reily is one of the most notorious hipocrits in the biz, and he's a complete and utter a'hole.  Just google "Oreily blows top". :aok He's a worthless pos

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline crockett

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #35 on: September 05, 2008, 10:34:44 AM »
Sometimes Crockett it really is as simple as there being a right choice and a wrong choice. Obama made the wrong one but is unwilling to admit it. If you're looking for excuses life can always be complicated enough to provide one or two.

It's easy to say that in hind sight, once it worked but you know damn well if it didn't work you would have been bashing Obama if he had voted Yes. If I remember correctly, Obama didn't vote for this because Bush was "at that time" against giving a firm withdraw time line. Obama wasn't going to vote for more troops with no end in sight. Obama stuck to his guns about wanting a firm time line for troop withdraw. Also if I remember correctly Obama did vote yes for more funding prior to this but the Republicans wouldn't vote yes at that time, because there was a timeline in the bill and it didn't pass.

If I'm not mistaken this was the same bill and Obama voted no the second time around because the troop withdraw time line was taken out.
"strafing"

Offline AKIron

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2008, 11:11:03 AM »
It's easy to say that in hind sight, once it worked but you know damn well if it didn't work you would have been bashing Obama if he had voted Yes. If I remember correctly, Obama didn't vote for this because Bush was "at that time" against giving a firm withdraw time line. Obama wasn't going to vote for more troops with no end in sight. Obama stuck to his guns about wanting a firm time line for troop withdraw. Also if I remember correctly Obama did vote yes for more funding prior to this but the Republicans wouldn't vote yes at that time, because there was a timeline in the bill and it didn't pass.

If I'm not mistaken this was the same bill and Obama voted no the second time around because the troop withdraw time line was taken out.

Whoa, with all your criticisms of Bush you aren't allowed to use the "hindsight" argument.

However, if you insist, Obama's hindsight appears to need corrective lenses. It doesn't appear that he realizes he was wrong when voting to deny the surge that McCain championed.
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Offline Hap

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2008, 11:19:00 AM »
Does TV, Youtube, radio mess big time with either side saying, "You're right.  I was wrong about that"?  It would be blasted 24/7 everywhere with the caption, "Do you want someone who was wrong about something running America?"

Actually, it's the people behind the scenes I guess.  The media doesn't kill people; people kill people.  Which I don't buy.  I hate the "Look!  He ate the head off a ferret" stuff.

I know much is a sideshow.  And amongst it profounder things exist.

Would have been nice if Obama had said, "I was against the surge because I thought it would not work.  Also, by being against it, I could be on the popular side of American opinion.  I thought doing so would serve me well during the primaries and election.  I was surprised that it worked.  I was wrong about the surge."



Offline SkyRock

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #38 on: September 05, 2008, 11:44:56 AM »
Does TV, Youtube, radio mess big time with either side saying, "You're right.  I was wrong about that"?  It would be blasted 24/7 everywhere with the caption, "Do you want someone who was wrong about something running America?"

Actually, it's the people behind the scenes I guess.  The media doesn't kill people; people kill people.  Which I don't buy.  I hate the "Look!  He ate the head off a ferret" stuff.

I know much is a sideshow.  And amongst it profounder things exist.

Would have been nice if Obama had said, "I was against the surge because I thought it would not work.  Also, by being against it, I could be on the popular side of American opinion.  I thought doing so would serve me well during the primaries and election.  I was surprised that it worked.  I was wrong about the surge."



or maybe he is trying to keep his stance from the get go.  No more troops, get the F out now. 




BUt i think hes just a twit anyway so who cares...

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline AKIron

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #39 on: September 05, 2008, 11:47:39 AM »
or maybe he is trying to keep his stance from the get go.  No more troops, get the F out now. 




BUt i think hes just a twit anyway so who cares...

It's hard to know his position, I think it's above his pay grade.
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Offline SkyRock

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #40 on: September 05, 2008, 12:16:26 PM »
It's hard to know his position, I think it's above his pay grade.
His position is, it was wrong from the beginning to even be in IRAQ.  The question is a no win for him, because his response would most certainly be used in negative context by his enemies, when in fact his position has always been no on IRAQ.  The surge was a last ditch effort from Bush to stem the tide of deaths of americans over there, unfortunately for his legacy, proof that the surge worked will always be distorted with the payoff of the sunni's.

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline crockett

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #41 on: September 05, 2008, 12:22:30 PM »
Whoa, with all your criticisms of Bush you aren't allowed to use the "hindsight" argument.

However, if you insist, Obama's hindsight appears to need corrective lenses. It doesn't appear that he realizes he was wrong when voting to deny the surge that McCain championed.

Why not?  I never supported the war in Iraq from the get go I've always been against it.

I did and still do support the war in Afghanistan because it is part of the "real" war on terror. I was extremely pissed when Bush and co started pulling troops out of Afghan to put in Iraq and I predicted that Afghan would turn to crap because of it.

I don't need to say anything in hindsight with regards to Bush because I knew it and said it before hand.
"strafing"

Offline lazs2

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2008, 02:42:48 PM »
damn crock-it..  you sure spew a lot of stuff just to agree that your boy was wrong on the surge.

Just say "osamabama was wrong on the surge cause he doesn't have a clue" and get it over with.   that's all anyone got out of your 3 speech's on it anyway.

lazs

Offline john9001

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #43 on: September 05, 2008, 02:54:28 PM »
crockett , like obama is just dancing in the dark.

Offline Mace2004

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Re: The O & O Show....O'Reilly and Obama
« Reply #44 on: September 05, 2008, 09:54:18 PM »
Why not?  I never supported the war in Iraq from the get go I've always been against it.

I did and still do support the war in Afghanistan because it is part of the "real" war on terror. I was extremely pissed when Bush and co started pulling troops out of Afghan to put in Iraq and I predicted that Afghan would turn to crap because of it.

I don't need to say anything in hindsight with regards to Bush because I knew it and said it before hand.
As someone who has been involved in the WOT for eight years (four active duty, four as a DOD civilian) I can tell you that you don't know what you're talking about when you speak of the "real" war on terror.  It is not just an Afghanistan thing, it's the entire region and yes, that includes Iraq.  You can add Iran, Syria, Lebanon, the Arabian Penninsula, the 'stans, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, South America, etc., etc., etc.  The war in Iraq has done more damage to al Qaida then most know or understand but then most people rely on the media and political pundits for their views.  Things are not nearly as simple as 30-second soundbites make it sound.

We can all, with hindsight, declare what went right or wrong but then we didn't have to make the call when the results were not known.  No war is mistake free, there are certainly things that can be debated; however, for Obama to refuse to acknowledge he was wrong is dishonest or blind.  For those that claim that it wasn't the surge it was other factors, they are ignoring the enabler for these other factors.  Sunni insurgents started to jump ship and come over to our side because we had already announced the surge and Sadr's Mahdi Army was beaten after the surge began.  These guys knew they couldn't win and, after the surge was announced, knew they could no longer wait it out.

This is exactly why all these anti-war politicians are dispicable.  Not because they oppose war but because their constant threats to pull funding and impeach Bush encouraged the enemy to continue to fight.  This is also why the stupidist f##king thing you can do in a war is set a date for it to end.  The enemy will just wait you out just as the North Vietnamese did when we announced we were withdrawing our troops from South Vietnam.  I'll also remind you that GEN Petraus still says that the achievements of the surge are not set in concrete.  My fear is that an Obama presidency will encourage yet another round of insurgency aided and abetted by an Iran with no reason to fear us.  On a more historical note, North Vietnam admitted it was the anti-war crowd in the US and Europe that encouraged them to continue a fight they had already lost militarily in 1968.  It's really pretty simple when you think about it. 
Mace
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