Author Topic: This month's casualties...  (Read 661 times)

Offline mg1942

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This month's casualties...
« on: September 19, 2008, 03:52:57 AM »
September casualties...


Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
- US mortgage lenders.
- Bailed out by US government to the tune of US$100 billion.

Merrill Lynch
- Investment bank
- Nearly collapsed, but saved by shotgun marriage to Bank of America, which will acquire it for US$50 billion.

Lehman Brothers
- Investment bank
- RIP
- Parts of its North American businesses will be acquired by Barclays.

AIG
- World's largest insurer.
- Rescued from brink of collapse by US$85 billion bailout from US Fed Reserve.

HBOS
- British mortgage lender.
- Lloyds TSB has just bought it at a bargain price of US$22.2 billion.

There are worries that Morgan Stanley (investment bank) and Washington Mutual (US savings bank) are next on the chopping block.

« Last Edit: September 19, 2008, 04:04:26 AM by mg1942 »

Offline mg1942

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2008, 04:02:23 AM »
The problems began with the steady deregulation of the US financial industry that started over 20 years ago.

At this point, most observers probably feel a smug sense of schadenfreude while watching the mess unfold. The truth is, we are all equally to blame. The gigantic scale of the present problem could not have been caused by just a handful of greedy bankers or insurance salesmen alone. It was also caused by rampant consumer and corporate demand for liquidity created by secularization. Without the availability of free-flowing funds, the dot-com boom of the 1990s would not have been possible, for example.

In a very real sense, all of us are getting our long overdue comeuppance now. The entire system is at fault, because it had been built primarily on that most primal of human instincts — GREED :)

The US and British banking system had, quite simply, lost touch with the real economy. When all kinds of dodgy deals — ranging from "business models" written on the back of a napkin to sub-prime mortgages — can be packaged neatly into financial instruments that are then traded on the world market, we've created a system that progressively encouraged the original lenders to neglect due diligence.

In effect, banks and moneylenders enjoyed a situation where they could keep passing the buck, and make money out of it. Hence the temptation to create more such dodgy deals.

During the boom years of banking growth, US and Euro banks frequently called Asian bankers wussies for not leveraging up and getting "optimal" returns for their capital. Well, look who has the last laugh now. At a time when US and British financial institutions are trembling, Asian banks are standing steady on rock-solid foundations of deposits.

Even then, there is little room to gloat. The world economy is so tightly interconnected today that everyone will be affected sooner or later The cost of debt has suddenly shot up over the week, which means that credit has all but dried up for many individuals and businesses. That could, in turn, affect the real economy, as many companies might suddenly find it harder to manage their cash flow. That could, in turn, lead to recession and job losses, and if the situation gets out of hand, another Great Depression could materialize :uhoh

The only "good news" for now is that oil prices are falling, due to worries over slowing global demand :) Hopefully, that would drag down other commodity prices as well. It would be disastrous to deal with a recession at a time of cost-driven inflation.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2008, 04:06:41 AM by mg1942 »

Offline mg1942

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2008, 04:15:46 AM »
I've been following the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac fallout since September 8 while you guys continue to talk about lipsticks, pigs, Palin, and The Anointed One :D


Offline Hangtime

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2008, 04:23:25 AM »
You won't mind if I reject responsibility for this fiasco. I pay my bills, have no credit load and own outright my property. I pay my taxes, own a business and it is never encumbered. I run at a small but steady budget surplus. I don't believe in deficit spending.

Kitchen Table Economics.

This ain't my freaking mess, and I don't deserve any 'comeuppance', nor should I be paying for somebody else falling asleep at their switch. Mine's been manned.

Bastards. Screwed us again.

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Offline SD67

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2008, 04:26:12 AM »
It's a sad state of affairs indeed. How much is all this costing you guys in the long run?
Should the Government really be bailing out these institutions?
9GIAP VVS RKKA
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Offline Vulcan

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2008, 05:17:00 AM »
It's a sad state of affairs indeed. How much is all this costing you guys in the long run?
Should the Government really be bailing out these institutions?

As I understand the US Federal Reserve is not really government, it has representatives of the US Government on it's board, but the money under it's control is capital contributed by private banks. So this whole "the US government is bailing the banks out with taxpayer money" we're getting at this end of the world isn't right. Anyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Offline Getback

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2008, 06:07:16 AM »
You won't mind if I reject responsibility for this fiasco. I pay my bills, have no credit load and own outright my property. I pay my taxes, own a business and it is never encumbered. I run at a small but steady budget surplus. I don't believe in deficit spending.

Kitchen Table Economics.

This ain't my freaking mess, and I don't deserve any 'comeuppance', nor should I be paying for somebody else falling asleep at their switch. Mine's been manned.

Bastards. Screwed us again.



Ditto! It's bail out mania. Much of the housing woes here in he US originated in the 1990s when banks could be sued over not lending money to minorities. So they basically had to loan money no matter if the people could afford it or not.

This is how I see it. The government, the banks, and the folks who borrowed the money are to blame fannie mae and freddiemac.

As far as the other failed companies I don't know.

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Offline SD67

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2008, 06:22:32 AM »
You're kidding me right?
People were suing the banks because they were not lending money to people who couldn't afford to pay it back?
That's just plain and outright stupidity.
9GIAP VVS RKKA
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Fabricati diem, punc
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Offline Phaser11

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2008, 06:31:33 AM »
I was thinking,
 If the feds bail everyone out, I could dump my house and they would cover it! I'll keep an eye on it too.
Phaser11,

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Offline croduh

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #9 on: September 19, 2008, 06:45:29 AM »
I've been following the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac fallout since September 8 while you guys continue to talk about lipsticks, pigs, Palin, and The Anointed One :D

SSSSHHHHHHhhhhh....

Didn't anyone tell you that politics are more fun than economy?<oldrolleyessmiley>

Offline lazs2

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2008, 08:04:53 AM »
hang.. it is only about 1% of the people who bought homes that are causing the problem..  that is a lot tho.. most of the problem was with regulation..  they forced loan companies to lower standards to let in "low income" and minority people into the process..

the scum bags used the loopholes created by the government.

Just like forcing schools to take people based on color and to take illegals has ruined the school system..

lazs

Offline WWhiskey

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2008, 08:34:20 AM »
I've been following the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac fallout since September 8 while you guys continue to talk about lipsticks, pigs, Palin, and The Anointed One :D



amen brother :pray
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Offline MoeRon

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2008, 08:42:51 AM »
It's a sad state of affairs indeed. How much is all this costing you guys in the long run?
Should the Government really be bailing out these institutions?

3.4 trillion is what i heard, and it'll go up from there... :furious
Lotteries are a tax for people who suck at math.

Offline Kaw1000

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #13 on: September 19, 2008, 08:52:35 AM »
My company's having a hard time. How can I get the government to bail me out?
If they won't, maybe I'll file a law suit.

The bottom line here is GREED. As I spoke of in previous post.

If the government doesn't hold Ceos and their cronies accountable for this mess,
They are fools.
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Offline alskahawk

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Re: This month's casualties...
« Reply #14 on: September 19, 2008, 08:56:45 AM »
 There will be more failures. We have not seen the end of this.

What I would like to know is how much the Ceo received for driving their companies into bankruptcy?

Why after the questionable accounting practices of Enron are we seeing questionable accounting practices again?

How many mega luxury jets these companies have.

What kind of compensation the boards get.

I would also like to know how well either of our candidates know these CEO's.
  How much did these companies contribute to the campaigns?
  How much did they spend on lobbyists?

 From what I heard, AIG CEO (June 08-Sept 08) Got a 5 million dollar check. Nice. What did the old CEO get to drive this mega corp into the ground.

Why isn't the government breaking up AIG since it is obviously a danger to the world economy due to it's shear size?