The Bailout

[rpm]

The text of the $700 billion government bailout bill is relatively short, very clear, and absolutely jaw dropping. In essence, it gives Secretary of the Treasury the authority to buy whatever mortgage loans he wants from banks across the nation and, heck, maybe even get pretty creative.

Proof:
Sec. 2(b) Necessary Actions.--The Secretary is authorized to take such actions as the Secretary deems necessary to carry out the authorities in this Act,

And what if he does something absolutely stupid or wants to bail out banks with whom he has past personal or business relationships? Get ready for the shocker:


Sec. 8. Review.

Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.


I've never seen anything like what our federal government is doing right now. They are giving our money away and telling us to our face that there is nothing we can do to challenge it. And it's a bi-partisan slap in the face with a Republican president and a Democratic congress.

[MORAY37]

The text of the $700 billion government bailout bill is relatively short, very clear, and absolutely jaw dropping. In essence, it gives Secretary of the Treasury the authority to buy whatever mortgage loans he wants from banks across the nation and, heck, maybe even get pretty creative.

Proof:
Sec. 2(b) Necessary Actions.--The Secretary is authorized to take such actions as the Secretary deems necessary to carry out the authorities in this Act,

And what if he does something absolutely stupid or wants to bail out banks with whom he has past personal or business relationships? Get ready for the shocker:


Sec. 8. Review.

Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.


I've never seen anything like what our federal government is doing right now. They are giving our money away and telling us to our face that there is nothing we can do to challenge it. And it's a bi-partisan slap in the face with a Republican president and a Democratic congress.

I suppose the complete and utter failure of the global economic system was the better, more rational choice?

I'll take the bad solution over the catastrophic one, alex, for 700 billion.

  I don't have to like it... and I don't, but it is the best of the two options.  Deregulation, pushed through for the past 25 years got us here.  We now need transparency and certain amounts of real regulation of the system to be put back into place.... you know, like they did when this happened last time..... 80 years ago.  People who do the same thing and expect a different outcome....purely stupid.

One thing I do agree with you on....
Non-elected and non-accountable (read: non-punishable) individuals should not have this authority.  That is one thing I am truly on your side with. 

[Delirium]

I'm sure we'll hear about a new Savings and Loans scandal in the next few years.

Worse yet, one of the arsehats responsible for this, Christopher Dodd (Senate Banking Committee), received money from a mortage lender and received rates well and above favorable. So, I suppose it already happening...

No, not everyone from Connecticut likes Dodd, in fact some of us know he is nothing like his father.

[rpm]

I suppose the complete and utter failure of the global economic system was the better, more rational choice?

I'll take the bad solution over the catastrophic one, alex, for 700 billion. 

There should be accountability. You don't give someone absolute power and expect them not to abuse it.

John McCain seems to think the same way I do. You voting for Obama now Moray or you just jumping in to oppose something because I posted it without doing any research?

I'll take stupid kneejerk reactions for $1000, Alex.

[MORAY37]

There should be accountability. You don't give someone absolute power and expect them not to abuse it.

John McCain seems to think the same way. You voting for Obama now Moray or you just jumping on the latest bandwagon?

Doesn't matter who i'm voting for.  Sharing that information could fundamentally alter this debate.  I don't jump on bandwagons, either.  I've been for the same individual since the election began.

[rpm]

So you are all in favor of turning the treasury loose to an appointed official with zero accountability for any action he may take.
Because that's what this bill will do.

[Hangtime]

I suppose the complete and utter failure of the global economic system was the better, more rational choice?

If your an ammo wholesaler, distributor or retailer... yes.

In fact, I'm thinking of expanding into sandbags and MRE's.

And, no; no ammo for you, turtle doc. You can stand in line with the peasants at K-Mart 'n pay retail.

While supplies last.



 

[Eagler]

So you are all in favor of turning the treasury loose to an appointed official with zero accountability for any action he may take.
Because that's what this bill will do.

what is your plan "B"?
it's my understanding that the issue is that if we procrastinate, it'll blow up in our face and that 700 billion figure multiplies, I'm sure it is already a trillion just being sold as "only" 700 billion.

The whole thing is retarded. We are rewarding poor performance without any penalties for getting us in this boat. I think whatever action we do now is but a stop gap measure putting off a collapse for the time being but not eliminating it.

How much pork, that is not in the total, do you think they'll stick on this one knowing it has to pass and pass soon?

[Wayout]

Wow, this is scary.   

"Sec. 10. Increase in Statutory Limit on the Public Debt.
Subsection (b) of section 3101 of title 31, United States Code, is amended by striking out the dollar limitation contained in such subsection and inserting in lieu there
of $11,315,000,000,000."

I wonder why no one in Congress is calling for an investigation or Special Prosecutor to look into the massive fraud that has taken place. It seems like this would be a slam dunk. After all is said and done this will make Enron seem like nothing.

[bj229r]

I wonder why no one in Congress is calling for an investigation or Special Prosecutor to look into the massive fraud that has taken place

Alas, there was no criminal acts committed here, mortgage lenders were brow-beaten into loaning money to people who never had a prayer of paying it back (in mid-90's they were actually given QUOTAS on poor/minority lending numbers---failing to meet said quotas was detrimental to their fiscal future) , and Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac backed up said loans, with OUR money---mortgage people made a mint off points, closing costs, etc.....people who ran Fannie/Freddie made a ton of money....now all these defaults are trickling down into the rest of the financial world. (Greenspan warned of this very hting in '95...Boosh people made a little noise ~ 5 years ago about putting Fannie/Freddie under a regulator, but nothing happened.) I think this mess is bi-partisan for the most part, but I find it quite galling that Barney Frank is trying to point fingers, as he specifically blocked efforts to reign in this mess while it was in a much more manageable state

[Hap]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_qgVn-Op7Q

That's the only sensible thing left to do.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

This thing happened in Finland too. Banks screwed up royally. Call in government. Banks get paid off by tax funds. People still lose their property, money and lives.

Banks never pay a dime back from the taxmoney. Bank owners continue to raise profit.

It pays to be in banking business. 

[crockett]

Alas, there was no criminal acts committed here, mortgage lenders were brow-beaten into loaning money to people who never had a prayer of paying it back (in mid-90's they were actually given QUOTAS on poor/minority lending numbers---failing to meet said quotas was detrimental to their fiscal future) , and Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac backed up said loans, with OUR money---mortgage people made a mint off points, closing costs, etc.....people who ran Fannie/Freddie made a ton of money....now all these defaults are trickling down into the rest of the financial world. (Greenspan warned of this very hting in '95...Boosh people made a little noise ~ 5 years ago about putting Fannie/Freddie under a regulator, but nothing happened.) I think this mess is bi-partisan for the most part, but I find it quite galling that Barney Frank is trying to point fingers, as he specifically blocked efforts to reign in this mess while it was in a much more manageable state

Man you are so full of it your Avatar is brown...

No one was "brow-beaten into loaning money to people who never had a prayer of paying it back".. The mortgage companies wanted to lend the money to these people because it's where their biggest profits are. The lending companies wrote the damn bill that you are complaining about, they wanted less govt regulation, just so they could lend to low income people.

Why do you think credit card companies sign up college students in droves that have no jobs? Why because they know they will end up making huge profits  off them in late fees and high interest. The mortgage companies did the same thing, it just wasn't college students with no jobs, but rather low income people who could barely afford the payments.

Hell it wasn't even low income, most of the defaults are from middle class working people who took on more than they could handle. So claiming it was low income people's fault is very far from the truth.

[SD67]

Mortgage companies LOVED lending money to low income people to buy houses.
They were to make a KILLING when the inevitable happened, they'd repossess them and sell them at a very tidy profit.
That was the theory. Pity it went tits up eh?

[FrodeMk3]

Eagler brought up something which is probably as shocking or important, as the wholesale investment of power into one individual:

it's my understanding that the issue is that if we procrastinate, it'll blow up in our face and that 700 billion figure multiplies, I'm sure it is already a trillion just being sold as "only" 700 billion.

It might not be a matter of procrastination, but whether or not anything was done quickly enough. If it is Too little too late, then what are the ramifications' of any shortfall in monies? Only certain people get bailed out, and not others?

And I feel the same as RPM does on this. There's absolutely no diddlying way that whomever is doling out this money should not be held accountable. It's like gov't. sanctioning corruption.