Trouble on the Pakistani Border.

[Dos Equis]

However, putting a 100% effort into the Vietnam war might ultimately have led to a nuclear or at least large-scale conventional confrontation with China, surely an even worse outcome than the one we got. So perhaps we should have called the whole thing off before we started.

I disagree, with respect.

The Chinese in the late 1960s are not the Chinese of today. They couldn't field a fleet of subs. The tech they bought from the Russians was crap. Many of the nukes would not have gotten off the launch pad, and probably not detonated had they made it across the Pacific.

They were in no mood to fight the US.

Today - much different story.

[Elfie]

Yes...the strategy in Vietnam WAS pissing in the wind, because we never tried to strike a killing blow to the enemy's means of making war.

However, putting a 100% effort into the Vietnam war might ultimately have led to a nuclear or at least large-scale conventional confrontation with China, surely an even worse outcome than the one we got. So perhaps we should have called the whole thing off before we started.

I don't think we needed to worry about China, China and Vietnam aren't exactly friendly with each other as evidenced by the border war in '79 (?). The two borders we needed to cross to get to the NVA and VC havens was Cambodia and Laos anyways.

[FrodeMk3]

They will just borrow more from China I'm guessing. /sigh

Hold that thought for a moment, and read this:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Pakistani_relations

If what it says is true, then we might NOT be able to borrow, If China's that friendly with Pakistan. I don't think that any overt conflict between the U.S. and Pakistan would result in large-scale Chinese involvement, but-The Chinese might call in all of the bonds' we've gotten with their backing to date. On top of the bailout, It could be economically ruinous, to say the least.

[Dos Equis]

Hold that thought for a moment, and read this:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Pakistani_relations

If what it says is true, then we might NOT be able to borrow, If China's that friendly with Pakistan. I don't think that any overt conflict between the U.S. and Pakistan would result in large-scale Chinese involvement, but-The Chinese might call in all of the bonds' we've gotten with their backing to date. On top of the bailout, It could be economically ruinous, to say the least.

If the Chinese call in the bonds, we have to pay them in dollars. We don't have the money. We have to get the US treasury to print it. Dollar dives, inflation soars. We become Israel in the 1950s, Weimar Germany in the late 1920s. A whopper junior will cost 8 bucks. The minimum wage will stay the same as it is today. Depression = on.

China is sitting on $500B in dollars already. They lose. What can they buy for that money? US businesses. US real estate.

It's like playing a game of Civilization. They don't go to war with us. They simply buy us out.

I say we sell them Texas first.

[Elfie]

Hold that thought for a moment, and read this:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sino-Pakistani_relations

If what it says is true, then we might NOT be able to borrow, If China's that friendly with Pakistan. I don't think that any overt conflict between the U.S. and Pakistan would result in large-scale Chinese involvement, but-The Chinese might call in all of the bonds' we've gotten with their backing to date. On top of the bailout, It could be economically ruinous, to say the least.

Would China call in all the bonds knowing that they would become virtually worthless since the US would have to print money to pay them? Just a hunch, but I'd say the Chinese are smarter than that. If they did call in the bonds and US inflation went through the roof, who would they find to buy all the junk they sell to us every year? Again, just a hunch but I think the Chinese are smarter than that.

[Elfie]

I say we sell them Texas first.

I say we sell them NY first, Texas has to much oil.   

[crazyivan]

Chinese indutry hasn't been doing good last few years I think. So there probably worried about themselves rather than sabatoging the US.

   Oh yeah, Drone predator went down.  Looks like were looking at something 

[Yeager]

If ever there was a case to be made for an organism collapsing in on itself from its own mass then China is the case to study.  They will collapse as sure as they sun rises, sooner rather than later.  The thing we living in the REST of the world need to start planning for is on how to get the hell out of the way when it happens.

[Hangtime]

I say we sell them NY first, Texas has to much oil.   

hey.. Fuggedaboudit.

[Elfie]

hey.. Fuggedaboudit.

You could move to Texas if we sold NY. 

[Hangtime]

No thanks. The crap they call pizza out there is reason enuff.

[Elfie]

Ok, move to Nebraska then and eat pizza from this place. You have to eat at the original one at 35th and Holdrege in Lincoln first though.

http://www.valentinos.com/locations.php?cityReq=Lincoln

[BnZ]

No thanks. The crap they call pizza out there is reason enuff.

I like the BBQed-goat and jalepeno pizza, TYVM.

[Hangtime]

*shudder*

[FrodeMk3]

Here, I would have to pose a different sort of question to you all, in regards to China; We all assume that China wants a large, Western-style economy just because...they like the toys, or whatever. But suppose that they are willing to go back to the privations' of life as they knew it after the revolution, and what they lived like right up until the '70's...If it meant the destruction of the U.S. economy, and the way we live? What we see of China, is usually their bigger cities. They spiffed up Beijing as much as they could for the Olympics, but it was still dirty. A large part of rural China lives without power, running water, etc. much like they did before the revolution. If China's leaders are willing to permit that, I don't doubt that they would subject their population to any kind of retrograde move in lifestyle if it meant crippling us economically.

The potential for it is there, if you look at the way they treated Olympic protesters...China's still as ruthless as it was in '89 in Tianemen square.