Author Topic: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!  (Read 2417 times)

Offline Sixpence

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #90 on: September 29, 2008, 04:10:39 PM »
This is going to get passed one way or another.

Right, but by voting 'no' the first time, they can use it in their re-election bid.
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

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Offline Hangtime

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #91 on: September 29, 2008, 04:19:02 PM »

It's all well and good to say the boat you are in sucks and we need a new one but if you don't stop the leaks you can't build the replacement once you are treading water. You might hate the captain and the engineering staff but that won't matter much when it sinks.

When the hole in the boat is bigger than the bucket, it's time to get off the boat. The captain can go down, sinking with his ship is part of his time honored responsibility. Not letting the bum drown me is something I planned for. Like Nils sez, the warning lights have been flashing for quite awhile now... and damage control is over matched.

It's time to man the lifeboat stations, she's going down.
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #92 on: September 29, 2008, 04:24:20 PM »
Right, but by voting 'no' the first time, they can use it in their re-election bid.

So the next 2-3 times before the election will be for what? The problem the problem is taxation which is forcing more and more individuals to seek credit on an uncertain future. We founded this country on representation before taxation and freedom from fear of 'debtors prison' so now we are taxed without adequate representation the banks and government enter into contractual agreements for 'the benefit of the poor' on our behalf and the only people that have to fear consequences (the prison of financial collapse) are the tax payers.
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Offline 1pLUs44

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #93 on: September 29, 2008, 04:51:14 PM »
Well they succeeded in killing the bill it seems for the time being. The market has responded. I hope those that thought the idea was not good can celebrate with the more than 700 point downturn in the market today. Losing 400 points in 10 minutes is really nice isn't it.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080929/ap_on_bi_st_ma_re/wall_street

 Nice job there looking out for the country and the economy.
:huh

The bail out bill is enough to give everyone over 18 in America 5 Million dollars. Thats a bit TOO much.
No one knows what the future may bring.

Offline Mr No Name

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #94 on: September 29, 2008, 04:52:31 PM »
No it was the lack of regulations that allowed rotten loans to be pushed around the system. The warning lights have been flashing for a pretty long time but the financial market was left to do what it did because it was not correctly regulated and looked at.



The rotten loans were made because the government said it would back those high risk loans... the removal of the RISK caused the problems, not deregulation.  Had each bank been risking their money on those loans, the housing prices wouldnt have soared because the crappy loans would not have been written
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Offline Maverick

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #95 on: September 29, 2008, 04:55:49 PM »
When the hole in the boat is bigger than the bucket, it's time to get off the boat. The captain can go down, sinking with his ship is part of his time honored responsibility. Not letting the bum drown me is something I planned for. Like Nils sez, the warning lights have been flashing for quite awhile now... and damage control is over matched.

It's time to man the lifeboat stations, she's going down.

Sorry but the vote didn't allow for lifeboat deployment, it wouldn't matter anyhow as they are in no better condition. It's getting close to tread water time and frankly I think the captain can stay up longer than most of us, yourself included.
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Offline Mr No Name

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #96 on: September 29, 2008, 04:56:28 PM »
From my Congressman on the house floor today:

"I understand the need to act and I understand the urge to act quickly. We must restore the flow of credit. I firmly subscribe to the belief that “Main Street” and Wall Street are inextricably linked.  Instability in the financial markets leads to instability in taxpayers’ personal accounts and their personal funds.  Meanwhile, that capital that flows through our financial markets is vital to the continued success of our businesses, large and small.  We should all agree that a failure of our credit markets would be an enormous catastrophe, and the government does have a role in ensuring that the financial markets function soundly.

"At the same time, we cannot allow the American taxpayers to become the insurance policy for financial decisions that did not turn out as planned.  Whether you’re talking about someone from South Carolina who took a mortgage they couldn’t afford or a Wall Street banker who financed that loan, we see just how important personal responsibility must be to American society, and I fear that this legislation erodes that accountability – and the freedom that comes with it.  

"Unfortunately, our government is in debt.  And we are in a lot of debt, both as a government and as a nation.  In fact, this whole crisis is built around debt, where too much bad debt has caused an inability to get new credit – otherwise known as debt.  My daddy always told me that you can’t borrow your way out of debt, and he was right.

"There are other reasonable options that we should explore to help the markets heal themselves and that would not burden our country under even greater mounds of debt.  I was pushing for a plan that would use more free market principles such as a suspension of the capital gains tax and incentives for repatriation of earnings, o help spur economic growth by helping all Americans whose retirement accounts are invested in the stock market, or who own a house, or a business and jump start the flow of funds back into the system.

"There is no doubt that we find ourselves in a precarious situation and people are angry, rightly so.  I am angry.  But we must not allow this anger to cloud our judgment, and make choices that will divide our country. This is not a matter of Wall Street versus Main Street.""

"But when it becomes time to vote on this bill, I will be voting no. I understand my colleagues for their reasoning, and I am confident that we all want to do what's best for the country. But, because I believe so strongly in the principles of the free market and the belief in freedom, I will be opposing this bill.  My fear is that today the government will be forever changing the face of the American free market."

He voted NO, thankfully.

Vote R.E. Lee '24

Offline Carrel

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #97 on: September 29, 2008, 05:01:36 PM »
The bail out bill is enough to give everyone over 18 in America 5 Million dollars. Thats a bit TOO much.


Uh...no. It'd be roughly 9 grand per adult over 18.

Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #98 on: September 29, 2008, 05:07:04 PM »
Well, the thing is, if we allow panic to force us into this insane, poorly thought out "bail out", we may only prolong and exacerbate the problem.

I have yet to speak with or listen to anyone who has convinced me that we MUST hand over $700 BILLION without a clear and well defined plan on how it will be spent, how we will be repaid, and how the problem will be solved, and prevented from happening again. Until such a plan exists, as much as I hate to see the economy suffer, I cannot and will not support ANY "bail out".
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Offline Sixpence

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #99 on: September 29, 2008, 05:14:37 PM »
So the next 2-3 times before the election will be for what? The problem the problem is taxation which is forcing more and more individuals to seek credit on an uncertain future. We founded this country on representation before taxation and freedom from fear of 'debtors prison' so now we are taxed without adequate representation the banks and government enter into contractual agreements for 'the benefit of the poor' on our behalf and the only people that have to fear consequences (the prison of financial collapse) are the tax payers.

What, you think the people who voted 'no' won't use it as ammunition for re-election?
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)

Offline moot

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #100 on: September 29, 2008, 05:17:30 PM »
crockett.. why is it a partisan issue? Why do you always go for the party line jugular? Toss yer democrat suit out, and use yer own brain... if you have one. This is not a partisan issue. The guy leading the fight against this in the house is an honest 11 term democrat.

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Offline Delirium

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #101 on: September 29, 2008, 05:28:16 PM »
I don't have a problem with the government making interest free loans to bail out some of these companies, even if they are a higher risk than most private lenders would find 'viable'. I do have a problem with the government dumping that much money, without oversight, into a market already rife with corruption possibly making inflation much worse.

What some of you left wing nuts have to realize is that you cannot fix a problem by throwing money at it.

What some of you right wing nuts have to realize is to do nothing would cause the economy to drop like a stone, hurting those that have retired the most. You want to show a little appreciation for the 'Greatest Generation'? Now is the time...
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Offline FrodeMk3

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #102 on: September 29, 2008, 05:28:52 PM »
Well, the thing is, if we allow panic to force us into this insane, poorly thought out "bail out", we may only prolong and exacerbate the problem.

I have yet to speak with or listen to anyone who has convinced me that we MUST hand over $700 BILLION without a clear and well defined plan on how it will be spent, how we will be repaid, and how the problem will be solved, and prevented from happening again. Until such a plan exists, as much as I hate to see the economy suffer, I cannot and will not support ANY "bail out".

What you've really gotta worry about, Virg, is that they will throw some riders of some kind on to the existing Bailout bill, push it back in front of congress, and get it to pass. Whatever the riders (Anything from Pork-Barrel spending, you name it) you still get stuck with the same bad idea, at the core. Watch the next proposal really carefully.

Offline Chalenge

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #103 on: September 29, 2008, 05:30:06 PM »
The bail out bill is enough to give everyone over 18 in America 5 Million dollars. Thats a bit TOO much.

That math is from what planet?
EDIT:

Uh...no. It'd be roughly 9 grand per adult over 18.

Oh there it is...
« Last Edit: September 29, 2008, 05:35:08 PM by Chalenge »
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Offline Sixpence

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Re: HOUSE REPUBLICANS PUT UP HISTORIC FIGHT!
« Reply #104 on: September 29, 2008, 05:30:29 PM »
What some of you left wing nuts have to realize is that you cannot fix a problem by throwing money at it.

Umm, where were you the last eight years?
"My grandaddy always told me, "There are three things that'll put a good man down: Losin' a good woman, eatin' bad possum, or eatin' good possum."" - Holden McGroin

(and I still say he wasn't trying to spell possum!)