Author Topic: Scoring System  (Read 5712 times)

Offline Motherland

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #30 on: October 16, 2008, 09:03:05 PM »
Yup, anyone who thinks flying extremely timidly is good for fighter rank has no clue wtf they are talking about.
I disagree. I'll compare a squady and I for an example.

I fly for the fun of it, and generally don't like to BnZ/pick (though I can and do do it depending on the situation and my mood). I've never cared for rank and it shows. These are my stats as of time of posting;

My overall fighter rank is 270.
Nothing spectacular as you can see; I don't expect it to be, I do a lot of stupid stuff that I don't expect to get out of, just to have fun.


Now, Gavagai (aka Anaxogoras) is a squaddy of mine who flies... 'smartly'. :D Not like an idiot like I do.

Gavagai's overall fighter rank is 18.
As you can see, he not only has a much higher K/D than me, but he also has a slightly higher KpH than I do. (He has also logged more sorties than I) This correlates with my experience, as I seem to do a lot more killing myself while I'm picking through a furball than when I'm surrounded by 5 Spitfires 200 feet away from the dirt.

Now, if you'd look only at that you can make the assumption that Gavagai is a much better stick than I. However I know from experience, having dueled him a few times (albeit a few months ago), that though he is undoubtedly a better stick than I, not to the point that the gap in our scores would suggest; even as he beat me the majority of the times, the duels were drawn out and fairly close (and very fun, we have to duel again soon :) ). Much closer, at least, than the large gap in our scores would suggest.

Picking/BnZ is far from detrimental to your score.

Offline grizz441

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #31 on: October 16, 2008, 09:09:09 PM »
His kills/hour is higher than yours because once he gets to a fight, he stays alive and kills more guys than you.  You are spending more time dying and flying back to fights and not racking up enough kills in between.

There is a lot of random philosophical scoring discussion so far in this thread and not so much actually giving thumbs up or thumbs down on my 'fix' to the scoring system.  I'd like some direct feedback from some of you veterans out there.  We can get this thing fixed if we put our heads to it! 

P.S. Steve <S>, thank you for taking the time to understand how my idea will better the game and jumpin on board.

Offline Motherland

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #32 on: October 16, 2008, 09:18:01 PM »
His kills/hour is higher than yours because once he gets to a fight, he stays alive and kills more guys than you.  You are spending more time dying and flying back to fights and not racking up enough kills in between.
This was actually exactly my point.
Quote
There is a lot of random philosophical scoring discussion so far in this thread and not so much actually giving thumbs up or thumbs down on my 'fix' to the scoring system.  I'd like some direct feedback from some of you veterans out there.  We can get this thing fixed if we put our heads to it! 
You're right, I'm missing the point. As far as scoring goes I do actually think your idea is good, even if not so much in fighter mode as in bomber in GV mode, where it seems most of the 'fly one or two sorties to get #1 and then don't fly again' type score whoring happens. In fact, your idea would probably help a lot in those particular categories.

Offline BnZ

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #33 on: October 16, 2008, 09:50:00 PM »
Motherland, the Hit% tells the tale. The thing that jumps out at me is 7.5% vs. 14.1%. People who kill every time they pull the trigger always have the advantage, really no matter what their flying style is.

BTW, stat of my own.

K/D in the two planes I have flown the most this tour.

P-47N 21/4

HurriIIC 29/7

One I boom and zoom mostly with, the other I almost without exception up for base defense. One is among the fastest planes in the game and poorest turning, the other is one of the slowest planes in the game. You aren't bnzing anybody in that thing. K/D in the Hurri isn't that much lower despite vulchers and 5'' guns to contend with. K/T and hit% is undoubtedly higher with the Hurri. 8 x .50s and 4x20mms can help anyone to kill every time they squeeze the trigger-like I said, that may be what counts more than anything else.

IMO, for a good score, you need a good-turning multi cannon bird and a target rich environment. A little performance doesn't hurt either. Hence, the relative success of the N1K statistically.


Offline LYNX

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #34 on: October 16, 2008, 09:55:43 PM »
It's ok by me but honestly feel it would reward me even further.  I log alot of hours per month being off ill.  Those that are better than me in a fighter but only fly say 15 or 30 hrs per month will be penalised.

Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #35 on: October 16, 2008, 10:30:44 PM »
I disagree. I'll compare a squady and I for an example.


Honestly, K/D is the least of your worries. You're nowhere even vaguely close to him in any sub-stat except K/T. Gav, could easily dump his excess K/D above 5:1 and improve his rank dramatically with few more K/H's if he cared to. Look at how dramatically poor his sub-stat rank in K/T is compared to the others, that's what I mean when I say K/T is far more important than K/D for fighter rank, you get a lot more "bang for your buck" with K/T. K/D is the most meaningless and least competitive sub-stat of fighter rank, he is way overkill on K/D at just 11:1. That is why flying timidly and being a K/D buzzard is very bad for fighter rank...

Comparing those two sheets is like comparing Rosanne Barr and a European super-model. How you feel you stack up in a 1 vs 1 duel with Gav has almost nothing whatsoever to do with what makes a successful MA fighter pilot...
« Last Edit: October 16, 2008, 11:02:13 PM by Zazen13 »
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Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #36 on: October 16, 2008, 10:39:48 PM »
No you don't.  The ones that are a mark of a true timid warrior are those with high K/D with a low K/S and low Kills per Hour along with a high hit %.  Those are your pickers and vulchers.


ack-ack

The only BnZers with a good hit% either hunt buffs a lot or come down to vulch. The shots you get with a fast, poor turner vs. other more maneuverable fighters are not exactly conducive to a high hit %.
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Offline Steve

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #37 on: October 16, 2008, 10:46:33 PM »
The only BnZers with a good hit% either hunt buffs a lot or come down to vulch. The shots you get with a fast, poor turner vs. other more maneuverable fighters are not exactly conducive to a high hit %.

Some people say I'm a BnZ'er. I almost never vulch.  Frankly, I suck at it, lol...... seriously.
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Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #38 on: October 16, 2008, 10:48:15 PM »
Some people say I'm a BnZ'er. I almost never vulch.  Frankly, I suck at it, lol...... seriously.

You kill buffs a fair amount and you're an excellent shot, top 5% gunnery...
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Offline Steve

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #39 on: October 16, 2008, 10:50:26 PM »
You kill buffs a fair amount and you're an excellent shot...

You are right about buffs... I hadn't considered how they effect my hit%... I am like a moth to a flame when it comes to buffs.. I can see that it would raise hit % to kill buffs.. I wonder how many points it would be worth in an average tour... if one killed  an "average" amount of buffs.
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #40 on: October 16, 2008, 10:52:56 PM »
Yup.  Our scores may be far apart, but Bubi is no doubt my equal in a duel.  I wouldn't be surprised if he beat me in a best out of 5 match. :salute
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Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #41 on: October 16, 2008, 10:55:37 PM »
You are right about buffs... I hadn't considered how they effect my hit%... I am like a moth to a flame when it comes to buffs.. I can see that it would raise hit % to kill buffs.. I wonder how many points it would be worth in an average tour... if one killed  an "average" amount of buffs.

I did an experiment for a couple of tours back when I played a lot more. I avoided buffs like the plague in attack mode and hunted them mercilessly in fighter mode. I had a 10% hit % vs. just fighters and an 18% hit % in fighter mode, buffs made up about 10% of my total kills in fighter mode. That's almost doubling my hit% with just 1 buff kill every two hops or so on average...
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Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #42 on: October 16, 2008, 10:59:48 PM »
Yup.  Our scores may be far apart, but Bubi is no doubt my equal in a duel.  I wouldn't be surprised if he beat me in a best out of 5 match. :salute

I have no doubt he can wield a stick, I know Bubi, I've also watched you. You are a very well rounded MA flyer. You're judgement of when to press the attack and when to consolidate your position and E is impeccable. That makes all the difference in the MA, where timing and balancing aggression and wisdom is the trick to effectiveness...
« Last Edit: October 16, 2008, 11:04:04 PM by Zazen13 »
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #43 on: October 16, 2008, 11:03:02 PM »
Btw, call me a picker or a BnZ lame-tard or whatever you like.  I'd be surprised if anyone else in the top 25 has as high a % of their fighter kills in 20+ ENY aircraft:

Bf 109F-4     6   
Bf 109G-14   11   
Bf 109G-2     24   
Bf 109G-6     29   
Bf 109K-4     50   
C.205          12
Fw 190A-5   31   
Fw 190A-8   1   
Fw 190D-9   11   
Me 262         9   
Ta 152H       6
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Offline Zazen13

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Re: Scoring System
« Reply #44 on: October 16, 2008, 11:06:08 PM »
Btw, call me a picker or a BnZ lame-tard or whatever you like.  I'd be surprised if anyone else in the top 25 has as high a % of their fighter kills in 20+ ENY aircraft:

Bf 109F-4     6   
Bf 109G-14   11   
Bf 109G-2     24   
Bf 109G-6     29   
Bf 109K-4     50   
C.205          12
Fw 190A-5   31   
Fw 190A-8   1   
Fw 190D-9   11   
Me 262         9   
Ta 152H       6

KillnU, wetrat and moot (just off the top of my head) can routinely get almost 20% hit % with the 30mm tater tossers...
Zazen PhD of Cherrypickology
Author of, "The Zen Art of Cherrypicking" and other related works.
Quote, "Cherrypicking is a state of mind & being, not only Art and Scienc