Buffs

[air_spro]

Just over one week 9 bombers with 3 assists . Plus tonight we "tried" to gun down a B17 flying back from attack of hangers at A13(in B26) me and bullzi . B17 took out my right engine and some ail but we did rtb ok . We would have had him too , but I just knew if I pulled just a little more g's would have taken off my wing 8-) . Hate that , lol .

After FA2 this is a dream   , love having gunner along too . When my team mate sid was we was on RW and we got three with him gunning for me . I just set him up looking out out back in F3 view . As you say NEVER come up slow and stupid from behind . IMO you got this right .

Got to say , scoreing in this game is better too , you get rewared for helping take Enemy bases , etc . Not in FA ,

 WTG Ace's High Team  

cheers spro


[This message has been edited by air_spro (edited 04-23-2000).]

[Fariz]

 

Originally posted by Swoop:
Fariz,

the earth is flat....a disc.....and it stands on the back of 4 elephants (not 3) who stand on the shell of Great A'Tuin the star turtle

And people play games on a stonehenge computers   I love this book too  

Fariz
XII Legion

[Fariz]

 

Originally posted by RangerBob:
Fariz if you sort of stand back and look at the situation objectively you will find that the buffs are really much better now for both fighters and bomber pilots.

In the past you could only fly way up high, usually with no gunner action. It was awfully fustrating to be so easily shot down flying a buff. You felt defenseless.

Fighter pilots dropped in like crows for the easy kill.

Now the buff has a chance, and he can score endless kills against uneducated buff hunters that lazily fly up the rear 6 of his buff. On the other hand he's in trouble when he meets up with an experienced buff killer that uses correct tactics against his buff.

This makes it better for both pilots. The fighter has to employ correct tactics and work for his kill with a feeling of reward. The buffer can at least defend himself against the dweeb type.

It's really better than it was before. Also try to remember that this is a sim and as a result most bombers have to fly alone without the protection of a large box. It's a lot of fun when you can get a group, but that's not very often.

Try to look at it from a slightly different point of view and I think you'll come to the same conclusion.

Ranger Bob

Sigh. I do not know how to say it to be understood. Is my English is THAT bad?

AH is trying to be sym. Buffs toughness/gun power overmodeled right now. You can love it because it makes it more fun for you to fly them. Also adding 10 lazer guns to it and warp engine will make it even more fun. But then it will be overmodeled even more.

Do you know why buffs in a RL flyed in big formations? Why they flyed at the maximum of their altitude? Hint hint.

"Fighter pilots dropped in like crows for the easy kill."

You bring grist for my mill. That is my point. It shall be. Lone buff shall be an easy pray. Fighters shall not run away from buffs as if they see starship from Star Wars. Thay shall be happy to see lone buff. Lone buff is an easy pray.

My last post on the subj., Enough said. I wanted to pay HTC attention on the problem, hope I did. If they will change aircrafts just to make players happy and game more fun it would not be sym anymore.

Fariz
XII Legion

[hitech]

Fariz: AH is a Game first and a sim 2nd. The only purpose of having the sim is to make a game.

What everyone is debating is out side of a "REAL LIFE SIM" posiblities. Realism is a very fickle thing. Everyone want's to pick and choose only the pieces of realism they wish to see.

If you step back and look at AH it only tries to capture pieces of what things were like in WWII. Lots of compromises need to and are made for game play. Simple things like auto pilot's,Air field spacing. Releate purly to game play. But it is my belife that most people don't wish to fly with their hand on the stick for 50 hours just to have 1 air engagement.

AH Is now 3 different games in 1. Fighter,bomber,vehicles. Using real life as a method for balancing between these 3 games just isn't a releality. How many times in real life do you think bomber raids were conducted with only 4 planes or less ,let alone 1. It's easy to say that people should fly like real life and form big bomber groups but that just dosn't happen very often. Therefore we are faced with 2 choices.

1. Make the bomber v fighter real life realistic, what this would produce in the end is a lot less bombers flying around.

2. Adjust things on the bomber's so they have a fighting chance. This does make flying a buff fun, and hence puts more of them in the air.

HTC's life would be very simple if all we had to do was make a REAL simulator with out any thoughts of game play.

In the end we have to ask ourselves is it FUN, is it FUN, is it FUN. Everything we choose to implement has to first and formost meet that criteria. This includes implementing components of realism, because it's adds to imersion and hence fun. But if we just add realism with out any thought to fun HTC would not be around long.


HiTech

[popeye]

It is FUN.  

Seriously, I think gameplay for buffs has been well tuned in 1.02.

popeye

[Swoop]

 

Originally posted by Fariz:
And people play games on a stonehenge computers     I love this book too    

Fariz
XII Legion

Um......at last count there's 24 in the series......

:-)  "The Fifth Elephant" was the last.  Um....so there's 5 elephants, not 4......but in the book it says the 5 elephant was legendary.....sooo....then there's still 4?  Um.  Confused.  Brain overload.  Fzzzzt.


But buffs are cool now.  ;-)

Flt Lt Swoop
No401 RAF
11 Group
(someone explain taxes to me, I still dont get it)

[This message has been edited by Swoop (edited 04-24-2000).]

[Cobra]

Buffs (v1.02)....love being in 'em, and love shootin' em down.

Cobra
Musketeer Escadrille

[This message has been edited by Cobra (edited 04-24-2000).]

[ygsmilo]

If you fly smart buffs are easy kills, if you fly poorly you will be a eazy kill.

Enough said.

------------------
Milo

"A MiG on your 6 is better than no MiG at all"

II/JG2 "Richthofen"

[Pyro]

The bombers were too weak.  A typical attack on a bomber resulted in its explosion.  There just weren't that many cripples.  You should have to aim your attacks more precisely against bombers to effectively take them out IMO.



------------------
Doug "Pyro" Balmos
HiTech Creations

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[Beefcake]

hehehe take it from the Full Time Bomber Pilot, BUFFS ARE BETTER! I can now surive 2 or even 3 encounters with fighters. Thanks HTC for making my life better. *gives thumbs up*

The Cow in the Sky

[This message has been edited by Beefcake (edited 04-24-2000).]

[Kieren]

Got two this afternoon in  SpitV, but ONLY because someone else distracted them. Had I gone straight in I think I would have bought it.

[Wraith]

Methinks that Fariz needs to spend more time researching the weaknessess of the BUFFS.

Ah heck, don't want him to get a headache   : SHOOT THE WINGS! The fuel tanks are there! You can rip one wing out with less than 10 rounds (flying the P-38!).

Personally, I see more fighters than BUFFS, and I've never seen buffs flying in formation, which is really sad IMHO.

HT, when I play AW3, the number 1 reason why pilots coordinate and fly in formation and do all the fun stuff is because they have a briefing room that allows them to do just that: Coordinate, set waypoints, plan a strike. If AH had something like this, we would see lotsa bombers in formation attacking from different angles.  

[StSanta]

A lone 26 is not easy prey, but can be attacked with some measure of safety, if correct tactics are used.

Same goes for 17, but much harder to knock down (especially in 109G10 with 1 20mm 150 rds and 2 13mm) and more lethal.

I think the balance at the moment is just perfect.

------------------
StSanta
II/JG2

[Sunchaser]

Pyro, you said, "The bombers were too weak."
and the rest of your post.

I think you are mistaken, hundreds of B17s and other types of bombers returned with massive damage.

Not picking a fight here, HTCs B17 is very good, I really almost love it but please continue the engine cowling fix, it is still not right.

This may belong in the AC and Veh area but I have a question.

Why will a fully fueled and loaded(100% fuel and 6@1,000 lb bombs) B17 NOT lift off any runway in Aces High?

75% fuel and 6@1k bombs no problem.
Just wondering if it is me or the game messing up.

Appreciate any info on this problem from anyone here with an answer.
Thanks.

------------------
When did they put this thing in here and WTF is it for?

[Kieren]

Sunchaser-

You totally misunderstood Pyro, I believe. He meant that the AH B17 was too weak for gameplay, so it was adjusted.

Historically maybe the B17 was tough, but you need to remember that, in the early part of the 8th's tenure in Europe, the survival rate of the crews wasn't very high. Unescorted daylight raids into the teeth of German defenses tended to thin them out quickly. You of course remember the Memphis Belle. What was the big deal about it? It was the first B17 to finish 25 sorties. How long had the 8th been in Europe by then?

It has been stated over-and-over that box formations and escort will help the buffs survive, and that is true. Game reality is that we will see lone B17's bombing. Real life says this would be tantamount to suicide, yet in order to encourage bomber pilots the Buffs are toughened. You can now be reasonably sure that, unless you are jumped by someone who knows what he/she is doing or you are jumped by multiple targets, you will get through to target.

What some guys seem to want is a B17 that can fly through furballs with impunity... sorry, it just wasn't that tough of an airplane. Anyone have production stats vs. combat losses? I think that might be a very telling statistic.  

[This message has been edited by Kieren (edited 05-07-2000).]