Pilot Fatigue Please.

[jihad]

 The title says it all.

 HT please add code that penalizes the "yank stick into beer gut circle jerk" flyers".

I really liked the 1.03 FM because it hindered this kind of flying.

The FM now is closer to real life performance but allows the TnB planes to do endless circles without the physical penalty that occurs in real combat.
 
IMO this would enhance gameplay a great deal.  

[Karnak]

Ya, we can't have those P-51, Bf109G-10 and Fw190D-9 pilots only getting a k/d ratio of 1.5/1.  Its gotta be more like 10/1 or it isn't fair.

------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother

Bring the Spitfire F.MkXIVc to Aces High!!!

Sisu
-Karnak

[funked]

The game is already pretty strongly biased toward b&z, and we already have artificially low blackout thresholds.  What more do ya want?  

[Toad]

Pilot fatigue?

How are you going to set the limits?

Ever watch a long (15 min) aerobatic performance? Did they have to lift the pilot out of the cockpit when it was over?

Most turnfights don't last 3-4 minutes.

Just another can of worms.

[Jigster]

Hehe thats funny, comparing your average aerobatic airshow pilot to your average WWII combat pilot  

Pilot fatigue works on both though...probably more so the BnZ' people due to higher stick forces at high speed  
Of course thats assuming more is taken into account then G forces

[skernsk]

Errr....negative on the fatigue.

DAM!!  Was this a troll..............

[Toad]

Point is Jig that an airshow pilot probably pulls as just many G's doing just about every type of maneuver for a longer period than your average dogfight. Stick forces aren't like consecutively bench pressing 400 pounds either.

Yet they don't seem to "fade away" at the end of the exhibition.

Further, when you go out to do ACM in jets, you fight until you run out of gas. This is normally several engagements. I doubt you'll find many guys that say they just were "too tired on that last fite". Adrenal glands help out some as well.  

Being tired after the flight and after the fight would be pretty normal.

Being too tired to finish the last 30 seconds of a 3-4 minute engagement? Nah, I don't think so.

[jihad]

Hmmmm... I should have phrased it differently I guess.

What I meant was a progressive blackout/redout model similar to EAW.

If you pull heavy G forces for extended periods of time the recovery time increases.

It would also help minimize some of the negative G manuevers that real pilots avoid.  <guilty of this myself>  

[Maverick]

Gee, another whine about other planes, players and their abilities.

Lets see, we have the ever present Chog and niki whine.

The I can't de-ack a field and capture it all by myself whine.

The I can't kill a certain ack with guns whine.

The I can't kill a panzer / osty in one pass with machine guns whine.

The fleet ack hurts my widdle plane whine.

The human ack gunners hurt my widdle plane whine.

The buffs guns are too uber whine. (guilty as charged)

The buffs can out turn a fighter at 30k whine. (guilty as charged)

The buffs can hit a gants butt from 30K whine. (guilty as charged)

The ever present Allies vs LW conspiracy whine.

Have I left any out???

Lets face it a large percentage of posters on the BBS are whino's. Who's going to open / buy the next round???    

Mav

[This message has been edited by Maverick (edited 04-18-2001).]

[Jekyll]

Funked said:

 

The game is already pretty strongly biased toward b&z, and we already have artificially low blackout thresholds. What more do ya want?

Well, well funked    Seeing as how you are intimately involved with another sim which is approaching open beta, and which boasts pilot fatigue as an innovative feature, I wonder if you have pointed out the futility of such a feature to your compadres at Sickware?

Let's just close with this comment from a current USAF pilot

 

The G force and fatigue modelling in this game add a great amount of immersion to the game, and it's one more very realistic factor in the gameplay. I'm really happy sick has put this level of human factors modelling into the game.

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Jekyll
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
Aces High Training Corps

[This message has been edited by Jekyll (edited 04-18-2001).]

[Vermillion]

I'm with Jihad.

If you guys don't think that pilot fatigue isn't a factor in air to air combat, your fooling yourself.

If you've never pulled 4-5 G's you have no clue what your talking about, let alone the 9 G turns alot of the pilots in this game pull regularly. And no I'm not talking about rollercoasters where they claim you pull XXX G's on the ride. I'm talking sustained, not instantaneous.

This is something I've advocated for a long time on this BBS. In fact, long before Sickware announced they were gonna do it. Hmmmm... maybe I should ask for royalties or something  

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure

[Ripsnort]

I would vote to see how it pans out in Sick's sim first...I'm skeptical...lets say I just used up my "pilot fatigue" on killing a pair of wingmen that were destined to kill me, after a 5 min. battle, they are down, I'm feeling good, and low and behold a high alt A/C with no pilot fatigue jumps me...I'm already at a disadvantage.


I can see pilots abusing this by hovering over fights, waiting about 5 min till every enemy con has push his 'fatigue' to the limit, then simply jump in and clean up.

[Fastbikkel]

Just making some notes here.

I fly soaring planes myself and indeed making G turns wears you down. But i am also quite sure that during combat ( not me in my plastic soaring plane   adrenaline keeps you going. I mean you will have to keep going or risk ending up in "walhalla".

The EAW system of black en red- outs seems real to me. But the system in AH today is also fine. I dont have real problems with this, though i think the EAW thing is a bit better.


Wir treffen uns wieder am himmel,


FB.(JG5)

[funked]

Jekyll I guess part of my argument was implied, and that part is:  WWII fighters can't sustain enough g to make pilot fatigue a huge factor, even if it's perfectly modelled.  

The most we can get is about 3g sustained, and any decent fighter pilot can handle that no sweat.

If AH had a high-fidelity model it would actually expand the envelope for most of the planes, because the current blackout limits are very conservative.

And since Jihad's expressed desire was to decrease the abilities of pilots who fly aircraft which turn better than the sloth-like flying turds of his squadron, I thought he should know that it wouldn't help him much.  

But sure, in the long run, it's something HTC should look into.

[Toady]

i get enough fatigue from staring at the screen for hours on end thank you very much.

this really is nit picking of the 1st order.