Author Topic: Thoughts on the P-47N  (Read 4262 times)

Offline bj229r

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6728
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #75 on: January 14, 2009, 09:05:18 PM »
This is incorrect for the LA-7. Check out Dokgonzo's chart. In fact, it's just about at 10k that the P-47N with WEP becomes faster than an LA-7, maybe that is what you meant.

The P-47N with WEP is faster than the LA-5 with WEP at all altitudes, which I found surprising.
Hmmm...lemme check on that


Dang I was wrrrrrrr...WWWRrrrrrr...not correct. "N" passes Lgay in speed around 10k...Lgay starts picking up around 15
« Last Edit: January 14, 2009, 09:09:55 PM by bj229r »
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers

http://www.flamewarriors.net/forum/

Offline Wingnutt

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1665
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #76 on: January 14, 2009, 10:51:36 PM »
Hmmm...lemme check on that


Dang I was wrrrrrrr...WWWRrrrrrr...not correct. "N" passes Lgay in speed around 10k...Lgay starts picking up around 15


problem the LA hits its top speed pretty quick, the N takes around 4 years.

Offline PiloteTardif

  • Zinc Member
  • *
  • Posts: 3
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #77 on: January 15, 2009, 11:44:38 AM »
Jugs have the qualities of excellent diving speed, roll rate, firepower, and unexpected levels of turning ability.

However, when flying a D, I always have to ask myself, WTF, why am I  not in a C-Hog? Same qualities plus insane turning ability?

No, there is only one Jug that can exceed 360mph on the deck. You can turn with a Pony, 190, Typh, La7 in a D-11 or an N. Which is more likely to catch the %@$%$$ though? A SpitXVI has it all over either Jug in maneuverability... but which is more likely to outrun the sucker?

That is weird because yesterday i've had a dogfight starting at Co-E,Alt: 12K, me in a 47-D40 VS Spit 16. We merged, and he hit my oil tank. I managed to keep me off his aim with two low speed HammerHeads and dive away to make a snap turn. Then the turning fight began. All the way to the ground we could both not have a decent gun solution (couple of snapshots maybe). I guess i suprised him w/ those notch of flaps. Once on the ground, a little barrel, he overshoots and I manage to get a good shot at him at 400-600 range. He started smoking and doing panicked scissors on the deck. He burned so much E that I was just about to finish him off when a pony snapped my tail in half. (I guess i have the tunnel vision syndrome).

Yes the turn radius of the spit is much better than a Jug but keeping in mind the Jug's hidden flap maneuvrability, I guess it can maintain a good turn rate against pretty much anything in decent hands and a good altitude.

PS: I'm pretty new on these forums so i expect a lot of negation. []^_o[]

Offline Stoney

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3482
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #78 on: January 15, 2009, 12:15:14 PM »
We merged, and he hit my oil tank.

 :rofl  Figures...You have to love the MA...
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline BaldEagl

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10791
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #79 on: January 15, 2009, 12:37:13 PM »
A few nights ago I took off in a 109K-4 to go after what I thought would be a set of buffs.  I was right.  They were Lancasters at 20K but there was a P-47 perched about 4-5K above them escorting.

On his first pass on me I did a 360 flat turn and then tried to catch the Lancs again.  On his second pass I maintained my flight path but barrel rolled to avoid his shot.  Each time he went back up and at that alt I pretty much knew I couldn't match him. 

After his second climb another friendly entered the picture much closer to the buffs than I was and the P-47 placed his attention there.  The friendly dove out slightly and the P-47 followed.  As soon as I saw this I put my K-4 into a climb so that the 47 wouldn't be able to zoom climb above me again.  He killed the other friendly.

As I approached the Lancs the P-47 was coming from my forward aspect about co-alt.  Knowing he'd have to turn 360 degrees I avoided his merge and ended up with three clean passes on the Lancs killing one per pass.

By this time the P-47 was on my six again and closing.  I nosed down to drag him from alt thinking that with a lot of E and the K-4's climbing abilities that I might be able to out climb him even in a zoom but my ultimate goal was to take him to the deck.  After a few turns and zoom climbs we ended up exactly there as he dove out thinking he'd outrun me in a dive.  While he gained minimally I stayed with him and trimmed out at the bottom.  I'm sure he thought I'd compress and lawn dart.

Once on the deck the real turn fight began.  He managed to force one overshoot but didn't have a gun solution and he used the three axis turn at the top once also just missing a guns solution.

The fight would go 2-3 turns then he would extend while I chased him back down.  He chose his extensions well, forcing me to continue turning so that he could gain seperation but once I straightened out he couldn't maintain it and we'd go another 2-3 turns.  While in normal circumstances I may have had a snapshot oppotunity or two, I was out of cannon rounds having expended them on the Lancasters earlier.  Knowing I'd have to saddle up I was getting somewhat frustrated at his ability to avoid me when all of a sudden he ran out of gas.  I took him as he tried to ditch.

I'm not sure what this has to do with this particular thread but it was a very fun encounter trying to outwit this Jug, beginning more in his element than mine, to reach the buffs he was doing a good job of protecting and then coercing him into my element for the final fight.  He did a good job of managing the situation and of flying that Jug other than his decision to follow the other friendly too low (but only a few K below my original alt) on that one occasion.

I guess the moral of the story is that a well flown Jug can be a formidable opponent even to an "uber plane" like the 109K-4.
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.

Offline Hajo

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6031
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #80 on: January 15, 2009, 03:24:29 PM »
Someone mentioned the amount of players in the MA.  Yes...the MA gets the majority of players.

When a Scenario is on.......look how many are in the SEA participating when the rest of the run and gunners
are in the MA flying the Uberstuffen.  Those usually participating in a scenario are flight simmers.  They enjoy
the History and wish to immerse themselves in a virtual time and place in a virtual aircraft fighting a historical battle.

The run and gunners don't want the discipline of flying a scenario.  They don't want the evenly matched fight at 25K.
They don't want the responsibility of protecting or defending or having a team oriented goal of larger proportion.
You see....they can't come diving down from 15K with 30 of their mates to pick an otd furball of 6 planes.
And then land their picks while slapping themselves on the back for slaughtering 3 planes with their 25.
They aren't simmers, they are WoW and Quake refugees. And you will not catch them flying anything but an uber plane.

There is a difference between a simmer and a point and clicker.  There are few of us (simmers) left.
Most of the latest generation have fallen off the Quake Wagon and are in our MAs now.

I'm seeing an increasing amount of dive, shoot, miss and run (in P51, D9 anything fast)

I'm seeing more and more bombers that bail after toolshedding. What great simmers they are!

- The Flying Circus -

Offline BaldEagl

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10791
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #81 on: January 15, 2009, 03:31:05 PM »
Someone mentioned the amount of players in the MA.  Yes...the MA gets the majority of players.

When a Scenario is on.......look how many are in the SEA participating when the rest of the run and gunners
are in the MA flying the Uberstuffen.  Those usually participating in a scenario are flight simmers.  They enjoy
the History and wish to immerse themselves in a virtual time and place in a virtual aircraft fighting a historical battle.

The run and gunners don't want the discipline of flying a scenario.  They don't want the evenly matched fight at 25K.
They don't want the responsibility of protecting or defending or having a team oriented goal of larger proportion.
You see....they can't come diving down from 15K with 30 of their mates to pick an otd furball of 6 planes.
And then land their picks while slapping themselves on the back for slaughtering 3 planes with their 25.
They aren't simmers, they are WoW and Quake refugees. And you will not catch them flying anything but an uber plane.

Or maybe... just maybe... their RL obligations and schedules don't allow them to participate in organized events.   ;)
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.

Offline Hajo

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6031
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #82 on: January 15, 2009, 03:50:25 PM »
There are a lot of organized events during the week.  At differing times.

At least one or two can be attended.  Snapshots, FSO on fridays and Scenarios.

I work 3 shifts......I manage to make a few of them.  And I work weekends and holidays.

I make them.  Of course....you have to want to attend them.

Again....can't slaughter the few then.  There is competition.  ;)
- The Flying Circus -

Offline Stoney

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3482
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #83 on: January 15, 2009, 03:52:15 PM »
Or maybe... just maybe... their RL obligations and schedules don't allow them to participate in organized events.   ;)

I don't think he was trying to call you out Bald :)
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline Wingnutt

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1665
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #84 on: January 15, 2009, 03:54:01 PM »
Someone mentioned the amount of players in the MA.  Yes...the MA gets the majority of players.

When a Scenario is on.......look how many are in the SEA participating when the rest of the run and gunners
are in the MA flying the Uberstuffen.  Those usually participating in a scenario are flight simmers.  They enjoy
the History and wish to immerse themselves in a virtual time and place in a virtual aircraft fighting a historical battle.

The run and gunners don't want the discipline of flying a scenario.  They don't want the evenly matched fight at 25K.
They don't want the responsibility of protecting or defending or having a team oriented goal of larger proportion.
You see....they can't come diving down from 15K with 30 of their mates to pick an otd furball of 6 planes.
And then land their picks while slapping themselves on the back for slaughtering 3 planes with their 25.
They aren't simmers, they are WoW and Quake refugees. And you will not catch them flying anything but an uber plane.

There is a difference between a simmer and a point and clicker.  There are few of us (simmers) left.
Most of the latest generation have fallen off the Quake Wagon and are in our MAs now.

I'm seeing an increasing amount of dive, shoot, miss and run (in P51, D9 anything fast)

I'm seeing more and more bombers that bail after toolshedding. What great simmers they are!



lumping the "MA players' into one big group and referring to them in bulk as "quake refugees" is just wow..

Offline Hajo

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6031
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #85 on: January 15, 2009, 05:04:07 PM »
Eagle I was not referring to you.

Wingnutt I am not including the whole MA.  Just the majority.  Since the majority seems to play the game that way,
that is why I referred to the MA.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 05:05:54 PM by Hajo »
- The Flying Circus -

Offline BaldEagl

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10791
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #86 on: January 15, 2009, 05:12:48 PM »
Eagle I was not referring to you.

Yeah... I know.  But it's true.  I've never participated in an AW or AH event, mostly because they don't start after 9 PM Central during the week and on the weekends I'm either busy or don't know how the day's going to line up.

I really really wanted to do BoB but saturday afternoons during the fall with fall yard clean-up every weekend for two months negated that.

Anyway, my point was not everyone is 14 with nothing to do but play.
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.

Offline Wingnutt

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1665
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #87 on: January 15, 2009, 05:29:41 PM »

the majority seems to play the game that way,



sadly, I agree.  :frown:
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 05:31:32 PM by Wingnutt »

Offline Hajo

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6031
Re: Thoughts on the P-47N
« Reply #88 on: January 15, 2009, 05:32:29 PM »
BaldEgl LOL I wish I was 14 .  Scenarios take place usually at 3PM EST on saturdays.

I get my work out of the way early  ;)
- The Flying Circus -